Where next...

Up to 5,000 more troops required in Iraq....


The Telegraph said the notes were marked "confidential" and recorded Mr Straw suggesting 5,000 more troops should be sent to Iraq to counter attacks on British and American troops and bomb blasts.

Wonder where there coming from.....or will tony start doing a magic show and pull out battalions from his top hat??

Oh that's right they're cutting the size of the Army :evil: :evil:
or mobilise formed ta tp's for telic 4, sqn's/coy's for telic 5, 6 etc, or is that just a rumour?
quiller said:
or mobilise formed ta tp's for telic 4, sqn's/coy's for telic 5, 6 etc, or is that just a rumour?
pox_dr said something similar about the medics telic for 5 or 6 being TA.


when there is no TA left , you will have the reservist left then :lol: after that the Cadets 8O
Wholesale call up of TA Infantry is next.

We're between a rock and a hard place here. We just don't want to admit that the seurity problem is getting worse, so we'll fudge and not say what we mean, until the brown envelopes arrive.

Jack Straw was interviewed at the UN , and said "No more british troops" At that point, I thoght "Best check me jabs"

The problem is the Americans won't agree to another countries head shed being in charge of their troops. So, all the other countries say "Fine" and that leaves us - again.

Meanwhile, the American civil adminstration, and the appointed joke of a Government , continue to dig themselves in, trying to preserve the contracts.

It's to late to bitch about what would have happened, if UNSCOM had been allowed to finish their job. Blair has dug us in deep with the cousins, so we'll always have to bat.

Christ on a bicycle, just agree to the UN request, and let's get more people involved, otherwise Iraq will be a 6 months on 6 months off posting for everyone, and that includes the TA.


trouble is what will happen, when we start scrapping the the bottom of the barrell and have no more TA men or reservist due to combat faitique 6 month on and off is fine, but these blokes have jobs in civvy street as well and you would need an accommodating employer to help things along , we don't seem to have the "patriotic duty ethos" the yanks employers have with regards to their National Guards etc
while I'm keeping quiet I served when I next go to sign on :)
Ah we have an employment Oppertunity for you Travel,Food work clothes all found Free suntan and camel spider thrown in :cry:
I'd also avoid any coins found in the bottom of your pint
there are thousands of kids in school, the Africans use them, why cant we???? :twisted: :twisted:
Unfortunately once we see the full mobilisation, as is being proposed, of the TA (it's coming soon to a TAC near you) for Telic or other duties to fill the gaps - the death warrent for the TA as it exists will be signed, sealed and delivered.

No employer in their right mind will take on anybody involved in the reserve forces and serious pressure will be put on those employees who are part of the TA now to quit.

Ultimately this is going to have serious effects on the recruitment and retention of soldiers in the TA. How many TA soldiers will relish 6-12 month tours?? How is this going to affect their families, civvie qualifications and promotion prospects??? How are units going to attract new recruits to fill the spaces left by guys being mobilised or leaving, especially as there is little or no evidence of recruiting campaigns having a real or partial impact or presence in the media.

From personal experience I can remember a number of soldiers coming in on a Tuesday night to inform everybody that they were leaving - when pressed it turned out at their annual reviews they had been given the choice - the TA or their jobs, as it was felt that the TA compromised their ability to do their jobs. The TA didn't and doesn't pay the mortgage for most members of the TA or feed them so they were leaving - though they were visibly upset at having to do so.

There has been little to nothing done to reassure employers or employees about how mobilisation affects them - Arrse is probably the best resource that they can find at present. It is not helped by Co's of TA units saying yes to everything - without thinking through the consequences - getting a full strength TA infantry company out of a TA inf Battalion will be an interesting exercise - especially as most are understrength in the first place.

God what a mess we are in :evil: :evil: :evil:

and the worst bit is that I can see no simple way out of it.........
SABRE, which is supposed to be the supporting organisation for reservists and employers, seem to be very quiet/inactive at the moment.


PartTimePongo said:
Wholesale call up of TA Infantry is next.
Hope you're not right PTP but nasty little nagging feeling says you might not be far off.

PartTimePongo said:
The problem is the Americans won't agree to another countries head shed being in charge of their troops. So, all the other countries say "Fine" and that leaves us - again.
Sounds worryingly familiar - not sure how we get out of this one - doesn't it remind you of kids in the playground - "it's my game and you can't play", only this time it's "I'm not playing this rough game if he is"

PartTimePongo said:
Christ on a bicycle, just agree to the UN request, and let's get more people involved, otherwise Iraq will be a 6 months on 6 months off posting for everyone, and that includes the TA.
(Faint bell rings in head) Sure there's something in RFA 1996 about only being able to be called out for X months in every Y months/years. I would go and look it up but I can't be arrsed at the mo.

Already starting to trawl for "interest level" at my Unit so we can really have "intelligent mobilisation" this time (ho ho). Anyone else been asked for their "level of deployment ability" on a scale of 1-10?
They( the Govt) are really taking the P*ss. I was talking this over with the wife last night.

I did Telic 1 happily. There was a genuine reason for our call up. There was a need for our skills and there was a fire strike on. So off we trooped to do our duty.

Now were back and getting our lives in order and we appear to be back where we were this time last year, waiting for call up notices.

We are all being put in an impossible position. We are not regulars, and should not be part of the routine tours plot. Families wont put up with it and neither will employers.

I dont mind doing my bit, but I object to doing every body else's.
Wholesale call up of the TA, supported by "War emergency" legislation , just after the new session of Parliament.

On the face of it, a call up of 5000 TA troops doesn't seem a huge number. The last time this almost happened I believe, was Kosovo. I think some of you know how close it was then

Employers would have regarded Kosovo differently. In common with our national trend to support the underdog against bullies and tyrants, the overwhelming sentiment of employers, would be "Go, come back safe"

I was working for a German employer at the time. His Brother was going in , when i said I might be, he said "Go with my blessing, don't get killed"
This time it's different.

Most of the UK is asking what exactly are we doing. America says "We need more troops, and the French and Germans aren't playing"

Jack Straw executes a 180 degree turn from last week, and starts talking about reinforcing with British troops, even while the local commanders are saying "We don't need any more" Great, another willy waving exercise by Tony Blair.

We don't need more troops. We need to bring unrelenting pressure on the United States, to start rebuilding , and to give us the material we need to sort out our zone of responsibility as well. Get the locals busy, and we'll remove the opportunist resistance, and possibly some of the harder line resistance as well.We'll then have enough troops to deal with Foreign agitators, and if we are seen to be rebuilding, the local Iraqis will weigh in against the people who would spoil it for them.

But of course, Bluppet would never ever criticise Shrub. Maybe he believes the happy smiley reports that Bremner is sending about the current situation? He must know its all bollox, surely?

Or has Ernst Stavros Rumsfeld arrived in country unannounced, to pat everyone on the back and tell them what a great job their doing?

But right now, the Iraqis are getting rock all , apart from a puppet government and a lot of hot air, and the longer this situation continues, the harder it will be for us to keep a grip on the place, no matter how many troops we put in the place.

Are the current level of attacks and disorder, the worst it will get? Or are they just waiting for cooler weather to up the tempo?

The US needs to bloody well listen to us, and start looking at doing things our way. Already, people are making comparisons with NI. That's all well and good, but at any one time in NI, at least you knew a chunk of the population was on your side.

Scary, I think the "So many mobilisations in a given time frame" will go out the window. We don't have enough troops.

Blair is probably working on his speech of justification now. Damn me, but when he was being questioned by the journalists yesterday, didn't he use the phrase "I absolutely believe" again? :evil:
its one thing calling up the TA for an emergancy or asking for volunteers
to do s types etc.
Op telic is less than a year old so I suppose its still an emergancy.
Come next year though theres hardly likely to be any TA left. The TA is the emercancy reserve its not there to Be drawn on everytime there is a problem.
Basically the MOd****ed up big time with options for change . who's going to want to join an organisation that is being cut back constantly ?
either spend more and make sure there is some slack or stop trying to be Georges Figleaf
Now Australia rules out more peacekeepers


CANBERRA, Australia (AP) -- Australia will not send peacekeepers to Iraq even if the U.N. Security Council supports a new multinational force to help U.S. troops there, Prime Minister John Howard has said.

A staunch U.S. ally, Howard defied public opinion earlier this year to send 2,000 troops to join the coalition assault on Baghdad. Once Washington declared the war over, Howard ordered most of them home.

Howard said Friday he had told U.S. President George W. Bush and British Prime Minister Tony Blair before war broke out that Australia would only be involved in Iraq during the conflict and not provide peacekeepers afterward.

"We are not going to send any more peacekeepers, no," Howard told Melbourne radio station 3AW. "I made that clear right at the beginning of this whole thing."

Facing increasing violence, a series of bombings and mounting troop casualties, the Bush administration on Wednesday offered the United Nations a bigger role in Iraq's security, political transition and reconstruction.

U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell has this week discussed a proposed U.N. Security Council resolution with European counterparts and U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan.

Some 800 Australian troops remain in Iraq on non-combat duties like patrolling the Gulf on a navy ship, searching for weapons of mass destruction and as air traffic controllers at Baghdad airport.

In July, Australia committed almost 2,000 troops to a peacekeeping force it led to restore order to the neighboring Pacific state of the Solomon Islands and has more than 1,000 still in East Timor

What the hell do the Aussies know, that we don't? Or is Australian domestic pressure making a difference?
I was in Australia when the bulk of their boys came home. There was a lot of extremely positive press associated with their return and a welcome home parade through the centre of the city that brought the place to a stand still. There was no talk of them maintaining a peacekeeping force, their spin on it was their forces had done their bit, the evil dictator was removed, boys home safely, now let the sand-dwellers get back to sorting out their own democracy...
Australia is more concerned with Islamic extremism on their door step (Indonesia and the Philipines + Timor spring to mind) and with sorting out the Solomon Island than they are with dealing with Iraq - they also have strong view about overstretch - i.e. don't ****ing do it.......also I think Howard got a hell of a fright from the strength of public opinion against the war in Iraq - if only Phoney Tony would listen or take heed.....

:evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil:
What's the betting that the price France exacts from the US for supporting a greater UN role will be billions of dollars worth of contracts for the rebuilding of Iraq - the same billions that had probably been promised to the UK for their support for the war.................

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