Women in coding

[GDog]

Is Mx Newing a woman? Why interview them about their experience in the software industry if they say they aren't?

What can we do to get more women into coding?

How visual, auditory and kinesthetic tools used to teach kids coding should be adapted for adults.

www.bbc.co.uk

Every bit of the last section of the above article is linguistic torture, the equivalent of nails down a blackboard full of greengrocer's apostrophe's.

 

[Site Admin]

These ‘they/them’ cunce shouldn’t be able to claim single occupancy council tax if they live by themselves’.

That last apostrophe was tricky…. and still might be wrong.

 

[GDog]

That last apostrophe was tricky…. and still might be wrong.

It was deliberate.

 

[Gravelbelly]

Is Mx Newing a woman? Why interview them about their experience in the software industry if they say they aren't?

Who cares? Why are you so excited about a personal title that you choose to start a whole thread on the subject? What's so tortuous about "singular they"?

Remember that the person who writes the headline, is not the person who wrote the article - and sub-editors have a habit of summarising badly. The article is saying "we have a shortage of coders; the existing workforce are overwhelmingly male; so why aren't others joining in?" - then interviewing some of those others. That includes Mx Newing.

If they figure it out, I'm all for it. I'm a software engineer who has worked alongside some truly capable women, and some stunningly dim blokes - it's an industry where there are never enough good people.

 

[GDog]

What's so tortuous about "singular they"?

I'll simply leave you with this:

"I'm not sure what would have happened if I hadn't got that internship," they say.

 

[ACAB]

I'll simply leave you with this:

"I'm not sure what would have happened if I hadn't got that internship," they say.

Go away, you boring **** stain.

 

[Drazyl]

I'll simply leave you with this:

"I'm not sure what would have happened if I hadn't got that internship," they say.

"The singular they emerged by the 14th century,[3] about a century after the plural they. It has been commonly employed in everyday English ever since and has gained currency in official context"

 

[Ortholith]

I'll simply leave you with this:

"I'm not sure what would have happened if I hadn't got that internship," they say.

What about it?

 

[GDog]

I'm a software engineer who has worked alongside some truly capable women, and some stunningly dim blokes - it's an industry where there are never enough good people.

I work with a female software developer and I'm not afraid to admit that she's much more capable and experienced than myself.

She also forced us all to piss about renaming all the "master" branches to "main" because as a white middle-class woman she's apparently in a unique position to declare that "master" is so offensive to black people they shouldn't be required to see it in an obtuse technical context.

She also didn't bother to ask the junior (black) graduate what his view was on the matter before adding these changes into his JIRA backlog.

 

[Brotherton Lad]

I'll simply leave you with this:

"I'm not sure what would have happened if I hadn't got that internship," they say.

That may be read in a number of ways. Certainly no greengrocers’ apostrophes.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

I'm afraid that 'learning to code' in Python counts for sod all in addressing perceived inequalities, given the huge skills chasm between someone who 'learned to code' and a software engineer. The former might not even have the aptitude for it. Nothing short of several years' mentoring of junior developers, as a common industry practice, could address shortages and inequalities.

 

[GDog]

What about it?

The singular "I" coupled with the typically plural "they" is absolutely jarring.

If the English language needs to entertain the abandonment of singular gendered pronouns then it should at least invent a better replacement than "they". Preferably something that doesn't make the reader resort to the international phonetic alphabet to understand how to pronounce it properly (I'm looking at you, 'Mx').

 

[GDog]

Go away, you boring **** stain.

No.

 

[Drazyl]

The singular "I" coupled with the typically plural "they" is absolutely jarring.

It's not. One is used in the first person, the other is in the third person.

If the English language needs to entertain the abandonment of singular gendered pronouns then it should at least invent a better replacement than "they". Preferably something that doesn't make the reader resort to the international phonetic alphabet to understand how to pronounce it properly.

It's a correct and long established usage. In this case you are the one that is incorrect.

 

[GDog]

That may be read in a number of ways. Certainly no greengrocers’ apostrophes.

Who is saying it? The person quoted or somebody or group of people talking about the person?

Are "they" quoting "her"?

 

[Ortholith]

The singular "I" coupled with the typically plural "they" is absolutely jarring.

If the English language needs to entertain the abandonment of singular gendered pronouns then it should at least invent a better replacement than "they". Preferably something that doesn't make the reader resort to the international phonetic alphabet to understand how to pronounce it properly.

Nope, I'm not seeing the issue. It's a direct quote from someone talking in the first person. If you didn't know the gender of the individual involved 'they' would be fine eg. someone walked up to me and they said "What is the issue with this article?".

 

[Drazyl]

Who is saying it? The person quoted or somebody or group of people talking about the person?

Are "they" quoting "her"?

The person quoted. Using the correct singular they.

 

[GDog]

Nope, I'm not seeing the issue. It's a direct quote from someone talking in the first person. If you didn't know the gender of the individual involved 'they' would be fine eg. someone walked up to me and they said "What is the issue with this article?".

I've read and re-read this trying to blot out any notion of presumed gender that is created by the photo and context and it's still jarring.

It doesn't help that the ending phrase is "they say" rather than "they said".

 

[giatttt]

I'm afraid that 'learning to code' in Python counts for sod all in addressing perceived inequalities, given the huge skills chasm between someone who 'learned to code' and a software engineer. The former might not even have the aptitude for it. Nothing short of several years' mentoring of junior developers, as a common industry practice, could address shortages and inequalities.

I really struggled with python as I learnt on Fortran, assembler, and other languages where storage was fixed. All my shortcuts were gone, even php allows register shifting and binary comparison.

Daughter did a degree in biology/genetics so maths, stats, and excel were to the fore. She picked up python pretty quickly as she was not stopping to agonise about memory usage.

The language is just a tool, the clever bit is knowing how the tools work and how to apply them.

 

[WALT]

The singular "I" coupled with the typically plural "they" is absolutely jarring.

I'm afraid I have to agree with him (Oh shit. Am I allowed to call him "him?")
I was educated in English in the '80s and this modern stuff just reads like unintelligible bullshit.
Another thing that winds me up is "Ms." It's neither an abbreviation nor a word, FFS. At what point did it become official?
Yes, I know language evolves, but this stuff is just made up bollocks.
The boxheads were faced with this problem , so decided; ok, anyone under 18 is a Fraulein, and anyone over 18 is a Frau, regardless of marital status. Problem solved without any made up gibberish.

Does anyone have the "old man shouts at cloud" meme, handy? Ta.