Why is the Extreme Left so enamoured of Radical Islam?

#1
Can anyone tell me why? Is this a marriage of convenience? Does the Left hate so much that they prepared to empower a medievalist movement that will remove women’s rights, execute homosexuals, burn books and install a Theocratic Dictatorship ? I am fairly confident the Islamists regard the left, in that fine old Bolshevik phrase, as ‘useful idiots’ to be disposed of as soon as possible. But WTF can the Left hope to gain?
 
#3
I used to wonder this too. The answer was provided by a gay bloke slagging off Ken Livingstone in an article in the Evening Standard.

The hard left, especially those with political power, see themselves as crusading knights in shining aromour riding to the rescue of the world's oppressed minorities. Of course, indulging this fantasy requires a steady supply of fashionably oppressed minorities.

In the 1970s, the 'oppressed working classes' were in vogue. Red Ken, Arthur Scargill and most of the current cabinet never missed an opportunity to stand on a picket line. This lost Labour the 1979 election.

In the 1980s, flat cap wearing trade unionists became old hat as trendy lefties looked for new victims to save. The oppressed gay community, ahem, filled the void left by the now hopelessly unfashionable union militants. Red Ken's GLC and Michael Foot's Labour party were vocal in their support for lesbian communes, gay housing estates and rent boy collectives. Loony leftery kept Labour in opposition for a generation.

Blair stamped hard on the loony left when he became Labour leader. The party severed its links with the English Collective of Prostitutes. Michael Foot and his donkey jacket were never to be seen again at the head of a tidal wave of crusty, CND types marching to Aldermaston.

The left had a dilemma. Who could they save now? What could be more deserving than oppressed religious minorities? Muslims were definitely a minority. They were, in the main, poor. They tended to vote Labour and they were oppressed by Jews (Red Ken doesn't like Jews - remember his concentration camp quip?). Ideal. Or so they thought.

As in the 70s and 80s, an extremist fringe has jumped on Labour's latest bandwagon. They exploit the naivete of middle class socialists desperate to find a cause to fight for. The result is what we have now. A country where an increasingly persecuted majority are afraid to put up Christmas decorations for fear of being accused of racism. Servicemen are asked to remove their uniforms in hospital in case their mere presence causes offence.

I suspect that Labour have, once again, cut their own throats.
 
#4
Much as I agree with so much of what Mariner says, he puts it far better then I could, I do worry about

'I suspect that Labour have, once again, cut their own throats.'

Dave is no hero, f-ing pillock in my book, and if Gorden continues as he has started I think the next election could go Old Labours way.
john
Mind you ai'nt dear Leader doing us proud Tells the house he's going to put Vald strieght and Vald shaking in boots has delayed, put back, off ! their meeting.
Maggei would be proud of her prodigy.
 
#5
Read Londonistan by Melanie Phillips, it is a worrying but detailed explanation of how we are losing the war at home. If her theories are correct most of what is spouted on Arrse is entirely accurate regarding New Labour, the Police, Journos etc, etc.
 
M

Mr_Logic

Guest
#7
I agree completely with the Ancient_mariner (but don't quite have his eloquence).

Old labour's traditional appeal has been that they support the weak under-dog who has (supposedly) been oppressed by society's elites. They garner votes from the majority by playing on their fears and promising a redistribution of wealth and/or rights. They have pushed this to the n'th degree and will now support any cause, even if it is damaging to the nation.

Labour dislike grammar schools because they smack of elitism (strange when you consider the schools and university Tony Bliar went to) and will support the rights of radical islam, et al, if it appears to be in some way oppressed.

In my mind George Orwell had it completely right in 1984. The left will always move towards totalitarianism. Remember, it is the current government who are trying to bring in detention without trial for 90 days. We dealt with the IRA with only 7 days detention (as Patrick Mercer said this morning on the wireless).

We need to change our govenment now to one that supports liberty, a sensible degree of tolerance and will allow the best and the brightest to thrive and prosper, for the good of the nation.
 
#8
Once the muslim extremists have started a serious suicide bombing campaign here in the UK and caused many deaths and resentment the left wing will move onto some other cretinous cause.
 

RP578

LE
Book Reviewer
#9
western said:
Read Londonistan by Melanie Phillips, it is a worrying but detailed explanation of how we are losing the war at home. If her theories are correct most of what is spouted on Arrse is entirely accurate regarding New Labour, the Police, Journos etc, etc.
No, that book is an assessment of the Left by an unabashed Right Wing commentator. A far better book is ""What's Left" by Nick Cohen, a Left Wing columnist for the Observer. It charts the liberal-Left's flirtation and eventual alliance with essential fascist causes since the end of the Cold War.

The breaking point for Cohen was the Iraq War. While he recognised valid reasons to oppose the war, the fact that the liberal Left continued to support the fascist insurgents over ordinary Iraqis baffled him. Typical of this was when Iraq Trade Unionist/Socialists and Communists were murdered by insurgents for participating and defending the new democracy, the Liberal Left dismissed the victims as 'American Stooges' or 'Quislings'. All from the safety of their Islington town houses of course.

Nick Cohen
 
#10
its anti American
a nice tactical move on behalf of george galloway got him elected and embarrassed blair
as the radical left are about as powerful as the bnp though slightly less likely
to beat you up after closing time forget about it
 
#11
brighton hippy said:
its anti American
a nice tactical move on behalf of george galloway got him elected and embarrassed blair
as the radical left are about as powerful as the bnp though slightly less likely
to beat you up after closing time forget about it
Umm, I beg to differ on that.
 
#12
RP578 said:
western said:
Read Londonistan by Melanie Phillips, it is a worrying but detailed explanation of how we are losing the war at home. If her theories are correct most of what is spouted on Arrse is entirely accurate regarding New Labour, the Police, Journos etc, etc.
No, that book is an assessment of the Left by an unabashed Right Wing commentator.
First and foremost starting a response with the word No as a prefix is extremely irritating especially when you do not go on to make a valid point. I totally agree that (see I didn't start with no) she is a Right Wing commentator, please tell me what is wrong with that or her opinions. I for one found it reassuring that I shared a great deal of her opinions on the collapse of the State and it's institutions quoting facts figures and incidents along the way to form a convincing argument. I especially agreed with her explanation for the total infiltration of the Police by left wing radicals. The only trouble is that she did not know where to stop and it is a bit of a ramble towards the end.

Thanks for bringing Nick Cohen to my attention and I will read his material with equal enthusiasm.
 
#13
armchair_jihad said:
Can anyone tell me why? Is this a marriage of convenience? Does the Left hate so much that they prepared to empower a medievalist movement that will remove women’s rights, execute homosexuals, burn books and install a Theocratic Dictatorship ? I am fairly confident the Islamists regard the left, in that fine old Bolshevik phrase, as ‘useful idiots’ to be disposed of as soon as possible. But WTF can the Left hope to gain?
But why do you think that left political forces support radical Islam?
 
#14
KGB_resident said:
armchair_jihad said:
Can anyone tell me why? Is this a marriage of convenience? Does the Left hate so much that they prepared to empower a medievalist movement that will remove women’s rights, execute homosexuals, burn books and install a Theocratic Dictatorship ? I am fairly confident the Islamists regard the left, in that fine old Bolshevik phrase, as ‘useful idiots’ to be disposed of as soon as possible. But WTF can the Left hope to gain?
But why do you think that left political forces support radical Islam?
I think that Ancient Mariner has the bones of it down, obviously there are more aspects yet to be discussed.

I think that this is more of a UK & Western European phenomenon, I cannot imagine this political sickness taking hold east of Berlin.
 
#15
armchair_jihad said:
KGB_resident said:
armchair_jihad said:
Can anyone tell me why? Is this a marriage of convenience? Does the Left hate so much that they prepared to empower a medievalist movement that will remove women’s rights, execute homosexuals, burn books and install a Theocratic Dictatorship ? I am fairly confident the Islamists regard the left, in that fine old Bolshevik phrase, as ‘useful idiots’ to be disposed of as soon as possible. But WTF can the Left hope to gain?
But why do you think that left political forces support radical Islam?
I think that Ancient Mariner has the bones of it down, obviously there are more aspects yet to be discussed.

I think that this is more of a UK & Western European phenomenon, I cannot imagine this political sickness taking hold east of Berlin.
And still I don't understand why do you think so. Have you any examples? What actually British or West-European Left have done in support of radical Islam?
 
#16
I've never really met any lefties who were into random drunken violence some used to want to have ago at the police and usually came off worse. and a few brave souls went to folkstone to have ago at the bnp
chased some skinhead wearing a maroon t-shirt into a pub (yes you can guess what happened next :twisted: ) pub full of 3 para afa leave at great speed :)
the politcal left in the uk are powerless and mostly about fightng with themsleves outside of the swp most of the rest have no time for radical islam
who they seem as an enemy the cry of "we are all hezbollah now " at an stop the war ralley pissed large numbers of people off.
 
#17
KGB_resident said:
And still I don't understand why do you think so. Have you any examples? What actually British or West-European Left have done in support of radical Islam?
Try here:

Londonistan
Published 2006 by Encounter Books in US and Gibson Square in the UK. Published in paperback with a new afterword in 2007

The suicide bombings carried out in London in 2005 by British Muslims revealed an alarming network of Islamist terrorists and their sympathizers. Under the noses of British intelligence, London became the European hub for the promotion, recruitment and financing of Islamist terror and extremism - so much so that it has been mockingly dubbed 'Londonistan'. In this ground-breaking book, Melanie Phillips pieces together the story of how Londonistan developed as a result of the collapse of British self-confidence and national identity and its resulting paralysis by multiculturalism and appeasement. The result is an ugly climate in Britain of irrationality and defeatism, which now threatens to undermine the alliance with America and imperil the defence of the free world.
 

RP578

LE
Book Reviewer
#18
western said:
RP578 said:
western said:
Read Londonistan by Melanie Phillips, it is a worrying but detailed explanation of how we are losing the war at home. If her theories are correct most of what is spouted on Arrse is entirely accurate regarding New Labour, the Police, Journos etc, etc.
No, that book is an assessment of the Left by an unabashed Right Wing commentator.
First and foremost starting a response with the word No as a prefix is extremely irritating especially when you do not go on to make a valid point. I totally agree that (see I didn't start with no) she is a Right Wing commentator, please tell me what is wrong with that or her opinions. I for one found it reassuring that I shared a great deal of her opinions on the collapse of the State and it's institutions quoting facts figures and incidents along the way to form a convincing argument. I especially agreed with her explanation for the total infiltration of the Police by left wing radicals. The only trouble is that she did not know where to stop and it is a bit of a ramble towards the end.

Thanks for bringing Nick Cohen to my attention and I will read his material with equal enthusiasm.
OK, apologies for being blunt and irritating. It wasn't the intention. The reason that I don't think Melanie Phillips' book answers the question posed (and I yes I have read it) is that her book is essentially an account of the rise of Islamism in the UK and not of the internal upheavals, fractures and mutations within in the British Left.

Yes, the book does, on a number of occasions, touch on the idealising of and admiration for various Islamist movements by the British Left. The causes for this though are not dealt with in anywhere near the depth that it merits, furthermore she approaches it (openly) as an political opposite viewing the movement from the outside. Cohen on the other hand leads you through the tortured factionalism of the Left from the perspective of someone who worked, socialised and debated with these very people. If you want to understand why some of the people on the Left have got to where they tacitly support fascism over democracy rather than a detailed journey through Islamism in modern Britain, then you're better off reading "What's Left" instead of "Londonstan".

As to your summary of "Londonstan", yes I agree that end is an endless ramble. The first six chapters were actually quite revealing and a lot of what Phillips had to says in those chapters rings true and is verifiable. The fact that she frankly expresses her view of the world without hedge or qualification is to be applauded, in fact (and I say this as a bleeding-heart leftie) I agree with a lot of the points Phillips made during the first 6 chapters.

After that though it just seems to descend into a rant chock full of half truths, and even outright distortion of acepted historical knowledge on the Middle East. The fact that it just ends as an 'Israel right or wrong' piece of agit-prop just kills it for me.

Hope this helps clarify my earlier post and that starting this one with the word 'OK' is less irritating.
 
#19
Melanie Phillips is an extremist twat.
 

RP578

LE
Book Reviewer
#20
luke said:
Melanie Phillips is an extremist t**t.
That she may be. I think she is. But that doesn't invalidate any and every point she makes. Indeed she makes some very telling ones in her book.
 

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