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What now for the EU ?

The Warpac went from 7.62x39 to 5.45x39 I think you will find.
My bad.

As I said it was over 30 years ago & my interest was fleeting as ths chances of me being involved in such behaviour was minimal. Or put it another way, if I was involved we were so truly fcuked as to be past caring.....
 
Nope, absolutely not - indeed the political controversy about 5.56mm in the 1970s (when the decision was being made) was that it was too lethal.

Well, as fascinating as all this my gun is better than yours chatter is, perhaps it could wait till WWIII breaks out, another Remain claim that seems to have failed to materialise.

Duly noting the above post, I will wait until the remainer WWIII breaks out and will reply to your comment.

In the meantime, if you are able, research the School of Infantry ( Tactical Wing ) teachings circa 1984.
 
In the dim and distant past I had a book by mr Hogg on ballistics.
He stated that the Germans in the late C19 had worked out that a smaller calibre high velocity round cavitated in flesh inducing shock even in limb wounds. incapacitating the combatant and Possibly tieing up resources ( I take the point of the above post).
We had gone down a different route from the big slow energy transmitting martini Henry round to the faster 303 which in British colonial use was found initially to under certain circumstances to be less of a man stopper as it could if it missed a bone , go relatively straight through, leaving the assailant peeved but possibly still able to pull a trigger . We addressed this by not extending the copper jacket right to the tip after the Germans ,( principally ) ,objected to hollow nose ammunition, as they knew they had allready got a Workable incapacitating round In the small HV Mauser And saw a chance to hobble Britain’s firepower in long arms.
its a while ago but that was the Gist of it.
 
Yes . . . but, can we start a rumour that we will re-adopt pounds, shillings, and pence . . . and watch the remainiac, snowflakes, implode in a state of catatonic apaplexy(?) ;) !!
Really? Last time I was in UK at WH Smith I gave the girl £1.50 for a magazine that cost £1.37 and she still had to use the calculator to work out how much change to give me.

Just imagine the apaplexy (sic) it would have caused if she had to give change from 30 shillings for something that cost £1/7/5d.

The, currently, useless information that there are 8 half crowns in a pound might come back to its own.
 
Which is why it would be simpler and easier to lease an area of UK waters exclusively for EU trawlers - with a 20 mile DMZ around it - EU trawler strays through the DMZ and into UK waters the other side, it gets impounded. Charge each trawler a license fee to use UK waters and we make money out of it. It's cheaper and more cost effective than having to reinstate railway infrastructure.

We'd have to be careful about what areas are assigned to EU trawlers - they'd have to border EU waters. And we'd have to take fish migratory patterns into account - they don't stay into one place. We could put effective conservation measures into place and the EU could still impact on UK fish stocks by fishing their waters to extinction.

The main person making noises from the EU side is Marcon. His chances of re-election as French president are fading fast, so he has to appear aggressive in protecting the interests of the French trawler men. When he gets two fingers from BoJo, he'll say that he tried, but wasn't backed up by the EU.

Wordsmith
Seriously that isn't the issue. Most of the fish landed are dead consequently time is off the essence. Now if you are an exporter or supplying the internal market you need reefer or similar transport. The same is true of flower markets or other fresh vegetables. The paradox is that most go by air freight which is overnight freight and largely unaffected. It's the near market that might be the problem. Most of our fish is imported, not landed from central markets. I note that down our way they have started to refurb trawlers- you get the market right and and yer onto a winner. The Killer has been lack of infrastructure investment directly as a result of the way the markets work in the CFP.
 
Oh and before I forget. there is provision for rebated fuel ( red Diesel) for fisheries which means that fuel cost issues are not massive in the overall catch, what is - is maximising the profits of the catch. Fish prices in a sustainable fishing concept will rise as a result but not because of fuel of running costs alone. In terms of the machine bought for 300k E from Poland that will pay for itself in a matter of a year or so with reduced manpower requirements- a point that was made much earlier on in the debate. The machinery exists and has done for donkeys to reduce manpower requirements.
 
The only ramming that will occur will be between our Fisheries Protection ships and French fishing boats.

Said it before - High speed replicas of that German E-boat being restored in the UK. Deploy with cable cutters for the nets and fouling nets to run across the bows of foreign boats to snag the props.

Tow to British ports once disabled. Crew get the option to take to the boats and await rescue by their own lot, or face trial and possibly prison in the UK.
 
Really? Last time I was in UK at WH Smith I gave the girl £1.50 for a magazine that cost £1.37 and she still had to use the calculator to work out how much change to give me.

Just imagine the apaplexy (sic) it would have caused if she had to give change from 30 shillings for something that cost £1/7/5d.

The, currently, useless information that there are 8 half crowns in a pound might come back to its own.
that'd be 2/7
the apoplexy is caused by the fact that you only paid 1.50 for a girly magazine o_O
 
And that echo is still wrong.

The conversion from 7.62 to 5.56 was nothing to do with how many rounds could be carried.

A1 / A2 Ech ( whatever they are called nowadays ) resupply chain / pre-dumped cache's put paid to that notion.

The Doctrine changed in the early 80's from killing ( killing bad ) the enemy, to inflicting casualties ( casualties better in the public eye / supposedly degrades the enemies fighting ability ) on the enemy.

The ultra cynic in me says it was nothing more than a cost cutting effort ( which bit them severely on the ARRSE with the cost of ongoing SA 80 upgrades.

Also something to do with overloading the enemy casevac chain. Wounded bloke requires someone to hold his hand. Dead one can be frisked for ciggies, extra ammo and corned beef.
 
Really? Last time I was in UK at WH Smith I gave the girl £1.50 for a magazine that cost £1.37 and she still had to use the calculator to work out how much change to give me.

Just imagine the apaplexy (sic) it would have caused if she had to give change from 30 shillings for something that cost £1/7/5d.

The, currently, useless information that there are 8 half crowns in a pound might come back to its own.

Sounds like your common or garden graduate.
 
Nope, absolutely not - indeed the political controversy about 5.56mm in the 1970s (when the decision was being made) was that it was too lethal...

Your previous post on that point does come across as the anti Vietnam war mob seeking another stick with which to beat the USA. Not sure that's really the case re the lethality of 5.56.

I've carried both and prefer 7.62 for the effect it has on a target. The rifle we had for 5.56 was lighter and easier to maintain though, so a small plus, along with an extra magazine or two and less recoil.

TBQH, 7.62 was a bit of overkill for contacts made at less than 50m most of the time.
 

ancienturion

LE
Book Reviewer
Most of the fish landed are dead consequently time is off the essence.

Historically fishing for herring was done off the east coast of the UK following the fish as it moved from Scotland down to East Anglia. This gave rise to the British methods of using herring (kipper, bloater, buckling, soup, dried, etc.) because, as you say, time was of the essence with railways and large fishing ports taking part. Strangely the herring family is revered throughout the world being a shallow water fish.
Sorry but the concept of all this on the British economy was some of the only bits of Geography I remember from school. Perhaps it was the bit about fishwives which stuck.
 
Historically fishing for herring was done off the east coast of the UK following the fish as it moved from Scotland down to East Anglia. This gave rise to the British methods of using herring (kipper, bloater, buckling, soup, dried, etc.) because, as you say, time was of the essence with railways and large fishing ports taking part. Strangely the herring family is revered throughout the world being a shallow water fish.
Sorry but the concept of all this on the British economy was some of the only bits of Geography I remember from school. Perhaps it was the bit about fishwives which stuck.
EUropean fisheries tended to use Either drying with salt or pickeling As generic. Most catches of the summer being used for the winter months. Hence Rollmops or similar as delicacies. Once so treated they can be moved at leisure. Live fish or fresh were much More upper class .
 

ancienturion

LE
Book Reviewer
EUropean fisheries tended to use Either drying with salt or pickeling As generic. Most catches of the summer being used for the winter months. Hence Rollmops or similar as delicacies. Once so treated they can be moved at leisure. Live fish or fresh were much More upper class .

Yes I even remember all that, raw, and pickled being The Baltic/Scandinavia areas, while dried was more the prerogative of the Eastern world. However, with the accent on many more diverse species being caught relatively near the UK it will be interesting to see how much noise Spain makes regarding our fishing waters.
 
Seriously that isn't the issue. Most of the fish landed are dead consequently time is off the essence . . . .
EUropean fisheries tended to use Either drying with salt or pickeling As generic. Most catches of the summer being used for the winter months. Hence Rollmops or similar as delicacies. Once so treated they can be moved at leisure. Live fish or fresh were much More upper class .
Whilst working in Russia (Ukraine/Belorus) 1990-96, I would use a large supermarket, and often see large skips/tubs of LIVE fish been pushed through the supermarket towards the fish counter!!
 
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that'd be 2/7
the apoplexy is caused by the fact that you only paid 1.50 for a girly magazine o_O

Someone seems rather knowledgeable on the current cost of girly magazines. Do you have to buy your own now that you can't confiscate them?
 

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