What now for the EU ?

[Oyibo]

Standby for Shell to do the same...............(also dual listed).

It's that pesky Dutch dividend tax that causes the problem.........although the NL Gov't did offer to repeal it in order to retain Unilever.

Level playing field huh?

RD Shell would be a very interesting one - much of it delisting from the LSE in 2005 and then the whole shebang (or much of it) going back to the LSE.

Should be one to watch

 

[Richard Headicus]

Still, its Friday so fish n chips tonite!

Scallops here.

 

[Banker]

RD Shell would be a very interesting one - much of it delisting from the LSE in 2005 and then the whole shebang (or much of it) going back to the LSE.

Should be one to watch

For those interested in the NL Government using tax (aka "state aid") in such cases, read:

Tax avoidance or state aid? Shell and the Dutch tax authority

Shell and the Dutch tax authorities made a deal in 2004 regarding dividind tax. The Dutch treasury missed out on € 7.5 billion.

www.somo.nl

 

[Murphy_Slaw]

OK, the reality of it was this:

• 90 year old dual listing wasn't fit for purpose as it made the company slow to react given two sets of inconsistent governance rules (NL and UK);
• NL Government tried every trick in the book to "encourage" (tax bribes etc.) Unilever to delist in London and consolidate in NL;
• UK based institutional shareholders, who collectively control the company, said FOAD.....so a cunning plan to consolidate in London emerged;
• Vote was put to investors in the NL entity, and 99.4% voted to move to a sole London listing;
• Red faces all around the NL Government, and opposition parties are tabling a retrospective "exit tax" to prevent or punish the move;
• Sole UK HQ will have little practical imact on day-to-day operations, but will improve UK corporate tax take and company profitability (UK has lower corporate tax than NL).

The major impact is the timing and symbolism of Europe's 12th largest manufacturer electing to HQ in London rather than in NL. It also reinforces how money (in this case, the interests of UK based instituional investors (i.e. pension funds)) trumps politics in the corporate world.

I have said all along that the markets will decide. This looks (to my untrained eye) like a purely financial reason to stay with the LSE which Unilever think will be more beneficial in the long term.
Again to my untrained eye this would appear to be an endorsement for the pound against the Euro.

 

[Whey_Aye_Banzai]

An absurd notion... Truth cannot be plagiarised.

You're making stuff up again.

 

[Banker]

Again to my untrained eye this would appear to be an endorsement for the pound against the Euro.

It’s more that liquidity and WHT avoidance trumps NL state-aid bribes.

 

[Higgs_bosun]

The difference between a deal and no-deal scenario is actually small​

“Estimates from both official and independent institutions suggest that, even with a free trade agreement (FTA) that involves zero tariffs and zero quotas, Brexit will – over time – reduce UK GDP by around 5% compared to a scenario of continued EU membership.”

Even according to the UK government’s own analysis, the potential mitigating effect of new trade deals with non-EU trading partners is tiny – in the order of 0.2-0.3% at most, which does not even remotely offset the negative effects of Brexit.

Brexit from every rational perspective is bat sh-t crazy.

 

[Lardbeast]

Reported. For your own good as you are getting increasingly near to self harming as your wibble worsens.

You’ll thank me one day for being concerned about your wellbeing.

You just suck all the fun out of laughing at mongs, don't you...?

That said, watching Scrotum single handedly highlight the brain dead undemocratic fuckwittery of the remain camp is worth the slight inconvenience of allowing it to remain at large where it can scream at paving stones and soil itself for our amusement.

 

[Portree Kid]

I know it has been posted upthread.

The EU’s chief negotiator was reported to have told European ambassadors that as part of a free-trade deal he was preparing to offer the government between 15 per cent and 18 per cent of the fish quota caught at present in British waters.

F***ing deluded does not even begin to describe it.

The UK's response

The proposal, which was confirmed by British officials, has been dismissed by London amid concerns on both sides that compromise may be impossible to reach.

Michel Barnier’s offer on post-Brexit fishing rights ‘impossible for Britain to accept’

Michel Barnier was accused last night of making a “derisory” offer on post-Brexit fishing rights as tensions flared before a critical round of negotiations beginning in London today.The EU’s chief

www.thetimes.co.uk

Mr Barnier arrived in London last night and is expected to sit down with his opposite number, Lord Frost, today.

After coming out with such a ludicrous statement. I'm afraid that the only seat Barnier would be sitting on today would be the 1st flight back to Brussels.

 

[Portree Kid]

Debt - Did somebody mention debt

This is why Christine Lagarde was parachuted into the ECB.

Without some radical thinking, national bankruptcies will appear on the horizon, inevitably leading to fresh speculation on the euro itself breaking up.

ECB cannot ignore questions about debt forgiveness

European Central Bank officials are trying to tamp down talk of canceling government bonds it holds, but the sustainability of that debt is in doubt.

www.politico.eu

Who better to take the blame than someone who has already been found guilty of financial negligence

 

[PhotEx]

So two points to make on that:

1. The EU can't "restore" anything. The rights are ours, what they mean is please can they be granted 85-88% of their previous quota.

2. 100% of UK fishing rights was apparently worthless and a stupid battle according to some. Now apparently about 60% of UK fishing rights (85-88% of the 70% of the quota that the EU had) is worth a Free Trade Agreement.

while the fishing industry is ‘only’ worth a few hundred million to the U.K., that’s because EU rules decimated our huge fishing industry and wiped out our fishing fleets.

But to the EU, fishing in UK waters is a €2.3 Billion industry that supports 40,000 direct fishing jobs, a huge EU fishing fleet, and 400,000 indirect jobs.

 

[Scaley Albereto]

Quite informative. Outwardly fish seems to be an issue, but overall a miniscule amount in trade terms. Macron has backed himself into a corner over it. They seem to think Mutti will wade in shortly as although she has kept out of it so far her car industry far outweighs frogs fish access financially.

They also discuss military & intell & the EU's misreading of PMBJ

 

[bobthebuilder]

The EU will be seeing, at the low end, 30 million migrants a year by the end of this decade.

Africas population will double to 2.5 Billion by 2050, and the complacent, rich, prosperous Europe, lands of free benefits, is next door.

The Germans will have a solution. They’ve rehearsed it before. Now they’ll be able to scale it up.

 

[LeoRoverman]

Quite informative. Outwardly fish seems to be an issue, but overall a miniscule amount in trade terms. Macron has backed himself into a corner over it. They seem to think Mutti will wade in shortly as although she has kept out of it so far her car industry far outweighs frogs fish access financially.

They also discuss military & intell & the EU's misreading of PMBJ

Yes, I understand that the EU has already discounted Policing and intelligence Saying leaving would not affect those

 

[Scaley Albereto]

Yes, I understand that the EU has already discounted Policing and intelligence Saying leaving would not affect those

I think the argument these put forward is the French & the fact we (UK) now work quite well & closely with french intelligence. In terms of military the only two of note are UK & France.

As ever the problem does see to be France.....

 

[BetwixtandBetween]

Quite informative. Outwardly fish seems to be an issue, but overall a miniscule amount in trade terms. Macron has backed himself into a corner over it. They seem to think Mutti will wade in shortly as although she has kept out of it so far her car industry far outweighs frogs fish access financially.

They also discuss military & intell & the EU's misreading of PMBJ

The eu does seem guilty of a few miscalculations in the negotiations.

 

[Trackpen]

I think the argument these put forward is the French & the fact we (UK) now work quite well & closely with french intelligence. In terms of military the only two of note are UK & France.

As ever the problem does see to be France.....

For clarity, that last sentence should read ‘... seem to be the French Government ...’

 

[Portree Kid]

The eu does seem guilty of a few miscalculations in the negotiations.

After the May / Robbins capitulation act, it is hardly surprising the EU carried on in the same manner.

I'm now firmly in the WTO from the 01 Jan camp, and start negotiations from scratch.

No longer interested in who it might, or might not hurt financially, it is the only thing the EU will understand.

 

[Scaley Albereto]

After the May / Robbins capitulation act, it is hardly surprising the EU carried on in the same manner.

I'm now firmly in the WTO from the 01 Jan camp, and start negotiations from scratch.

No longer interested in who it might, or might not hurt financially, it is the only thing the EU will understand.

Just caught a brief tv news piece this morning whilst in a waiting room. Basically arguing the effect on GDP as a result of Covid means both sides are desperate for a deal arguing the Covid hit on top of a no deal hit would be catastrophic. Only caught that bit, not even sure which channel or who the bint was opinion this, although she sounded foreign....

As much as I would like WTO & a FAOD to the EU I suspect an 11th hour deal to be the outcome & as @Auld-Yin has mentioned there will be good & bad bits for both sides.

 

[Higgs_bosun]

You just suck all the fun out of laughing at mongs, don't you...?

That said, watching Scrotum single handedly highlight the brain dead undemocratic fuckwittery of the remain camp is worth the slight inconvenience of allowing it to remain at large where it can scream at paving stones and soil itself for our amusement.

It's ok mate...I'll not report you for sarcasm, insults, off topic ranting or a personal point of view. You know why? Because it makes absolutely no fekin difference at all... I doubt that Barnier or Boris will be looking in here to pick up a few tips.

We can scream hysterically all we want... but only I will get to say, I told you so.