Would you trust the Bears smile?

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by Nibbler, Oct 21, 2006.

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  1. Just in case we all think that leopards change their spots, this link should provide some food for thought...

    Russian Officers' torture tactics

    Respect for the guy mentioned, who retained enough sanity to identify these swine despite the conditions he endured...
  2. Sorry, I will comment the article later, my wife is waiting for me for shopping...

  3. You mean you can't say anything at this time as they may be on to you? :wink:
  4. No he means that she is an officer and he DAREN'T make her wait while he replies. <gulp>
  5. Right! Read it! Awful, and I have every respect for the man involved and fervently hope he can achieve some sort of justice.

    And your point is?

  6. I think we would all agree that the emergent Russian Federation of states has a lot of catching up to do on many issues including human rights. It is improving however and it will continue to improve as the RF re-establishes itself amongst the rest of the world but almost 80 years of polarisation is hard to eradicate so it will take time.
  7. It was essentially an IQ test to distinguish between those who could identify political issues and those who would take a personality based view - you have reinforced my Nietzscheian view of certain stereotypes. However, as you need it spelt out, my point is that just like certain other banana republics where passion and self loathing is confused with morality, one should think long and hard before deciding to do any sort of business with this bunch of venal criminals.

    Actually, there's a considerable body of evidence to suggest that the body politic of the Russian Federation is regressing, not improving at all. Chechnya is a case in point...
  8. There's more evidence to show that while improving it's economy the RF is prepared to accept Western values in exchange for trading.

    Cut off the trading and you hold back change.
  9. While I have no problem with deserving types of people - terrorists, sex-offenders, Celtic supporters etc being tortured to a slow and agonising death, torturing civvies likke the PE teacher is both morally wrong and tactically unsound. It acts as a recruiting seargent for terrorists, like the scum who slaughtered the children at Beslan.
  10. The article is founded on this case.

    First of all mr.Sadykov has right to complain to European Court for Human Rights. Has he complained, I don't know. There is no even one word about it in the article. Now, let's apply a common sense. Alleged events happened 6 years ago. Sufficient time inteval to complain.

    Again, they are free to complain to ECHR.

    Btw, there are many so called teips (clans) in Chechnya. Blood revenge (Vendetta) is a common place and cutting ears was (is) used as a 'warning'. So likely the ear was cut in another place by another 'performer'.

    There is no such a division in Russian army. There is no any army regiment in the city of Hanty-Mansiysk. Probably he speaks about policemen. Special police units (OMON) from Hanty-Mansiysk area were sent to Chechnya. One policeman from city of Nizhnevartovsk is in the jail now for beatings.

    I agree, the man was likely detained, beaten. Alas, Russian policemen use to beat detainees and not only in Chechnya (one woman won her case in ERHR and received 35,000 Euro as a compensation). As for the story then it looks as a fairy tale.

    Late journalist Anna Plitkovskaya has been mentioned in the article. She wrote about Chechnya. But she had also American citizenship. But Abu-Graib was not so interesting object for her investigations.
  11. That's probably because she knew the difference between idiots behaving badly (Abu Ghraib), and state sanctioned systematic torture of opponents (anywhere the Russian Federation and its ex KGB president feels threatened). Spare me the attempts to argue this away: Russia has a long and appalling history of extra-judicial treatment of anyone who disagrees with it: as a case in point, Anna Plitkovskaya may have been partisan in her reporting - but the authorities who ran Abu Graib would not have had her assassinated.

    Would you rather be an investigative journalist in today's Russia or Ireland (Guerlain), or today's America? Evil is evil, irrespective of pathetic attempts to claim moral equivalence...
  12. No there isn't -there's evidence to show that the RF is prepared to pretend to accept Western values if it lines the pockets of various individuals... There's no evidence whatsoever to show that they 'accept' Western values: type Anna Plitkovskaya, Chechnya, Ukrainian election, NATO expansion, Khordovsky or Grosny into Google to confirm this...
  13. ...in secret CIA jails?

    It is unclear now who namely killed mrs. Politkovskaya and who namely ordered the murder. You suggest that they are Russian authorities. Why do you think so?

    Alas, killings of journalists are common nowdays.


    Btw, namely British authorities bear responsibility for security in Basra. But can we blame them for the killing (moreover accuse them in it)? No of course.


    Note, that in the case with mrs. Politkovskaya we have only allegations and suppositions. But here we see direct accusations.


    Btw, the killer was sentenced. So it was a proven murder.
  14. The Russians might be far ahead of us in "creative" interrogations but we are certainly travelling on the same road in the same direction.

  15. I give up: you're right: we're about to arrest ex PE teachers and cut their ears off, whilst making them eat their own excrement: yup - we're equivalent to that.