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Why are some countries so much more corrupt than others?

rampant

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
The northern country's, Scandinavia, Viking heritage, no discernible invasions and total integration of other cultures that imposed their will, England, a collection of close knit country's that have existed un-tainted by foriegn invasion for nearly a thousand years,. Then we have the Americas, a vast influx of foriegn invaders, firstly the British In, great number, the local indigenous population harried and them all but killed off, and many century's of mass, on a colossal scale, immigration, predominantly at first from Ireland, and then central Europe. The common factor here is a clash of cultures, mind-sets and work ethics.

Africa, where do you start, the British, Germans, Portuguese, Dutch, Spanish etc, the common factor is a racial mix that has evolved a clan mentality, and such is inclined to favour their clansmen over all others, this is prevalent in the formation of organised crime, in all of the industrialised nations, including the middle and far east, and all powerful enough to influence politicians, bankers and the judiciary. Money talks, and controls.

Any 2nd or 3rd world country that has vast mineral resources lends its self to rampart corruption, its a paradox that the gold and diamond rich country's, of central Africa, have the biggest political and economic corruption, and some of the lowest standards of living on the planet.

Where there is wealth in vast quantities, and a piss poor grass roots economy, then the temptation to skim it off the top is dominant. Nigeria anyone.

Russia, as Churchill once said, " A riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma" vast gas and oil wealth,
coal and iron ore in abundance, and now with the fall of its totally controlling communist regime, Quick witted individuals have soaked up its riches, and have morphed from canny businessmen, into somewhat corrupt oligarch, but not all.

China. something of an unknown quantity, as we do hear of corrupt officials being executed and imprisoned, however, there must be vast legions of local area and remote state officials that are skimming it off the top. its human nature. The bigger the country, the bigger the temptation.

Conclusion:- There isn't one, and there is no definitive answer to why some country's are more corrupt, in politics, economic or law enforcement, only that that when opportunity's arise, there will always be individuals, and multi-nationals , that will spot the opening to make a fast buck, pound, yen, rouble, dong, riyal, rupee etc.

I await a more definitive answer, from the more knowledgeable, and vastly better educated than I, members of this august forum.

All of the above is pure conjecture, not to be taken seriously, or in any way belived.....TAXI!:p

Untainted by foreign invasion, I think the Dutch would like a word with you. And the Scots, and....
 
Not if you read the entire post.


I did. It deals mostly with your own experience in one department in a particular local authority area. Are you even in a position to estimate the level of corruption taking place throughout that particular local authority?

There are virtually limitless areas within the public service arena, private business and charities where the possibility of corruption is viable.

I don't see on what your estimate of the UK's position on a notional sliding scale of world corruption is based.
 
Countries become failed states when the cash runs out and the population have zero social capital..... We are a long way from that in the UK. Brexit for instance, is an example of democracy working, in that it changed a supposedly unchangeable policy and that resulted in the mining of some social capital, from a part of the populace.. If we ever return to the EU, that will create a similar mining effect on another part of the populace.

Corruption is the canary in the mine, for how much social capital exists within a nation. So a policeman who doesn't rob from his own citizens, but happy to steal from foreigners is a person conflicted and retaining some residual capital. Whereas a copper in South Africa who robs from citizenry of all colours and irrespective of nationality is without any social capital and likely as not would never risk his life either.

So to answer the question: Its all to do with social capital and how wealthy a country is to keep greasing the wheels.
 

Bob65

War Hero
So a policeman who doesn't rob from his own citizens, but happy to steal from foreigners is a person conflicted and retaining some residual capital. Whereas a copper in South Africa who robs from citizenry of all colours and irrespective of nationality is without any social capital and likely as not would never risk his life either.

No money appears to need to change hands for the Met to selectively apply the law, this is an entirely different sort of corruption we have here.
 
No money appears to need to change hands for the Met to selectively apply the law, this is an entirely different sort of corruption we have here.
Anything which reduces social capital is bad and the rule of law is undermined, when the law is not applied equally and so every time this sort of thing occurs, you get a little chip off the UK Social Capital.
 
Does nobody 'search' for anything anymore? Where's @jarrod248 when he's needed?
Countries_by_Corruption_Perceptions_Index_score_(2019).png
 
Possibly other countries go for the kick backs at a lower level. France, Spain, Italy, Portugal for example famous for the local mayor taking brown envelopes for planning permission or speeding up paperwork.
Other countries have honed it to a finer degree up in the higher echelons. We may not expect to give the local councillor a bung to get that extension paperwork cleared but we do get MPs (Keith Vaz anyone?) allegedly taking brown envelopes for pushing passport applications through and the many deals and loans by Peter Mandelson (who still went on to have a rather stellar career).

Minor royals (and some not so minor) getting caught in stings with people dressed in Arab clothes,
Contracts to companies with no public tender process seems to be a way many top MPs get their share prices pushed up. The expenses scandal wasn't exactly corruption, though. Just a way of getting duck houses and snickers bars paid for by the taxpayer.

Other countries perceive UK as being a privilege country, giving rewards for donating money to political parties in the shape of honours (something many PMs including Blair have used) or putting something forward in Parliament to benefit their companies. The House of Lords (the second largest legislative chamber in the world outside the PRC central committee) being particularly noted for receiving favours.

Even using the title "Lord" to get upgrades on flights is corruption of a sort.
 

Bob65

War Hero
Anything which reduces social capital is bad and the rule of law is undermined, when the law is not applied equally and so every time this sort of thing occurs, you get a little chip off the UK Social Capital.

If you want influence then you've got to take it from, or at least neutralise, those who currently have it. Middle-class neo-Marxist Entryists have successfully done the Church, the schools and universities and the Labour Party, now they are working on the police.
 
I did. It deals mostly with your own experience in one department in a particular local authority area. Are you even in a position to estimate the level of corruption taking place throughout that particular local authority?

There are virtually limitless areas within the public service arena, private business and charities where the possibility of corruption is viable.

I don't see on what your estimate of the UK's position on a notional sliding scale of world corruption is based.

Well like yourself, I’m entitled to my opinion.

I make no apologies for expressing them so tough shit son!
 
Perfectly acceptable for our Governments to have moral values, but that only works properly in business if every other country holds the same standards, the reality of life shows us that sometimes you need to get down in the dirt and fight for something of value that will benefit the country. The problem starts when the opposition party finds out about a secret backhander and uses it as a weapon against the incumbent party even though they would have done exactly the same thing. Sometimes 'ya just gotta stf up.'

Edit to add: Business deals are business deals, politicians that pocket cash (gifts) for their own greed are scumbags and should be prosecuted.
 
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Does nobody 'search' for anything anymore? Where's @jarrod248 when he's needed?
View attachment 511131

India only orange? The place is a byword for corruption. Buckshee (sp?) anyone.

We used to have a formal procedure for entering the country. The cabin manager would write off a bottle of scotch, stick it in a duty free bag and give it to the Captain. The Captain would then present himself and ship’s docs at immigration and forget to pick up “his” duty free placed at his feet.

A quick glance from the incorruptible immigration chap and stamp-stamp-stamp all over the paperwork, a nod and off we all toddled, minus a duty free bag.

Westland did for that and the dweebs from Corporate Governance got involved.

It now takes 3 hours to get a crew into the country.
 
Bottle of whisky, huh?
I took my first ever driving test in Cyprus back in 1969 (Good God, where did the time go?)
Driving instructor "leave a bottle of whisky on the back seat when you take your test".
Passed first go.
 

NSP

LE
Within the UK is there anything lower and more corrupt than a local authority planning officer...?
 

Bob65

War Hero
Bottle of whisky, huh?
I took my first ever driving test in Cyprus back in 1969 (Good God, where did the time go?)
Driving instructor "leave a bottle of whisky on the back seat when you take your test".
Passed first go.

In some cases it's not even about the cash value, it's just about demonstrating that you're a member of the club and you know the rules of the game. Nod's as good as a wink and all that.
 
If you want influence then you've got to take it from, or at least neutralise, those who currently have it. Middle-class neo-Marxist Entryists have successfully done the Church, the schools and universities and the Labour Party, now they are working on the police.
Surprising how many of them gravitate to jobs which tap Government/Charity of one description or another and our neo marxists remind me a little of Africa, where a state job is the goal for any aspiring middle class family and the payrolls of most africans states is massively inflated..

The evolution of what is defined as a Class enemy, is now anyone who believes in smaller government.
 
Bottle of whisky, huh?
I took my first ever driving test in Cyprus back in 1969 (Good God, where did the time go?)
Driving instructor "leave a bottle of whisky on the back seat when you take your test".
Passed first go.

I was there in 1976. I was told that if you wanted to pass a civvy driving test, you had to wear a short skirt and leave a bottle of scotch on the back seat of the car.

Did you have to buy a short skirt or did you already have one you could wear? :)
 
I was there in 1976. I was told that if you wanted to pass a civvy driving test, you had to wear a short skirt and leave a bottle of scotch on the back seat of the car.

Did you have to buy a short skirt or did you already have one you could wear? :)

I had to borrow one from the resident infantry battalion. Not much choice in colours, though, mainly various shades of green.
 
Within the UK is there anything lower and more corrupt than a local authority planning officer...?


Oh yes, in the west midlands, there were a husband and wife team of councillors, when not in council, it transpired, that they were swingers, and advertised their body's for threesomes, Etc for photo shoots, all this took place in the upstairs rooms, over the village café, they got exposed in a Sunday newspaper, and from a contacts magazine, but beacause it did not impeach, in any way, on their council duty's, they could not be dismissed, however beacause of the nation wide publicity, they both "Resigned"

They were by reputation, a pair of very un-savoury character's, and universally disliked in council chambers. They stood for two conservative wards. In a large village not a million miles away from Wolverhampton.
 
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Corruption exists in all countries. It’s just a question of scale.

The UK in terms of scale is at the lower end. I’d suggest halfway between the middle and the bottom of the scale.

I spent twenty years working for a local authority and while corruption was a minor problem, it did happen.

Some building control officers were definitely at it. The rewards for “helping out” ranged from a day out at the races or a weekend golfing to cash exchanging hands. Those at the lower levels of the ladder would cop a bit of secret overtime working on the tools for a contractor at weekends.

Since the early eighties, local authorities have been compelled to put certain activities up for tender for private companies to bid for the work. That means that each local authority had to set up an evaluation and monitoring element to decide who won the the work and then ensure that everything went ok for the duration of the contract. Although it could never be proven, some people did very nicely out of that and although it’s over twenty years since I was last there, I know it still goes on.

Then of course there’s planning. Corruption in planning takes place at the top of the hierarchy of local authorities with very senior officers and Councillors involved in influencing decisions in certain ways. A good example was a friend of mine who sat on a planning committee was offered an all expenses paid weekend trip to a hotel with numerous luxury amenities in Scotland for an in depth briefing on a planning application. He turned the offer down.

After I left the employment of the local authority, I set up a small building firm and sub contracted a few building jobs airside at Heathrow. I know for a fact that the people I subbed the work from spent most of their time entertaining various senior managers from lots of companies that operated airside. The first question asked when looking around was, “who’s the budget holder.”

I was on site once when someone In middle management from the company chatting to me mentioned that he was surprised at the amount of money they were paying for my services. I suggested if he found the senior guy who played a lot of golf, he would quickly suss out why my fee’s were so high. A few days later on site again, he told me he had made some confidential inquiries and there were two of them.

Looking at recent events with the coronavirus pandemic, there are various snippets of certain companies who appear to have links to either government officials including ministers or to advisors to the government being given in some instances, multi million pound contracts without any tendering process or indeed any process at all taking place to check these companies out. The work is simply handed over to them.

So it seems, corruption is alive and kicking in the UK.

Links with G4, and those who supply Government items, etc... it's really nothing new Serpico
 

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