When Nazis marched through London

Discussion in 'Military History and Militaria' started by Oyibo, Nov 3, 2009.

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  1. I suppose 'Hattie Garlick' doesn't get out much if she thinks something that happened in 1936 terrifying.
  2. The soundtrack says it was a Coldstream Funeral Detail, not Grenadier.

    It's all a bit sensationalist, applying todays 'values' to something that happened in 1936. Yet even today, on State occasions, the flags of other nations are flown on The Mall.

    The point about the amount of people saluting is a bit misleading, too. It's the terrace of the Embassy. Of course the people there are Embassy officials or invited guests, to suggest otherwise is a bit daft.

    Cab drivers, don't you just love 'em.
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  3. Fair enough - credit where credit's due :p
  4. The Concentration/Extermination camps were running in I936 and the N.S.D.A.P. was one of the fastest growing Political Parties the world has ever seen.The whole Whermacht made Personal Oaths to Adolph Hitler and were already mobilising to bring death and destruction in order to enslave most of Europe.That Flag was their most potent symbol and yes still terrifies any one who remembers or has knowledge of what it once flew over.Please may we never forget that the British Union of Facists had 50,000 in the early 30's,and The Daily Mail was hailing Oswald Mosely (their Leader) as the coming man.Facism is insidious it calls out to people who fell powerless and disenfranchised from Authority,but somebody always pays for the Chosen few to feel in charge,usually in blood and tears.We must never forget or forgive the horror this flag represented.
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  5. There were no extermination camps in 1936 and at that time, the Concentration Camps were akin to Long Kesh, places where so-called criminals, political prisoners and "undesirables" were detained without trial. At that time, most were released back into German society once their term was served.

    In 1936, the NSDAP was a legitimate political movement, albeit based upon some very unpleasant policies but in 1936, Germany had not annexed the Sudetenland, swallowed-up the rest of Czechoslovakia or Annexed Austria.

    The Nuremberg Laws had been passed the year before but Anti-Semitism was very low key until 1937 (because of the Berlin Olympics), Kristallnacht had not taken place and very few signs of what the regime would do in the years ahead, were visible.

    Swearing an oath to Hitler as Head of State is not far removed from swearing an oath to the Queen (as Head of State).

    None of the things that the Nazis, or their armed forces did later is to be excused but applying hindsight (as well as material inaccuracies) is just wrong.
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  6. It is also wrong to forget .It is simply semantics to say that the detention camps were not yet the fully developed Concentration/Extermination centres they were to become,The intention to enslave or destroy the 'untermensch' was a core aspect of Nazi ideology from state education,Hitler Youth/B.D.M.through to Army political training.While initialy they attempted to simply rob,imprison and forcibly expel the' undesirables' when it became evident that this would not be expedient enough they soon found their solution to this.Anti Semitism didn't pop out of a box in1937.All Wehrmacht soldiers knew exactly what the Eagle and swastika badge on their uniform signified.The Army's willingness to not only accept this, but to incorporate it in their modus operandi was evident in their treatment of 'untermenshen' civilians and especially in their treatment of Soviet P.O.W.'s.As for the oath,many soldiers had made oath's to the state prior to the Nazi takeover.They all then took subsequent oath's to Adolph Hitler their 'Fuehrer' personally,and many were glad to.The most important point here I feel is to remember that many Germans were very willing party members and they really did see Hitler and the N.S.D.A.P. as their salvation.This was reflected in the admiration many felt all over Europe and America at the time.It was only when the reality of it's evil became unavoidable that people accepted how their hopes and loyalty had been perverted.The Germans were not intrinsically evil any more than any other people.The B.U.F. were becoming so popular that Laws were enacted in the U.K. specifically to undermine their progress.At times like these when the democratic system of government seems apathetic and useless,the siren call of Fascism is always at it's strongest.The most important reason to study history is to remember, and to learn from past mistakes in the hope of not repeating them.
  7. Pointing out inaccuracies is not semantics.
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  8. The resistance by the Wehrmacht to Hitlers regime was constant and sincere, to the point that officers of the Wehrmacht who needed to approach Hitler were required to be bodily searched by the Waffen-SS due to the numerous attempts that had been made by the officer corps to assassinate him.

    Anton Scmid, a sergeant in the Heer aided two hundred and fifty Jewish men, women and children to escape from the Vilnius ghetto and subsequently supplied them with forged passports so that they could escape the reach of the Holocaust.

    I am in no way claiming that the Wermacht was not guilty of supporting a monstrous regime, nor am I saying that members of that organization were innocent of having committed war crimes. What I am saying is that the issue is more complicated than the brutish interpretation of history that you present.

    I am not an expert on this period of history at all but the knowledge that I do have suggests that the reasons why the Wermacht followed the Nazi regime were there own, some noble some perhaps less so but not in the majority of cases a love of the Nazi ideology.

    If we are to remember then let us remember the whole of the thing so that the memory does not want for verisimilitude.
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  9. Believe it or not I do see your point!I am also however simply trying to say that the situation was one of general acceptance and that people were eventually misled.There were resistance cells throughout both Germany and Greater Germany and while the ones most in danger were the ones within the Wehrmacht,they were a tiny minority.In both my posts I indicate that the people involved in this were simply people but they were taken (deliberately) in by the Nazi's at first and then intimidated by the monster they helped to create.As the original post shows this was not only a German issue.You didn't have to love the Nazi's to let them win they simply took what they wanted by guile or force.That is the 'brutish' fact of that time,and the Wehrmact was they fist they used to smash any opposition.
  10. Yet this one represents just as great a blight on humanity but is pefectly fine
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  11. hotel_california

    hotel_california LE Book Reviewer

    It's unfortunate that while we all are knowledgeable of the horrors of the Nazi regime the Коммунистическая Партия Российской Федерации are still ignorant of the horrors of the Stalinist regime.
  12. Yes but isn't history always written by the victors.
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  13. Its not just Stalin though is it? Although he was the worst of a bad bunch
  14. hotel_california

    hotel_california LE Book Reviewer

    I can't expand on that.