Will Dominic Cummings be needing a new job soon?

Should Dominic Cummings resign over this scandal and violation of blatant lockdown advice?

  • Yes

    Votes: 37 20.1%
  • No

    Votes: 105 57.1%
  • Divided

    Votes: 8 4.3%
  • Don't care

    Votes: 34 18.5%

  • Total voters
    184

Auld-Yin

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Apart from those dismissed on disciplinary grounds or failed during training, I am scratching my head to think of any SP dismissed for being rubbish, during my 30 year career. It is fair to say, however, that the various redundancy tranches did thin out quite a lot of dead wood (and paid them handsomely for being mediocre).
You've never seen anyone get a three month report then emptied after it? I have, albeit a long time ago.
 
Apart from those dismissed on disciplinary grounds or failed during training, I am scratching my head to think of any SP dismissed for being rubbish, during my 30 year career. It is fair to say, however, that the various redundancy tranches did thin out quite a lot of dead wood (and paid them handsomely for being mediocre).
As opposed to the disgraceful SNLRs of the 1980s where good blokes were dumped under nasty rules by spineless OCs acting on quota instuctions from their COs.
 
That rather begs the question how the individual in question got to that position in the first place...
One can only wonder how many of those involved in the career/reporting chain of the individual suffered from a sudden rush of shit to the heart on hearing the good news.
 
A one star ? A Brig ? Wow.
 
That rather begs the question how the individual in question got to that position in the first place...
Well, I don't know - sometimes circumstances conspire against you (like having 3 PARA in your brigade...).

Then of course there's always Tony Wilson to fall back upon in 1982...
 

Mr_Relaxed

War Hero
Be careful what you wish for. Has any soldier ever been sacked, other than any that have been banged up by the Courts Martial?

It's perfectly possible to sack someone in the private sector, so long as you have good reason to do so (i.e. genuine incompetence, not "they keep disagreeing with me, and I'm the boss") and you follow the rules (or the Industrial Tribunal will have you).

So: given that we've all known some utter chods and oxygen thieves, when was the last time the Army actually sacked a waste-of-space NCO or officer, rather than post them off somewhere else, to make them Someone Else's Problem?

(Sits back and waits for the cries that "but Soldiers are different from Civil Servants, they special, etc")
Or you pay a chunk of money to make the problem (and any Tribunal) go away - the phrase tends to be "What's their magic number?", quick negotiation and agree what nice words HR will say about them if asked.
 
Or you pay a chunk of money to make the problem (and any Tribunal) go away - the phrase tends to be "What's their magic number?", quick negotiation and agree what nice words HR will say about them if asked.
The MOD almost never does that - public money etc etc. Nobody cares about the capitation rates of the (often senior) individuals who have to waste their time preparing for, and attending, the ET.
 
Looking at the chart in @Andy71 's link, it seems to me the numbers in the 'Dismissal' column are all nice round multiples of 10 which would indicate to me that they are not individual dismissals for incompetence/inefficiency but rather something to do with closure or relocation of a particular office and those involved didn't want to move. BTW, I'm not a statistician.
 
Looking at the chart in @Andy71 's link, it seems to me the numbers in the 'Dismissal' column are all nice round multiples of 10 which would indicate to me that they are not individual dismissals for incompetence/inefficiency but rather something to do with closure or relocation of a particular office and those involved didn't want to move. BTW, I'm not a statistician.
Why would round 10s be more plausible for non-relocation dismissals rather than firing?

Looking at it all the numbers are multiples of 10 (or zero). I suspect there's some rounding going on across the entire dataset

ETA - hidden down in the notes

Numbers are rounded to the nearest ten, and cells containing between one and five employees are represented by ".."
 
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ISTR seeing a NISRA document from 2017/2018 that showed more people resigned from the NI Civil Service than retired. Doesn't surprise me, mind.

In terms of sackings, I recall 3 in my time. One bloke got his collar felt for noncery, and the other 2 were nicked for fiddling payable orders.
 

lert

LE
Can't comment on the CS but at know of at least 2 JRs binned in early teens, from a field army unit not training. Neither could pass a BFT or CFT among other failings. Both were utter wastes of baggy skin and organs. IIRC the mechanism was a three month warning order and hoofed under AGAI 67. This was at the time of Herrick and in a pinch trade.

It may or may not equate to a performance related sacking from a private sector organisation but regardless of the mechanism, the result's the same.
 
Why would round 10s be more plausible for non-relocation dismissals rather than firing?

Looking at it all the numbers are multiples of 10 (or zero). I suspect there's some rounding going on across the entire dataset

ETA - hidden down in the notes

Numbers are rounded to the nearest ten, and cells containing between one and five employees are represented by ".."
Unless there was wide-scale naughtiness at one location I couldn't see it any other way.

As always with the CS, the devil is in the fine print. Thanks for pointing that out.

In terms of sackings, I can only remember two in the true sense of the word.

One was a CS who set up his own ficticious companies so he could exploit the Local Purchase procedures - he placed fake orders and submitted false invoices for payment. He got sent down for a stay at HM's Pleasure.

The other was also an LPO clerk who was caught pulling sickies and claiming sickness benefits whilst she was working on-site at her husband's building firm. She was caught when one of Sqn's officers went to the building site with the intention of buying one of the houses and there she was in the sales office when she was supposed to be immobilised at home with severe back problems.

Couldn't get rid of useless CS for love nor money.
 
Couldn't get rid of useless CS for love nor money.
Why on earth not? Set clear, measurable and achievable targets, ensure training and mentoring is available, give clear direction and guidance where required, observe and report. Once failure is clear then follow the process of warnings etc and when the process says they've been warned enough sack them in accordance with due process in terms of timelines etc. Wait for ET, attend ET, win ET.

Yes, it's a pain in the arse but it isn't impossible, even with CS. The first area to concentrate on is your own HR staff - get a good team in there and you are halfway to the objective.
 
............. The first area to concentrate on is your own HR staff - get a good team in there and you are halfway to the objective.
And therein was the problem. The station's Civil Admin would find every excuse for not taking the matter on - and I'm not talking about a single station, this was common across several stations I was at. In one of the cases I mentioned in an earlier post, the problem person was a very close friend of the Civil Admin Officer (they had been at school together and were near neighbours) and this fact only came to light following the discovery of her moonlighting and questions being asked as to why no action had been taken over her sickness record despite it being reported. Then there was the hurdle of the Whitley Council - don't know if it still exists. It may be very different now but this was several years ago.
 

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