Why Arnt Cold Injury Cases Disaplined Like Sun Burn Cases

#1
Why isnt the Army Disaplining Cold Injury Casualties, For years now everyone knows that Sunburn is self inflicted due to the lack of protection. So when a Soldier gets a Cold injury in a temperate climate like Germany, Surely this is also a lack of protection therefore subject to the same disaplinary action. But we seem to be awarding these casualties with a P7 Downgrade and a home only Holiday.
Is this fare?
 
#2
Its a bit touch and go with cold, with sun its very clear cut, UV rays etc. With cold you can be fully kitted out for the temperature and then it plumbets dramatically without warning or it goes far below met reports. However if it is blatantly obvious then it should be treated the same as sun, its an iffy one really
 
#3
My son got frostnip in both big toes in the Brecons whilst wearing Lowa boots and sealskin socks. What else would you have suggested, Willwallace?
 
#4
Oforf_Ucksake said:
Its a bit touch and go with cold, with sun its very clear cut, UV rays etc. With cold you can be fully kitted out for the temperature and then it plumbets dramatically without warning or it goes far below met reports. However if it is blatantly obvious then it should be treated the same as sun, its an iffy one really
I dont know if its an Iffy Injury or an iffy subject altogether as Im only aware of FNC,s suffering from it. But how can a soldier be excused all duties due to a cold injury but he can still walk down town in his dappers, jeans and latest fcuk top. Surely the kit we are issued will protect him more?
 
#6
I can see where you're coming from Will but when I was hauled up with my leg in plaster I still had my jeans and latest fcuk (alright it was Animal but hey :p) top on down the pub, wasnt allowed to do anything else except go and say hello to the QM to fill out fecking forms for him
 
#8
Cold injuries are very subjective and very much down to the individual. Anyone reporting with a cold injury will usually be subjected to a number of tests at the Institute of Naval Medicine in Pompy (Policy). They may be restricted from further duty in cold climates.

You can get a cold injury in any climate, its down to the individuals suseptability. Every year cases are reported from Brecons to SPTA. A lot of other factors are involved aswell, but to prove somone has got cold injury due to negligence would be very difficult to prove
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#9
Willwallace said:
Why isnt the Army Disaplining Cold Injury Casualties, For years now everyone knows that Sunburn is self inflicted due to the lack of protection. So when a Soldier gets a Cold injury in a temperate climate like Germany, Surely this is also a lack of protection therefore subject to the same disaplinary action. But we seem to be awarding these casualties with a P7 Downgrade and a home only Holiday.
Is this fare?

Why don't you get a life (and a dictionary) you whining tw*t.
 
#10
drain_sniffer said:
Cold injuries are very subjective and very much down to the individual. Anyone reporting with a cold injury will usually be subjected to a number of tests at the Institute of Naval Medicine in Pompy (Policy). They may be restricted from further duty in cold climates.

You can get a cold injury in any climate, its down to the individuals suseptability. Every year cases are reported from Brecons to SPTA. A lot of other factors are involved aswell, but to prove somone has got cold injury due to negligence would be very difficult to prove
Absolutely. Also once a person has suffered a cold injury they can become sensitised to further cold exposure. The mechanism is poorly understood but seems to involve changes to the vascular supply to the extremity. Heat injuries are acute problems but rarely have long term consequences (if you ignore increased risk of skin cancer)
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#11
drain_sniffer said:
Cold injuries are very subjective and very much down to the individual. Anyone reporting with a cold injury will usually be subjected to a number of tests at the Institute of Naval Medicine in Pompy (Policy). They may be restricted from further duty in cold climates.

You can get a cold injury in any climate, its down to the individuals suseptability. Every year cases are reported from Brecons to SPTA. A lot of other factors are involved aswell, but to prove somone has got cold injury due to negligence would be very difficult to prove
I could have done with a trip to Pompey on 87 when I developed Chilblains in an OP during a freak april snowstorm in Co Tyrone. I could hardly walk but luckily the Boss decided to give me watchkeeper duties for a few weeks. The issue boots and socks dont help if you are one of two sharing a pallet in a drainage ditch 2 on 2 off for 5 days and unable to walk around!
 
#12
Speaking of which- does anyone have access to the regs with regard to sun injury?

Need to give a talk on heat illnesses in the near future, so would be useful to know the disciplinary procedures and consequences.

Thanks!
 
#13
Discipline for sun injury is largly a thing of the past. All info on heat/cold is in JSP 539. PM me if you need more info




Edited once because of the usual mongy reasons
 
#14
Factors affecting sunburn : Not covering up or using sunscreen (your fault)


Factors affecting cold injury: Temperature, lack of shelter, wind, wet, lack of food / water, workload, tiredness, clothing. (not always your fault)


Also, I wouldn't consider being downgraded to P7 an 'award'. Cold injuries can fcuk your whole career up, I'd rather be charged anyday.
I think you need to grow up mate, you don't seem to have much of a grip on reality. :roll:
 
#15
I will take care to ensure my spelling improves in the future, Didnt realise my old school teacher was in. For the silly fool who implied I should grow up, I take it you think it is OK for the army to go out and Buy 170 quid pair of boots for someone with a cold injury even though this will not improve the soldiers fit for duty status and will not prevent a recurance of a cold injury but is purely an attempt to prevent the army from been subjected to a 68000 pound legal bill. Which I might add recently happened, What the MO is trying todo is protect himself rather than act in the best interest of the Army the Unit or the Soldier. The knock on effect now is that many young soldiers seem to be suffering from cold injuries and are immediately reporting to there QMs and requesting lowe boots. HUM.
I hope I didnt make too many smelling mistakes this time.
 
#16
INVICTUS said:
Factors affecting sunburn : Not covering up or using sunscreen (your fault)


Factors affecting cold injury: Temperature, lack of shelter, wind, wet, lack of food / water, workload, tiredness, clothing. (not always your fault)

Fully agree with you there, sunburn itself is usually the fault of the victim/casualty.

Serious heat-stroke and most cold related injuries usually involve failings in the chain of command - failure to supply water, bad planning, failure to supply the right kit, poor management of stag lists, etc.

The initial question being asked shows a complete lack of understanding of these basic causes.

I hope you're not an NCO Willwallace, I'd hate to be one of your blokes. Why are you blaming the MO, responsibility for Thomas's health and welfare starts with his oppo and ends with his Charlie Oscar.
 
#18
Willwallace said:
ruby2shoes
the brekons are hardly a temperate climate in winter are they
Southern Germany and the Harz mountains aren’t exactly Barbados either! 8O
 
#19
Willwallace said:
I will take care to ensure my spelling improves in the future, Didnt realise my old school teacher was in. For the silly fool who implied I should grow up, I take it you think it is OK for the army to go out and Buy 170 quid pair of boots for someone with a cold injury even though this will not improve the soldiers fit for duty status and will not prevent a recurance of a cold injury but is purely an attempt to prevent the army from been subjected to a 68000 pound legal bill. Which I might add recently happened, What the MO is trying todo is protect himself rather than act in the best interest of the Army the Unit or the Soldier. The knock on effect now is that many young soldiers seem to be suffering from cold injuries and are immediately reporting to there QMs and requesting lowe boots. HUM.
I hope I didnt make too many smelling mistakes this time.
Would you prefer the MO boot the squaddie out for having a cold injury?
Its called Duty of Care you TiT!
 
#20
A guuy gets a cold injury and gets treated, al I can say is thank feck

I have harsh memories of a CO's ex that told training to the extreme, he was an ex Commando and wanted to prove a point on our first ex, and boy did he prove it, I estimate at least a third of the regiment went down with something or other, a lot of stress fractures and cold injuries. So many so that instead of the said CO re-evaluating his own ex he issued a warning to his med staff to stop medivacing people of the exercise.

The result ?

Some seriously fecked up soldiers, a mate of mine went sick and got fecked off. Straight after was due to attend a NCO leadership course and promptly broke his leg playing basketball, why ? He was suffering from a stress fracture from the exercise, playing the sport exagerated the injury.


Point is, it isn't covering arrse. its ensuring that the guys get the relevent treatment.

Oh and another point, I am pretty sure that not all heat injuries are considered self inflicted, its only sun burn in certain circumstances, please correct if wrong
 

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