Why Council Tax bands are to be revalued...

#1
...we'll be subsidising public sector pensions! Liabour don't have the b@lls to subject local government workers to the same pension revisions that the Armed Forces and the police are undergoing, because of the effect of mass walkouts.

Will this have an impact on CILOCT for those in public accommodation?

From the Torygraph:

How Prescott put £1bn on council tax
By George Jones and Toby Helm
(Filed: 21/04/2005)

Council tax is expected to rise sharply after the election following Labour's decision not to raise the retirement age for local government workers from 60 to 65, leaked Government papers revealed last night.

Councils in England will face nearly £1 billion in extra costs over the next three years as a result of increased pension responsibilities.

Last month's decision by John Prescott, the Deputy Prime Minister, not to proceed with the higher retirement age averted a 24-hour strike by a million council workers as the election approached.

Ministers agreed to revoke changes, due to come into force on April 1, after workers, from binmen to dinner ladies, threatened to walk out.

Channel 4 News disclosed that it had seen a confidential memo to Labour MPs from the Office of the Deputy Prime Minister, warning of the consequences of not proceeding with the higher retirement age. It was written in January.

"If these changes are not implemented, local government would face increasing pension costs of £300 million per annum over the next three years," it said.

Hilary Armstrong, the chief whip, underlined the need for a rise in the retirement age in a letter to MPs. She said it could not be delayed "without serious consequences building up for the future".

Nick Raynsford, the local government minister, denied last night that councils would face extra costs.

He said the Government was still committed to seeking changes in the pension scheme. It had agreed with the unions to drop the higher retirement age on the basis that there would be "no adverse financial impact".

The disclosure that the about-turn would involve significant costs for councils came as council tax was forced to the forefront of the election campaign by a Conservative pledge to scrap Labour's revaluation of every home in England.

Michael Howard, the Tory leader, said the move would halt "a relentless rise" in local tax bills. It would save seven million households from a further £270-a-year average increase as a result of being moved into higher tax bands.

Mr Blair came under pressure over the prospect of post-election tax rises when he was interviewed by Jeremy Paxman on BBC television.

Four years ago, in a similar pre-election interview with Mr Paxman, he said that people should not assume that Labour would put up National Insurance contributions. In the first Budget after winning a second term, Labour raised them by a percentage point.

Mr Paxman said Labour was going to have to raise taxes after the election.

Mr Blair replied: "No, you can't say that on the basis of the spending plans we have. The spending proposals we have are adequately catered for by the plans we have got."

As The Sun, owned by Rupert Murdoch, announced that it would be backing Mr Blair, as it did at the last two elections, ministers switched tactics toward the Tories, taunting them as "desperate" and panic-stricken because of their failure to make progress in the polls.

Until now Mr Blair and his ministers have tried to guard against complacency among Labour voters by stressing that the election would be "a tough fight" and that they could let the Tories in by the back door if they did not vote.

But Labour strategists, buoyed by polls showing them extending their lead to between five and 10 points, appear to think they are in a strong enough position to highlight the Tory inability to break through.

Mr Howard had to fight off accusations that his rejection of revaluation of homes - a policy not included in last week's manifesto - was a "shameless" vote-grabbing U-turn.

Labour and the Liberal Democrats produced evidence that frontbench Tories had argued that local property taxes needed regular revaluation, although Mr Howard said that his MPs had voted against the revaluation and the creation of new council tax bands at every opportunity in the Commons.

Iain Duncan Smith, the former party leader, said the move was "one of the best decisions we have made" but conceded that it could be seen as a U-turn.

Mr Howard said the decision to promise to halt the process for at least five years was based on new house price figures which showed that it was no longer necessary.

The value of homes is being reassessed for the first time since 1991.
 
#2
Local governemnt workers !
Tone's jobs for the boyos, the co ordinators for off white lesbian mothers from anywhere but UK.
john
 

Mr_Fingerz

LE
Book Reviewer
#3
So you don't use libraries, schools, leisure centres, or roads then?
 
#4
Just another stealth tax by the neo-communist govt.

So much for two jags having any balls. He gapped it at the threat of a 24 hr strike. Pussy!
 
#5
jonwilly said:
Local governemnt workers !
Tone's jobs for the boyos, the co ordinators for off white lesbian mothers from anywhere but UK.
john
So you don't have your bins emptied? use open spaces? or let some fcuker build a 90 ft wooden cock next to your house?
 
#6
jonwilly said:
Local governemnt workers !
Tone's jobs for the boyos, the co ordinators for off white lesbian mothers from anywhere but UK.
john
So you don't have your bins emptied? use open spaces? or let some fcuker build a 90 ft wooden c0ck next to your house
 
#7
or let some fcuker build a 90 ft wooden c0ck next to your house
That would be an excellent use of taxpayer's money! :twisted:

I have to confess that I was scratching my head over the last couple of days, puzzling over the issue of council tax revaluation. Why do it if it isn't required? What is the point in basing a tax on someone's house, when the captial value of a person's house can't be realised unless it is sold?

Now it is all clear! Local government employees deserve good pensions and salaries, but should not be exempt from the painful changes that everyone else is undergoing on the basis of possible strike action. The Armed Forces and the police can't strike and are being shafted by pension reform.

Also, having worked in local government and as someone who is likely to do so again, the profligacy and waste of these organisations is awe-inspiring! The issue of accountability has to be resolved as a matter of urgency although some initiatives have already been suggested, such as local authorities sharing their (vastly overpaid) chief executive officers.
 
#8
I hate to open up such a can of worms, but what system would you like to use for determining council tax?

These anti-Labour for the sake of it arguments are really starting to P1ss me off.

Don't bring problems, bring solutions.
 
#9
StabTiffy2B said:
I hate to open up such a can of worms, but what system would you like to use for determining council tax?

These anti-Labour for the sake of it arguments are really starting to P1ss me off.

Don't bring problems, bring solutions.
How about a pay as you go effort?

If the bin men turn up and get the rubbish in the truck without spilling on my garden and then leaving - then I will pay them

If I use the police/ambulance/fire service - then I will pay them (if they turn up)

Tell me if there is somethign else council tax covers - cos on my £1000 a year bill its says thats all mine covers - for shoddy services that I rarely use.
 
#10
Bring back a modified version of the community charge based on zoning, with a comprehensive rebate system. Residents pay for the services they use based on the overall uptake in their zone of use, and those on low incomes and pensioners pay a lesser amount.

There is no point in charging people on the basis of the value of their home as they cannot liquidate that capital without disposing of it! Having a zoning principle would ensure that those living in an area with access to more services pay more than those with fewer services. Cutting the contributions (or making exemptions) for those on low incomes takes account of the ability to pay and the redistribution principle.
 
#11
StabTiffy2B said:
I hate to open up such a can of worms, but what system would you like to use for determining council tax?

These anti-Labour for the sake of it arguments are really starting to P1ss me off.

Don't bring problems, bring solutions.
Erm - what's wrong with the existing system? Yes, it has its faults but the "revaluation" is a red herring as everyone's home has increased in price. But it's not supposed to be a tax on the price of your home, just a charge towards the cost of provision of local services. They just happened to apportion it on the basis of property price as a bit of a lazy, loose way to link it to wealth - seeing as no-one could hack the poll tax, which was - hold on a minute - a charge per person, so sort of linked to use of services... :?

Everyone's home has gone up in price - so why do we all need to be revalued, and more to the point why do we need to pay more for services that in general do not show a proportionate amount of improvement?

..So you don't have your bins emptied? use open spaces? or let some fcuker build a 90 ft wooden c0ck next to your house
erm, yeah - but I'm not producing loads more rubbish or going to the park a whole lot more than I did last year! And I don't quite understandhow my increased house price might make me do so either...
 
#12
I saw some woman in wales compaling that here council tax had gone up to £1064.

Mine's already at £1120!

We've got roads round here that they started resurfaceing 5 years ago, and still havent finnished. There's some roads and paths that need resurfacing. and they're talking about cutting bin collections down to once every two weeks.

Then the council go blow £10,000 on a CD for the Pikies.

Yes I will have some chesse with this whine!

Soloutions: thinking about it, the Libdems idea is probaly the fairest. of course when you get an area with lots of low paid workers then you're in trouble.
 
#13
How about a pay as you go effort?

If the bin men turn up and get the rubbish in the truck without spilling on my garden and then leaving - then I will pay them

If I use the police/ambulance/fire service - then I will pay them (if they turn up)

Tell me if there is somethign else council tax covers - cos on my £1000 a year bill its says thats all mine covers - for shoddy services that I rarely use.
Sounds like a middle class rant to me!
 
#14
I'd suggest some of you sit down before you fall down. Must be dizzy from all that spin :D

If you seriously think that a revaluation is linked exclusively to local government pensions think again. Yes there will be an increase in revenue to local authorities through a revaluation process.

There will then be a massive cut in central government support for local governement. Its one way our Gordon can rob peter to pay paul and help balance his books.
 
#15
Lets take a moment of clarity here.

Council Tax covers more than Bin men & emergency services. The roads we all drive on for example. More than that it covers war memorials. Something which all Arrsers should appreciate and not B1tch about.

Unfortunatly, the Lib Dem version is sh1t. A household with a joint income above 40K a year (a lot of people me thinks) will be stuffed. Not exactly minted people either (I fall in that bracket).

So we are left with value of your house or number of people in the house (ie Poll tax) and we know how unpopular that is.

I'm going back a few posts but stealth taxes? Hardly. It's been around for years and evryone knows about it. Not very stealthy
 
#16
When I moved last year the house I moved into was re-valued. Because the last owner had the 'temerity' to build an extension it went up a band from D to E, consequently I am paying out nearly £500 a year more for exactly the same services! :evil:

I can see why they need to revalue on a regular basis, trying to equate everything to what people THINK it was worth in 1991 is crazy and is causing us lots of arguements appealling against this.

Local income tax - how does this get assessed, gathered and enforced without increasing the number of bureaucrats even further. Also, what if you've got kids of working age living in the house, or you're a working couple on a reasonable wage each, chances are you'll pay more. This aspect of it will get worse over the years if the problems continue for first-time buyers or with a continuing shortage of HA / council accomodation because more children will stay at home with their parents for longer.

Why should wages affect the amount paid to the council? Do I use more street lighting, or need the police or ambulance more because I earn more? Do I need more libraries, or make more rubbish?

Bring back the poll-tax, it was the most sensible thing because simply living in a particular area means that you use the council facilities (as in roads, lighting, police, ambulance, etc) in that area. Base the quantity paid on a street by street basis, so if you don't have lighting for instance, then you pay less.
 
#17
MikeMcc said:
Bring back the poll-tax, it was the most sensible thing because simply living in a particular area means that you use the council facilities (as in roads, lighting, police, ambulance, etc) in that area. Base the quantity paid on a street by street basis, so if you don't have lighting for instance, then you pay less.
3500 single soldiers living in catterick garrison paid the same rate of poll tax same as some fat tory MP.....Errm very fair system.
 
#18
Good idea Mike, but unfortunatly, the more divides you have the more admin effort is required and therefore the overhead of this is divided up by all payers. A case by case basis would be the worst of this.

The system we currently has works and requires little admin effort. Therefore it it likely that it will stay.
 
#19
"I hate to open up such a can of worms, but what system would you like to use for determining council tax?

These anti-Labour for the sake of it arguments are really starting to P1ss me off.

Don't bring problems, bring solutions."

Stabb if you don't like it don't read it, it is not that difficult.

Another question is why the cgarges for bin clearance and roads gone up so much in the last few years with no discernable change to service. Cold it be that the govt has removed funding but still raised taxes?!?

If I had all the answers I would have bought my own country and undertaken an imigration policy to keep people who used such silly phrases such as that out.
 
#20
Slimey my old boy,

It's called inflation. Also, how do you know that the service hasn't improved. For example, in my area we have posh new wheely bin things.

I was just pointing out that some arrse members like to jump in with anti this and anti that comments while offering no solution and not understanding the route of the problem. Don't talk politics if you know nothing about it, is all.
 

Similar threads


New Posts

Latest Threads

Top