Winchester 1873 That Was Found In The Nevada Desert.

Found this on Youtube, it's an update of what happened to the Winchester 1893 rifle that had been in the Nevada desert for fair bit, a hundred years and more. I remember this find being on national television when it happened but honestly never gave it another thought afterwards .

The video restored the memory and I found it pretty interesting.
 
If only Custer had had a few of these little beauties er? Oh... And the Gatlin guns that he supposedly refused to take with him as well of course!
 
If only Custer had had a few of these little beauties er? Oh... And the Gatlin guns that he supposedly refused to take with him as well of course!
I've gave General George Armstrong a fair bit of thought over the years and I came to a conclusion the hype went to his head and he believed it as well. If you look at some of his quotes he believed he was invisible.

The Sioux Nation would soon dispel him that notion though.
 
I'm going to make a point of seeing that the next time I'm down that way. It'll be interesting to see it up close. I love stuff like this.
 
Found this on Youtube, it's an update of what happened to the Winchester 1893 rifle that had been in the Nevada desert for fair bit, a hundred years and more. I remember this find being on national television when it happened but honestly never gave it another thought afterwards .

The video restored the memory and I found it pretty interesting.
You put 1893 in post title rather than 1873. The 1893 was a shotgun if I recall correctly.
 
I've gave General George Armstrong a fair bit of thought over the years and I came to a conclusion the hype went to his head and he believed it as well. If you look at some of his quotes he believed he was invisible.
Though it is fiction, GMF offers pretty much the same opinion in Flashman and the Redskins, with his as-per-usual historic endnotes pointing out Custer's foibles and massive ego
 
Weapons have a way of turning up. A local Vietnam veteran told a friend and I this story once:

After a contact in which his unit had been involved, an enemy KIA was found to be carrying a .30 US M1 Carbine. The matter was reported to a neighbouring American unit, and the weapon's serial number was traced. It turned out the weapon had been issued to a GI who'd carried it in Europe in the Second World War and who'd returned it when, in due course, he returned to the US and was discharged.

The weapon was then issued to another GI during the Korean War. He was killed, but although his body was recovered, his weapon was not, it having been taken by either a Chinese or Korean soldier. This fact was duly noted and the weapon officially recorded as missing.

Whoever had taken it notwithstanding, the weapon had ended up with the Chinese, and eventually became part of a shipment made to their (fellow travelers would you call them?), the North Vietnamese. Thus in the space of twenty odd years, it had been in the service of three different countries.
 
I've gave General George Armstrong a fair bit of thought over the years and I came to a conclusion the hype went to his head and he believed it as well. If you look at some of his quotes he believed he was invisible.

The Sioux Nation would soon dispel him that notion though.
Custer's brother Tom was his ADC at Little Bighorn. Tom Custer had earned the US Medal of Honor twice in the US Civil War, one of only 19 men to do so in the history of the decoration, although a total of four soldiers were double recipients during the Civil War. (Source: Thomas Custer - Wikipedia)
 
Found this on Youtube, it's an update of what happened to the Winchester 1893 rifle that had been in the Nevada desert for fair bit, a hundred years and more. I remember this find being on national television when it happened but honestly never gave it another thought afterwards .

The video restored the memory and I found it pretty interesting.
Funny how Americans get excited over something just over 100 years old , the UK is full of late nineteenth century guns.
 

Scunner

Clanker
'they removed the rust' looks like it's been sand blasted and that has ruined it. Would have been far better to leave it unmolested other than removing the live cartridge...
 
Funny how Americans get excited over something just over 100 years old , the UK is full of late nineteenth century guns.
As is the US. No one is getting excited as you put it, it's just an interesting find.
 
D

Deleted 60082

Guest
Weapons have a way of turning up. A local Vietnam veteran told a friend and I this story once:

After a contact in which his unit had been involved, an enemy KIA was found to be carrying a .30 US M1 Carbine. The matter was reported to a neighbouring American unit, and the weapon's serial number was traced. It turned out the weapon had been issued to a GI who'd carried it in Europe in the Second World War and who'd returned it when, in due course, he returned to the US and was discharged.

The weapon was then issued to another GI during the Korean War. He was killed, but although his body was recovered, his weapon was not, it having been taken by either a Chinese or Korean soldier. This fact was duly noted and the weapon officially recorded as missing.

Whoever had taken it notwithstanding, the weapon had ended up with the Chinese, and eventually became part of a shipment made to their (fellow travelers would you call them?), the North Vietnamese. Thus in the space of twenty odd years, it had been in the service of three different countries.
I own a rather fine Snider Enfield rifle that I purchased in Afghanistan about 11 years ago. The rifle was originally made in Enfield in 1859 and would’ve been converted in the mid eighteen seventies to become a breach loader. Based on the markings on the stock and the trigger strap the rifle was issued to native sepoys during the British Army of retribution expedition Into Afghanistan in 1878. There are new markings which indicate the rifle was used by the Afghan army up until to the First World War. Fast forward to 2007, I bought it from a local enterprising Afghan for $100. It’s in extremely good condition having been well stored and well maintained over the years. It now graces the wall above my fireplace in my study in the Lake District.

I’m sure there are others here on the site who also brought martini-enfields and Snider-Enfields back from Afghanistan. I do regret not bringing back a martini Enfield, Although most of them that I saw in the markets were very poor Khyber pass copies.
 
D

Deleted 60082

Guest
As is the US. No one is getting excited as you put it, it's just an interesting find.
A couple of weeks ago a friend of mine in Auckland, New Zealand was clearing out the roof space to do a loft extension on their Edwardian Villa. Resting up in the rafters was a Winchester .22 Long rifle slide action rifle. It has a little bit of surface rust but the action still works and the woodwork is in good conditio. Based on the serial numbers rifle dates and from the early 1920s. It’s anyone’s guess how long that rifle is been up there.

As I’ve mentioned before on other threads when my grandmother died in the 1970s, we found a mark IV Wembley .455 revolver in her bedside cabinet, complete with several boxes of ammunition. As a 12-year-old I was quite excited but my father had an attack of the vapours and handed the pistol into the police. I still have the lanyard and holster and used the lanyard during two tours in the Balkans, in the Middle East and Afghanistan.We believe the pistol was owned by her second husband who was an infantry officer in the First World War and was a district commander in the home guard in New Zealand during World War II.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
If only Custer had had a few of these little beauties er? Oh... And the Gatlin guns that he supposedly refused to take with him as well of course!
Some years ago, there was a grass fire at the site of the battle and an archaeological survey was carried out afterwards with metal detectors to plot the location of cartridge cases. They found that the Indians had the better rifles/carbines, some repeating rifles, whilst the Cavalry had the single shot Springfield carbine. The Indians had been better deployed in better firing positions ISTR.

Someone should have shot Custer before he got them all killed.

The Winchester did make a major difference at the Battle of Plevna in the hands of the Turks. They fired at the Russians with the Peabody-Martinis, then used Winchesters when they got within range. The Winchester 'rifle' fired pistol ammunition and did that rapidly, the small metal gun of its day.
 
Last edited:
D

Deleted 60082

Guest
The Winchester did make a major difference at the Battle of Plevna in the hands of the Turks. They fired at the Russians with the Peabody-Martinis, then used Winchesters when they got within range. The Winchester 'rifle' fired pistol ammunition and did that rapidly, the small metal gun of its day.
There’s several on display in the armoury of Topkapi Palace in Istanbul. The Turks also used a lot of SMLEs (captured at Kut or Gallipoli) but also acquired No 4 MK 1 towards the end of WWII. Some of the paintings and statues of the War of Independence (1919-1923) have the Turkish troops with SMLEs rather than Mauser K98s. They have retained the No4 in their arsenals and disposed of their pre-WWI Maisets in the early 1980s. Up until 2 1/2 years ago 25lber howitzers were also in use, albeit for training at the arty school in Polatli, near Ankara.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
The Winchester did make a major difference at the Battle of Plevna in the hands of the Turks. They fired at the Russians with the Peabody-Martinis, then used Winchesters when they got within range. The Winchester 'rifle' fired pistol ammunition and did that rapidly, the small metal gun of its day.
The idea in the Old West times was that a man could carry the same ammunition for his rifle as for his revolver. This made the carbine or "saddle gun," as they were also called, more attractive to potential buyers. It might also have distracted them from its two main faults:

Firstly, any rifle with a tubular magazine, even today, mostly has to use ammunition with a rounded tip, which is not good for long range accuracy. That's because using Spitzer or other sharply pointed rounds can cause a chainfire due to recoil as the primer of one round slams into the tip of the one behind it. This tended to put the user off tubular magazines, and so matters stood until Hornady came out with their "Leverevolution" ammunition. These rounds are tipped with rubber so as to prevent this problem.

Secondly, lever actions, while giving indisputably fast reloading, can be difficult to use in the prone position. That is why they were phased out of military service as turnbolt actions evolved.

By the end of the 19th Century Winchester made a lever action rifle which used a box magazine. This was its Model 1895:





Lawmen and hunters tended to prefer this one, as they could get better long range accuracy with it, it being offered in a variety of calibres including .303 British, but as against that, it had only a five round capacity (4 + 1), and using it from the prone position was still problematic, although it could use stripper clips.
 
Last edited:

New Posts

Latest Threads

Top