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WO2 Promotion - or not?

#1
Doing the rounds with the Rumour Mill at present - apparantly all those tiffies that got knocked back last year (being a few days or so out of the promotion bracket) may find themselves being knocked back yet again this year based on a new rule on time served at both SSgt and WO2 level.

Can anyone shed any light on this? My guess is that it is something to do with VEng, and the fact that if something isn't nipped in the bud soon, we'll end up with a load of 16-year WO1s.

Any gen-up info would be helpful. I imagine a lot of people out there will be effected by these rumours, if they are true.
 
#3
Yes, at present there are apparently plans to extend time in rank - at present sits at two years for WO2-WO1 which will become three years. For SSgts it will move from three to four years - but the rumour that we're hearing here is that it is going to effect the next WO2 board (Jan 2010, results 4 Feb 2010).
This will effect a lot of people if true. And if true, I can imagine a lot of letters will be written in light of this... But my fear is that in order to bring something into action on this scale, effecting so many people - it will hardly be an impetuous decision, and chances are this will have been thrashed out no end - meaning they will have their bases firmly covered and yet again, people at the tail end of their careers will be seen off and be able to do very little about it.
 
#4
JesterRIP said:
Yes, at present there are apparently plans to extend time in rank - at present sits at two years for WO2-WO1 which will become three years. For SSgts it will move from three to four years - but the rumour that we're hearing here is that it is going to effect the next WO2 board (Jan 2010, results 4 Feb 2010).
This will effect a lot of people if true. And if true, I can imagine a lot of letters will be written in light of this... But my fear is that in order to bring something into action on this scale, effecting so many people - it will hardly be an impetuous decision, and chances are this will have been thrashed out no end - meaning they will have their bases firmly covered and yet again, people at the tail end of their careers will be seen off and be able to do very little about it.
Personally, I think that the 4 year wait to get your WO2 is a good move, get 2 x 2 year posts under your belt before the complete change in Job spec that many WO2 posts bring.
 
#5
I heard this is coming in soon to enable WOs to learn the difference between Affect and Effect.

but seriously, if there is a liklihood of a lot of 16 year WOs1, then something needs to be in place to slow them down. Lets face it, with VEng, all that will happen is that people race to WO1 and sit block posts for those behind them.

I don't doubt that some people are capable of being a good WO1 at 16 years - I just think it should be an exception rather than a rule...
 
#6
Nige said:
I heard this is coming in soon to enable WOs to learn the difference between Affect and Effect.

but seriously, if there is a likelihood of a lot of 16 year WO1s, then something needs to be in place to slow them down. Lets face it, with VEng, all that will happen is that people race to WO1 and sit block posts for those behind them.

I don't doubt that some people are capable of being a good WO1 at 16 years - I just think it should be an exception rather than a rule...
Fixed that for you!

Yes affect / effect, point taken! Well my point being, a lot of people (especially those who went tiffy late) are looking at a bleak future, given that in some cases they will not get a shot at a WO1 board. Given that if they had not done the tiffy course in the first place (and saved themselves best part of two years that could have been served more productively), some would have been WOII Artisans by now knocking on the door of a SSC...
Again though, if it's true or not, or coming into effect next board or the one after - any info would be appreciated.

Just for the record, this doesn't AFFECT me.
 
#7
For Royal Sigs, the ideal promotions zone for SSgt is not before 10 years, and for WO2, its not before 16 years, so if you are flying its a bummer, and its pissing a lot of the supervisory trades off that get fast tracked to SSgt, and if they have only been in for like 10 years, they've got a 6 year wait, where they used to get promoted every 2-3 years and not have many problems getting their commissions.

Ref: SOinC PD6
 
#8
Still reading thus on the ol' Aide Memoire as at Oct 09.

SSgt to WO2 (Artificer)
 3 yrs in rank (As at 31 Mar)
SSgt to WO2 (TS Spec, Rec Mech, Shipwright)
 2 yrs in rank (As at 31 Mar)
SSgt to WO2 (All other trades)
 2 yrs in rank (As at 31 Mar)
 Minimum of 17 yrs of reckonable service
WO2 to WO1
 2 yrs in rank (Does not include promotion year)


So the rumour mill may be just that! :wink: Guess they'll have to wait to find out.
 
#9
I think you're right. I saw the aide memoir on the MS site - but this news has only just surfaced in the last few days - so who knows?
 
#11
Personally, as someone who went Tiffy early, I think that promotion should be timed against time served in the current rank not against total time served. As a tech, its too easy to sit on your arrse and do feck all for a few years at Sgt level and then reap the rewards come the first Q man's board. Am I bitter? Nah I don't resent anyone for anything but it does seem as though you are handicapped no matter what calibre you are.
As for having 16 year WO1s well thats nothing new, a very good pal of mine, on my Tiffy course, was that and then some. In fact he may well have been a 16 year LE Officer. Some guys make very good Warrants or Tiffies at an accelerated rate, some don't, thats life! There is also a very good chance of there being a 14 year WO1 on the next board, watch this space......!
 
#12
JesterRIP said:
Fixed that for you!
:D see - it never pays to be a smart arse on arrse! Although I am sure the WOs1 is 'correct'

The ADF has a load of WOs1 kicking around, they don't kick them out at 40 either, so the younger blokes suffer a bit - 'dead man's shoes' is quite literal here sometimes!
I believe it is technically possible to get WO1 after 16 years here and you can serve to 60 - that's a long time as a WO1!
 
#13
One of the consequences of moving from a standard 22 year career to 24 years is that promotion times need to be reviewed. The proposal for artificers is to increase the minimum length of time spent as substantive SSgt to 4 years before becoming eligible for promotion to WO2 and 3 years as a WO2 before promotion to WO1. The transitional plan will be produced by MCM Div.
Whenever this is introduced their will be a cohort that will feel that the goal posts have been moved.
 
#14
Nige said:
JesterRIP said:
Fixed that for you!
:D see - it never pays to be a smart arse on arrse! Although I am sure the WOs1 is 'correct'

The ADF has a load of WOs1 kicking around, they don't kick them out at 40 either, so the younger blokes suffer a bit - 'dead man's shoes' is quite literal here sometimes!
I believe it is technically possible to get WO1 after 16 years here and you can serve to 60 - that's a long time as a WO1!
I think you are quite correct using "WOs1", Nige.

You just don't see it that often as it is usually written WO1s! I suspect that even I have been guilty of the offence in the past!

As to the matter of "dead man's shoes", isn't that why the Royal Navy use the toast "To a long and bloody war"?

Litotes
 
#15
bluebells said:
One of the consequences of moving from a standard 22 year career to 24 years is that promotion times need to be reviewed. The proposal for artificers is to increase the minimum length of time spent as substantive SSgt to 4 years before becoming eligible for promotion to WO2 and 3 years as a WO2 before promotion to WO1. The transitional plan will be produced by MCM Div.
Whenever this is introduced their will be a cohort that will feel that the goal posts have been moved.
Interesting reading bluebells, i take it you don't have a document/source to quote or a timescale yet? Crusty old bitter and twisted Tiffies, who'd have thought!
Perhaps a two tiered system of those already there Vs those about to load on new courses? Those on VEng Vs those who are not? This way you know what you are getting into and those goal posts don't change half way through your tenure.

Still should cheer up the guys i met a few years back at Arborfield who were on ACFC III, were due to Grad around 20 days the wrong side of the 'as at' date. Four years and 340 odd days until you can even board. 2013 before your first look is it?
:pissedoff: BANG and the dirt is gone!
 
#16
Fell foul of the same thing the last time the Corps decided to change the rules. Been a SSgt for 9 years and have never been eligible to go forward to a promotion board as a consequence. I agree that we should not be promoting Tiffies who are vastly under experienced but at the same time if a guy goes on his course late and the Corps has selected him, he should not be disadvantaged by blanket rule changes in puzzle palace.
Glasgow should be doing their homework and looking after their soldiers as expected by every SNCO. Rule changes by the Corps are after all meant to be inclusive and not exclusive. No doubt this would be too much of a challenge.
 
#18
Hi catchyerselfon.

Yes, I heard it from REME Sldr Wg this afternoon. The new policy is being rolled out in New Year. It will affect those already at SSgt and WO2, although I personally think the effect should only include those selected for promotion on the next boards.

I for one feel at a loss to explain (although as previously mentioned the hoods at Sldr Wg will have every answer ready) how I can be made to mark time for another year until I get a shot at WO1, when I will be asked if I want to change my TOS to VEng (FC) in Feb 2010. My anticipated board was Nov 10, my ROD is Jul 12. How can I make a choice for my future if they keep changing the goalposts.

At what point will I be told by REME Sldr Wg, "Look, we accept that you don't want VEng (FC), and because you cannot now board until Nov 11, we're sorry but WO2 is now your ceiling. Oh, and here is a sleepy posting to see you off into 2 years Resettlement before you expire (sic)", "p.s. thanks for all the hard work you have given in the last 19 and a half years, it's been fun, but now we put you out to pasture on a smaller pension than you expected to get"

It sucks, I'll be requesting an interview at the next roadshow.
 
#20
There are no dates mentioned, although I'm sure that REME Sldr Wg will have enough desk officer's briefed to cover all queries until it is announced officially.

Best bet is to get your OC to ring them if you are concerned.
 

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