Which Regiments used the Fox ARV?

#1
I am producing some artwork of the FV721 Fox ARV, the version fitted with the 30MM Rarden Turrets.

To go along side the artwork I am trying to piece together a bit of the history of the vehicle, I have the basics but I am trying to find out which regiments used this version of the Fox.

Can anyone help?

Many thanks

Richard
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#4
All 3 of the LI Bns based at Weeton Camp in the 1980's, starting with 2nd Bn, then 1st Bn and finally 3rd Bn. 1LI also had them in Buller Bks Munster in 82/83 during its airportable phase but these were withdrawn after the 1983 Op Banner tour as the Bn became a trial unit in 6 Airmobile.
The scaling was 8 vehicles per Bn all allocated to Recce pln although I rarely saw more than 3 working at a time.
 
#5
If you mean CVR(W), it was used by the recce platoons of 1LI and 1KOSB in the early 80s in Munster and Osnabruck respectively. Both battalions were non-mechanised and, IIRC, part of 5 Field Force.
 

AlienFTM

MIA
Book Reviewer
#7
The Fox CVR(W) was also used by a Squadron of the Tidworth Armd Recce Regt. (In 1976-77 this was A Sqn 15/19H.)

Never heard of a Fox ARV. I presume in you are saying ARV = Armoured Reconnaissance Vehicle? ARV is an Armoured Recovery Vehicle.

Fow was a Combat Vehicle Reconnaissance (Wheeled).
 
#8
As well as the RY and QOY the UOTC armoured units had a couple each. Northumbrian racked this up to six, I think it was, as the JUO's dad commanded the RAC training regiment at Catterick and signed over four spares, issued in lieu of Scimitars for gunnery training, that he had in a hanger.
 

Schaden

LE
Book Reviewer
#9
Was the Fox well liked when it was in use irl? - always used them in tabletop gameing ultra moderns circa 1985!!
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#10
We certainly liked them, a lot better than walking everywhere!
 
#11
RHG/D had a squadron of CVR(W) at Comberemere Barracks Windsor. They were not well liked; the REME repair shed was renamed the Fox Covert because they broke down so often and if you drove them fast round a corner they fell over!

It would be more interesting to hear about CVR (W) Vixen otherwise known as the "Fat Fox".
 
#12
Better than the Ferrets/Saladins that they replaced but with a filthy reputation for rolling if driven across a slope or cross country too fast: NUOTC lost at least one guy that way and when I visited an RY drill hall once I was almost blinded by several 'in memoriam' plaques from similar incidents.
They also broke down a lot although the mechanical engineering students in the troop claimed that with a little work you could get 80mph out of them on a good day!
 

AlienFTM

MIA
Book Reviewer
#13
Schaden said:
Was the Fox well liked when it was in use irl? - always used them in tabletop gameing ultra moderns circa 1985!!
You may wish to look at the www.hmvf.co.uk forums. There are some people there who own Foxes. I have learnt some interesting stuff about Fox servicing, which was a lot less straight-forward than CVR(T) servicing.

Our A Sqn got Fox primarily to learn to use the Rarden 30mm cannon. Fox was never intended for frontline service in BAOR, where close recce was provided by Scimitar.

Seeing our A Sqn in Fox, personally I felt happier in a Scorpion, but I can see why Fox crews liked them. What really put me off Fox was learning that one had rolled backwards end over end on the Plain just outside our barracks and killed a crewman. There were a lot of stories went round about Foxes rolling, but TBH, the armour was aluminium alloy and the turret was small in relation to the hull which contained three people, major assemblies etc and for me the maths don't add up.

By contrast the Mark 5 Ferret (remarkably similar shape but made of steel and mounting two Swingfire ATGMs in the turret) ought to my eye to have been less stable than the Fox. I did a couple of journeys on Mark 5 Ferrets, one the length of Northumberland on A-class roads between ranges and railhead and never once felt like we were anywhere near the Ferret's limits.
 
#15
They rolled one in front of the TV cameras at Bovy in 78 on an early edition of Top Gear pree Clarkson I think Raymond Baxter was the presentor
 
#16
I used to work with part of a Fox, if that helps!

 
#17
The North Irish Horse when an independant Sqn.
 
#18
As with so many problems the tendency for CVR(W) to roll was a lot more complex than it seems.

Whilst a some tipped over when being driven cross country I believe just as many did so when being driven on roads. At first sight it did seem to be that the centre of gravity was to high for the vehicle but on investigation it appeared that the largest contribution to their instability was the suspension.

Whilst doing my D&M Inst course in the early 80's we were given a lecture on the CVR(W) problem by a Maj from the 13/18H who was a bit of a boffin, into motor racing and an expert on suspension systems, he had been tasked to see if he could determine what the cause of the accidents were, and came up with a very plausible theory concerning the suspension. Lots of talk of understeer/oversteer changing when under breaking, requiring only a little sideways movement before tipping over if the driver braked to hard, can't remember the details as it was over 20 years ago. In effect the vehicles tripped themselves up.

Had great fun doing driver training on the CVR(W), used to take them around the Dorset lanes as far as Shaftesbury and into Bournemouth, stopping for a NAAFI break at a spot that overlooked the city where all the old dears were taken on their coach parties. Racing back down the A31 overtaking all sorts caused many a strange look.
 

JINGO

War Hero
Book Reviewer
#19
I used them as part of A Squadron RHG/D, we were the only Sqn so equipped, the rest had Scorpion. We liked them well enough within certain roles,we could move and redeploy very fast to meet airlanded threats etc by road or track. Cross country was another matter entirely, we did not trust them at all and they bogged in easily if you didnt keep an eye on things (as I found out at the back end of Imber).
The power steering was troublesome and you needed arms like Garth to drive it without. Servicing was interesting involving removing a lot of the hull floor,the lack of a turret basket meant internal stowage was poor.
Overall though not the worst wagon by far for what it was. I seem to recall coming across 1 Gloucesters Recce Plt using them but dont recall the year.
 
#20
Paymaster said:
It would be more interesting to hear about CVR (W) Vixen otherwise known as the "Fat Fox".
I think I read that only two were produced, and one of those is at Bovvy?
 
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