Witch hunt!

Yokel

LE
It costs billions to provide healthcare to people with all sorts of ailments. Some self inflicted, some mere misfortune, some inherited genetic defects, or whatever else.
Smoking tobacco, according to many medics, is the primary cause of all the woes of mankind, at least until you dig a bit and discover it's a useful coverall excuse to save resolving a totally unconnected ailment.
I smoke.
Almost two decades ago I'd a heart attack. Immediate medic response, caused by smoking. Secondary medic response, having asked a few questions, working 16 hour shifts, poor diet, lack of sleep, lack of exercise, stress, debts, and all the other joys of modern life, is not a good recipe for health. Cure those, then worry about smoking.
A decade ago I'd a stroke. First medic response, caused by smoking. Second medic response, from the surgeon, a weak blood vessel blew, because sometimes shit just happens, and it'd have blown whether or not I smoked.

Basically, medics are idle and pass people off with the most obvious excuse, rather than spend time and effort investigating.
Meanwhile the NHS spends vast sums pestering otherwise happy and healthy eldely people to undertake frequent tests for one thing or another, apparently to justify more tv ads for more donations for more research, ad infinitum.

Doing something that you derive pleasure from is life affirming for most of us. That can be sports, parachuting, flying, sailing, any number of dangerous pastimes, hazardous pursuits, or simply inhaling tobacco and swallowing alcohol.
Each will affect different people in different ways, all will eventually die, of something.

But smoking kills half of long term smokers. Tobacco smoke is full of chemicals that are toxic to every part of the human body. How or why should the medics investigate exactly what caused your heart attack or stroke? Most of these things are caused by a combination of things, and these things a cumulative. Their priority is on treatment.

I am not following your argument. Because preventative measures cannot prevent every heart attack, stroke, cancer, etc they should not try to prevent them.
 
But smoking kills half of long term smokers. Tobacco smoke is full of chemicals that are toxic to every part of the human body. How or why should the medics investigate exactly what caused your heart attack or stroke? Most of these things are caused by a combination of things, and these things a cumulative. Their priority is on treatment.

I am not following your argument. Because preventative measures cannot prevent every heart attack, stroke, cancer, etc they should not try to prevent them.
I'm not suggesting anything, except, by your own statement, 50% of smokers die from some other cause.
We can all find fault with others' habits, should we choose to.
 
It costs billions to provide healthcare to people with all sorts of ailments. Some self inflicted, some mere misfortune, some inherited genetic defects, or whatever else.
Smoking tobacco, according to many medics, is the primary cause of all the woes of mankind, at least until you dig a bit and discover it's a useful coverall excuse to save resolving a totally unconnected ailment.
I smoke.
Almost two decades ago I'd a heart attack. Immediate medic response, caused by smoking. Secondary medic response, having asked a few questions, working 16 hour shifts, poor diet, lack of sleep, lack of exercise, stress, debts, and all the other joys of modern life, is not a good recipe for health. Cure those, then worry about smoking.
A decade ago I'd a stroke. First medic response, caused by smoking. Second medic response, from the surgeon, a weak blood vessel blew, because sometimes shit just happens, and it'd have blown whether or not I smoked.

Basically, medics are idle and pass people off with the most obvious excuse, rather than spend time and effort investigating.
Meanwhile the NHS spends vast sums pestering otherwise happy and healthy eldely people to undertake frequent tests for one thing or another, apparently to justify more tv ads for more donations for more research, ad infinitum.

Doing something that you derive pleasure from is life affirming for most of us. That can be sports, parachuting, flying, sailing, any number of dangerous pastimes, hazardous pursuits, or simply inhaling tobacco and swallowing alcohol.
Each will affect different people in different ways, all will eventually die, of something.
The NHS has evolved it’s services to carry out routine tests on people when they get to a certain age etc. detection at an early stage can save lives.

I had an old army mate who was coming up to that age for testing things like the prostate etc. unfortunately, it was too late for him. He lived with me and my family for the final year of his life.

I’m a year older than him and have had the routine testing done on all men of a certain age and I’m fine. With my mates fate still relatively fresh in all our minds, I’m very happy to know everything is good down there.

These things save lives and they also cut the costs where treatment is found to be necessary because the illness is caught at an earlier stage.

So those tests are a pretty good investment.

As for your point about smoking. Some people smoke all their lives and seem to be pretty unaffected by it. I’ve met plenty of people who are in reasonably good health despite their smoking habit. There are though large numbers of people for whom smoking has turned them into a walking heart attack or stroke waiting to happen.

How’s your breathing for example? Mines excellent!

I meet large numbers of people however in their fifties and sixties who often struggle to routinely draw breath. Their health problems are undeniably caused by smoking.

My point is that while smoking was their choice, it’s not mine and I don’t see why I should be put at risk of breathing difficulties because others want to smoke.

So when you have to pop outside for your nicotine fix, kindly shut the door to keep the warm air in the pub.
 
Rather late to the table on this debate, considering it was posted in 2013, but can I just agree with those who said the opening post was so feckin long it’s a wonder I’ve any memory left in my smart phone, I ain’t reading that bloody lot!
I’d like to weigh in by saying this; I smoked for 28 years (12 - 40), I enjoyed it at times, after tea and whilst enjoying a pint especially, when I started it was feckin grim at 12, but I did it because of peer pressure, I got good at it, then at about 18 I actually started enjoying it.
I eventually gave up in 2007 for financial reasons, it was becoming too damn expensive, no more NAAFI / EFI £5 for 200 specials, plus the smoking ban meant I had to spend my evenings down the pub in either a freezing cold beer garden, or a freezing cold smoking shelter. So I went cold turkey and here we are 15 years later, not a drag has passed my lips and if you consider the average price of fags in that time is about £7.50 a packet (£5 in 2007, £10 now), and I had a 20 a day habit, I’ve saved about £41,062.50, and denied the taxman about £35,000!
Now if that isn’t enough to make you quit, I’ve steadily watched the anti-smoking league grow and grow, it has become a completely antisocial pastime, smokers are getting fewer and fewer and finding themselves more and more pushed onto the fringes of society. After the initial shock of finding all our public houses stunk of piss and vomit when there was no smoke smell to mask it, the publicans have now realised that sprinkling shake-n-vac around the public bar and pouring cheap bleach down the urinal and toilet pan doesn’t cut it and they actually need to clean the place now (except those idiots that think waterless urinals is a step forward!), so we have cleaner pubs.
I’m not one of those ex-smoker fag hating knobbers, but my final word is, I enjoy the world a whole lot more now I don’t smoke, I also love being in a world not full of other peoples smoke in confined public spaces, I also like it that my daughter has given up! There are fewer and fewer occasions now when I smell a burning fag and think “Ooow that smells really good, I miss that!”
 
Each will affect different people in different ways, all will eventually die, of something.
I smoked since soon after joining junior bleeders in 1972. I quit after having a heart attack in 2004 and started running again, not to win, just to finish.
DVT got me in 2017 and I tested positive for JAK2 with a marrow sample. JAK2 is a mutated gene in the marrow that is caused by nicotine, in short, smoking alters your DNA and this can be passed to your children.
Airlines won't carry you long haul without a substantial insurance policy because thrombosis significantly increased the chance of DVT in-flight.
I cannot get a Covid vaccination without undergoing chemo to lower my platelet count.

So, all will die but smokers, even ex-smokers, have a big lifestyle crimp that non-smokers do not and they increase their offspring's chances of getting cancer and thrombosis.
Image7.jpg
 
Meanwhile the NHS spends vast sums pestering otherwise happy and healthy eldely people to undertake frequent tests for one thing or another, apparently to justify more tv ads for more donations for more research, ad infinitum.

My figures are out of date but last time I checked the NHS spent about £2 billion a year on smoking related illnesses, and at that time tobacco taxes were raising £10 billion a year for the public coffers (see what I did there). Smokers are - or were - great, they raised loads of money and didn't collect their pensions for too long...
 

Boris_Johnson

ADC
Moderator
DirtyBAT
Me and the good lady were in Correlejo a couple of weeks ago looking for a sports bar to watch England struggle to get a draw against lower ranked Italy, as well as even lower ranked Germany. (We were back home in time to witness the 4-0 home loss against bottom ranked Hungary)...

Anyway, we checked Google maps and there was one just around the corner from the hotel, so unsurprisingly it was full of the morbidly obese lot who'd been filling ashtrays around the pool hotel all day.

You know the types, massive beer guts, permanently sprayed on footie shirt, either shaved grey hair or completely bald with a roll of neck fat like a travel pillow rather than 2 x chins like the rest of us. Accompanied by the chain smoking missus with manageable hair, jeans and white vest / t-shirt.

We were a little concerned going away after 2 years of doing sod all and being a little more rotund. No fear though - pretty much wedged between fatties I'd never felt so fit and skinny.

I say "wedged", but everyone was getting up every 5 minutes to waddle outside and back around to the wide open window by the seat to lean in to the exact same position they were in before to spark up for the 8th time that first half.

A mistake we made once. It was like being in a pub pre-2007 all over again. I could hardly breathe and my eyes were stinging a bit after we left as I wasn't used to it.

For the Italy game we found a place called "7 Pints" - and our initial apprehension proved to be wrong as I asked one couple, "Where's all the roly-poly Brits?"

"Oh it's too far from their hotels - they'll all be at Talk of the Town or the Corner Bar".

A 10 minute walk no less.

But because it's so windy there, most of the hotels are designed as hollow squares with a central pool, which is why we couldn't really use it during the day. The huge clouds of smoke just swirl around the place no matter where you sit.
 
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