Worst rifle/pistol you have ever used

#1
Where to begin?

For me, the worst bolt action rifle I ever had the misfortune to fire was the good old Italian M91 carcano carbine with the folding bayonet. Just about everything on the damn thing is resoundingly awful, awkward, stiff and miserable. Failure to make consistent contact with the target frame at 200 m didn't help matters...

pistol-wise, the Ruger M85 was a clunky piece of cast junk. It worked reliably, but it sat miserably in the hand, the trigger was awful, and it was alles über der platz on a figure target at 15 m.

as for revolvers, the 7.5 mm Swiss M 1882 revolver lacks everything you would expect to be present in a Swiss firearm -- accuracy, reasonable ergonomics, and a reasonable trigger. Absolutely miserable.

Anyone else used anything particularly egregious?
 
#3
Tanfoglio TA90, basically a copy of the CZ75. I was suckered into buying it after I finished my probationary at the local pistol club. Having been taught during that period by an ex RM using his .45 S+W I was intending to buy a Glock 21 but the owner of the club managed to convince me to go back to 9mm. The Tan was a horrible thing, couldn`t get on with it, had no love for it. The thing used to stovepipe quite regularly, couldn`t hit a barn door and used to jump about in my hand something chronic. Stashed it away in the locker and hired a .45 again and never looked back....until they banned handguns about nine months later. :x
 
#4
The Enfield No2 Mk1* was total crap
 

Alsacien

MIA
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#5
Mr_Deputy said:
Alsacien said:
Top Trump, beat this :D

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FP-45_Liberator

owned by an old STAB, fired by me (I had 45 cartridges on my FAC) circa 1986 at a UK pistol range.

The Liberator was shipped in a cardboard box with 10 rounds of .45 ACP ammunition, a wooden dowel to remove the empty shell casing, and an instruction sheet in comic strip form[1] showing how to load and fire the weapon.


Sounds like a Spud Gun avec bigger bang. Could you hit anything with it? (i.e. did it have any genuine, reliable accuracy? Given that it was designed to kill or be killed. I often pity the guys who had the balls to shoot Krauts etc with these types of cheapo stamped guerilla weapons - their lives depended on them. )
Managed to discharge it in a safe direction (into the butts no target), was not keen to risk my anatomy with a second round, and neither was the owner :D

I would be amazed if it was useful beyond a few yards
 
#7
Worst rifle is probably a toss up between a Magtech bolt action 22RF that struggled to shoot one inch groups at 20 yards and a Browning/FN self loading takedown 22RF that fell apart at the slightest excuse.

Pistols? It was a good while back - I was never overly fond of the Browning Buckmark but it wasn't really particularly bad, just not to my taste. I don't recall any particularly bad pistols. I only had experience of a few and then they were banned.
 
#9
tropper66 said:
The Enfield No2 Mk1* was total crap
And the Webley .22 single shot target pistol we had ar junior Leaders
 

Alsacien

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#10
Mr_Deputy said:
Alsacien said:
Mr_Deputy said:
Alsacien said:
Top Trump, beat this :D

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FP-45_Liberator

owned by an old STAB, fired by me (I had 45 cartridges on my FAC) circa 1986 at a UK pistol range.

The Liberator was shipped in a cardboard box with 10 rounds of .45 ACP ammunition, a wooden dowel to remove the empty shell casing, and an instruction sheet in comic strip form[1] showing how to load and fire the weapon.


Sounds like a Spud Gun avec bigger bang. Could you hit anything with it? (i.e. did it have any genuine, reliable accuracy? Given that it was designed to kill or be killed. I often pity the guys who had the balls to shoot Krauts etc with these types of cheapo stamped guerilla weapons - their lives depended on them. )
Managed to discharge it in a safe direction (into the butts no target), was not keen to risk my anatomy with a second round, and neither was the owner :D

I would be amazed if it was useful beyond a few yards
It is easy to hide so push into target's face or stomach and fire I suppose. Its main plus point.
Just comparing it a Webley or something with presence - you're not going to scare many people waving that thing around! Kill/injure very close up. Does the job it is designed to do I suppose, it quite literally just detonates a .45 cal round and gives it a vague direction of flight and that's it.
Better hope he went down first time - reloading speed is not a design feature....
 
#11
I nominate the No 8 as used by the Cadets as the worst rifle, accuracy is abysmal. The worst pistol I have ever fired was a well worn CZ75, a Fig 11 at 25 mts had a good chance of survival, even a Service issue Browning could get all the shots on at that range.
 
#12
Drlligaf said:
I nominate the No 8 as used by the Cadets as the worst rifle, accuracy is abysmal. The worst pistol I have ever fired was a well worn CZ75, a Fig 11 at 25 mts had a good chance of survival, even a Service issue Browning could get all the shots on at that range.
we had half a dozen no.8's at school which were very nearly as good as the Anschützes, but were not as easy to shoot due to the shorter sight radius and heavier trigger.
 
#13
stoatman said:
Drlligaf said:
I nominate the No 8 as used by the Cadets as the worst rifle, accuracy is abysmal. The worst pistol I have ever fired was a well worn CZ75, a Fig 11 at 25 mts had a good chance of survival, even a Service issue Browning could get all the shots on at that range.
we had half a dozen no.8's at school which were very nearly as good as the Anschützes, but were not as easy to shoot due to the shorter sight radius and heavier trigger.
My first rifle was a .22 BSA Century about 100 years old when my dad bought it for me, then I saved up and got an Anschutz 64 , at Junior Leaders we had to use No8s until they got us some new BSA Martini Internationals. But I always got on OK with the Mk8
 
#14
Definately with Stoats on the Carcano.. even the rifle version is dire! I have to admit that the only thing that makes me wonder about the Kennedy assassination is "Why did he use a Carcano???"

Most carbines using full power rounds are deeply unpleasant. The Mosin Nagant carbine is really nasty and even the K 98 is not as nice as the Geweher.. Must be something to do with the "No Sense - No Pain" with Cav soldiers..?

WW2 Jap stuff is pretty horrid as well.. The Nambu alway took the skin off the back of my hand...

Although I like the look of P08 Lugers, I was never that happy shooting them, weight all wrong and horrible triggers.

As to modern stuff, I think a lot of the designs lack soul.. Not that taken with AR designs, they look nice , but the basic concept is flawed. Any gun that goes "Boinng.." when you fire it is a bit suspect IMHO...

I do like the Accuracy International rifles. They are honest and do what they say on the tin, and I respect this.




...but the rifle I REALLY hate is the Ruger 10/22...

The Chav of the gun scene....

Nasty cheap clunky horrid Ugh Ugh Ugh....

Make it go away pleaaaase!
 

maguire

LE
Book Reviewer
#15
'The Liberator was replaced with the Deer gun in 1964 when a modernized equivalent was designed for possible use in Vietnam [1]. This was because the CIA needed a weapon of this type, and most Liberators had been scrapped after WWII. The Deer Gun was chambered for 9x19mm Parabellum and was loaded by unscrewing the barrel and inserting a round to fire.'

going slightly off topic, but considering the antipathy felt for US forces and the number of insurgents, wouldnt making a weapon like this available in a Vietnam-type situation be incredibly counterproductive?
 
#16
HE117 said:
Definately with Stoats on the Carcano.. even the rifle version is dire! I have to admit that the only thing that makes me wonder about the Kennedy assassination is "Why did he use a Carcano???"

Because it was cheap. Very cheap.

Most carbines using full power rounds are deeply unpleasant. The Mosin Nagant carbine is really nasty and even the K 98 is not as nice as the Geweher.. Must be something to do with the "No Sense - No Pain" with Cav soldiers..?

K98 is vastly overrated

WW2 Jap stuff is pretty horrid as well.. The Nambu alway took the skin off the back of my hand...

aye

Although I like the look of P08 Lugers, I was never that happy shooting them, weight all wrong and horrible triggers.

I rather like them -- they point very naturally for me although they are back heavy

As to modern stuff, I think a lot of the designs lack soul.. Not that taken with AR designs, they look nice , but the basic concept is flawed. Any gun that goes "Boinng.." when you fire it is a bit suspect IMHO...

can't be that flawed -- they absolutely dominate the competition scene

I do like the Accuracy International rifles. They are honest and do what they say on the tin, and I respect this.


...but the rifle I REALLY hate is the Ruger 10/22...

The Chav of the gun scene....

Nasty cheap clunky horrid Ugh Ugh Ugh....

but it works, vough, innit!

Make it go away pleaaaase!
 

Alsacien

MIA
Moderator
#17
maguire said:
'The Liberator was replaced with the Deer gun in 1964 when a modernized equivalent was designed for possible use in Vietnam [1]. This was because the CIA needed a weapon of this type, and most Liberators had been scrapped after WWII. The Deer Gun was chambered for 9x19mm Parabellum and was loaded by unscrewing the barrel and inserting a round to fire.'

going slightly off topic, but considering the antipathy felt for US forces and the number of insurgents, wouldnt making a weapon like this available in a Vietnam-type situation be incredibly counterproductive?
Very strong chance of getting shot in the foot for sure :D
 
#18
The worn-out SLR I fired my first TA APWT with.

As I took the first pressure, I watched the sight picture distort as the two halves of the thing moved relative to one another.

I wouldn't particularly want to own a No4 Mk1*, but I think they were pretty good rifles - as was the No 8, IMHO. But I haven't fired either since 1966. Anything that had deteriorated to the extent that SLR had would be pretty much rubbish.
 
#19
maguire said:
'The Liberator was replaced with the Deer gun in 1964 when a modernized equivalent was designed for possible use in Vietnam [1]. This was because the CIA needed a weapon of this type, and most Liberators had been scrapped after WWII. The Deer Gun was chambered for 9x19mm Parabellum and was loaded by unscrewing the barrel and inserting a round to fire.'

going slightly off topic, but considering the antipathy felt for US forces and the number of insurgents, wouldnt making a weapon like this available in a Vietnam-type situation be incredibly counterproductive?
The reasons for developing Liberators/Deer Guns are political. The problem is that if you engineer a "Popular Uprising", how do you arm them without the weapons becoming a long term legacy problem?

The American Congress is somewhat sensative to this issue having got into the game early and suffered from the long term results of "selling guns to the Injuns..". Congress (unlike the Kremlin) was a bit wary of handing out moderm weapons to dodgy regimes such as the Vietnamese and the Free French (ok, probably the De Gaull had some input here).. but you get my drift..

The game is deniability.. You enable your freedom fighter to get a K98 or an AK by giving him a Liberator/Deer gun, but you did not supply him..
 
#20
stoatman said:
HE117 said:
As to modern stuff, I think a lot of the designs lack soul.. Not that taken with AR designs, they look nice , but the basic concept is flawed. Any gun that goes "Boinng.." when you fire it is a bit suspect IMHO...

can't be that flawed -- they absolutely dominate the competition scene
Oh come on...

A design that requires you to bang the bolt forward to ensure it goes to battery before you shoot..?

I know the AR design dominates, but can I suggest that it is because it is the only show in town rather than it being inherently a good design.

I think Stoner was good at designing rifles that could be easily mass manufactured. I don't accept that it was the best design around at the time...
 

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