What is Leadership

You are not ashamed you covered up gang rape? Jesus, what a **** you really are.
I think you're the only **** round here (although you've got very limited company).

I covered up nothing, helped the victim to get more than she asked for or expected, and reported it directly to the perpetrators' chain of command and the DA. However much I may have wanted to do more, not being responsible for the local police, judiciary or media I was unable to.

You really are proving to be the scum of the earth and a disgrace to the soldiers you should have been honoured to command, as I was, whatever their faults.
 
I think you're the only **** round here (although you've got very limited company).

I covered up nothing, helped the victim to get more than she asked for or expected, and reported it directly to the perpetrators' chain of command and the DA. However much I may have wanted to do more, not being responsible for the local police, judiciary or media I was unable to.

You really are proving to be the scum of the earth and a disgrace to the soldiers you should have been honoured to command, as I was, whatever their faults.
Hmmmm I'm pretty sure I've never protected gang rapists. Doubtless they'll do it again to some other poor girl. If only you had the courage to be stronger eh Jonnyboy?
 
It was neither about me nor up to me. Sorry, but your attitude just disgusts me. End of interest.
I'd go as far as saying those who cover up gang rapes are almost as bad as those committing them.
I guess your courage deserted you.
 
No, I’m looking at it from a strategic versus team leadership perspective, not a leadership versus management perspective.

Strategic leaders lead big, complex organisations. Their core function is to provide and enable a vision for the organisation, provide the means to execute that vision and enunciate it in a way that is persuasive at evety level in the organisation.

Team leaders lead people. They do the Adair’s trinity of team, task and individual. Strategic leaders have to do this too, for the small team, usually the board, that they lead.

I think most people on here are trained and experienced at the team leadership level. As followers they expect strategic leaders to behave like team leaders. Somewhere around I’ve got an article by Stan McChrystal which discusses how important it is for strategic leaders to educate / persuade their followers about what they do.

IMHO strategic leadership across the public sector is pretty dire. It’s patchy across industry too, but not a vacuum. For me, institutional hierarchies are the worst. Those who get to the top rarely have any real vision of what they will do when they get there and when they do they end up getting immersed in political minutiae.

I think Mackey and his ilk fail desperately as strategic leaders. There is no vision, just excuses. If Mackey and the other very senior leaders provided clear strategic leadership, no one would expect them to step in at the tactical level. They’d know and expect him to get to his HQ quickly to provide strategic leadership.
Bollocks. He was a police constable on site at the time of a terrorist attack. He is paid to protect the public. Whatever his other duties are, they are supplemental to that.
 

diverman

LE
Book Reviewer
Bollocks. He was a police constable on site at the time of a terrorist attack. He is paid to protect the public. Whatever his other duties are, they are supplemental to that.
Never stopped Bernie Hogan-Howe arresting scrotes. he is possibly the only one to have locked people up in every rank from constable to commissioner
 
Bollocks. He was a police constable on site at the time of a terrorist attack. He is paid to protect the public. Whatever his other duties are, they are supplemental to that.
Wrong. Commissioners are not Constables, they are Magistrates. There are fundamental differences between the governance of the Met and those police services headed by Chief Constables.
 
Wrong. Commissioners are not Constables, they are Magistrates. There are fundamental differences between the governance of the Met and those police services headed by Chief Constables.
This has appeared a few times in this thread. Commissioners were magistrates up until April 1974, following which they have all held the office of constable.
 
Never stopped Bernie Hogan-Howe arresting scrotes. he is possibly the only one to have locked people up in every rank from constable to commissioner
So did that make Hogan-Howe a good leader. And, if so, did being a good leader of the rank and file make him a good Commissioner.

IMHO he was a dire Commissioner, who failed miserably to reatore the confidence of the public in policing.

The Commissioner can be the best leader of men, physically brave, fantastic at developing the moral component of fighting power as @FORMER_FYRDMAN believes to be essential. But without the ability to secure the consensus of the people or the confidence and support of the governance organisations, namely London’s government and, uniquely for the Met, Parliament, he wouldn’t be a useless leader.

There’s much more to strategic leadership than leading those you command or who report to you.
 
Surely the Commisioner should be both. He or she needs to gain the confidence of the populace, but also inspire those they lead.
I guess that's why they get paid the big bucks.
Some of the stand out people I have worked for, military and police, have been both leaders and managers. I think that's why they stand out.
The difference between 'Follow me' and 'Follow me, I’m right behind you'
 
... come on, @F_F, you can't seriously expect @Bob to change now .....
John I started my contributions to this thread by stating that this was more nuanced than the coward outrage bus is willing to consider. It would have been very easy to jump on the bus rather than apply some critical thinking.

I too could argue a strong argument that Mackey failed catastrophically both as a man and as a leader because he locked the car doors and left. But equally I can see that there is an arguable case that doing so was exactly the right thing for him to do; his immediate priority was to provide leadership at Board level and to the people of London.

I’d suggest that setting an example to the rest of the service who weren’t involved wasn’t and should have been a priority. The moral component argument is fatuous.

I think he had a range of responsibilities ranging from getting stuck in as a Constable, through provide “leadership” to those on the ground to getting clear to take strategic command.

Ones view of which is right probably depends on one’s own experiences. I tend to the view that your strategic leaders need to lead strategically and get out of the weeds.. It isn’t right or wrong.
 
I would agree if it hadn't been happening right in front of him.
Had he been at NSY, heard that the attack was in progress, and made for the scene, then, while it would fit with a copper's instinct, he would be better placed to assume his strategic leadership role from where he was.
But.......it happened right in front of him........so the picture changes. 'I need to get away from here, and command this incident from somewhere else', sounds poor. Sounds like an excuse.
I acknowledge that I am not a strategic leader. But I am a human being. And a cop. I accept that going into harm's way is part of the job.
 
So did that make Hogan-Howe a good leader. And, if so, did being a good leader of the rank and file make him a good Commissioner.

IMHO he was a dire Commissioner, who failed miserably to reatore the confidence of the public in policing.

The Commissioner can be the best leader of men, physically brave, fantastic at developing the moral component of fighting power as @FORMER_FYRDMAN believes to be essential. But without the ability to secure the consensus of the people or the confidence and support of the governance organisations, namely London’s government and, uniquely for the Met, Parliament, he wouldn’t be a useless leader.

There’s much more to strategic leadership than leading those you command or who report to you.
I'm really struggling to understand why you're trying to separate things.

All these things are connected and a degree of competence across certain key dimensions is required for Mackey's role. There is no point in being able to influence key stakeholders if those responsible for your ability to deliver hold you in complete contempt. Further, no matter how good you are, your ability to influence anyone is hugely diminished if you can't carry your own organisation with you. Tony Blair is a case study in this.

Like it or not, policing has a physical dimension and, though it may not be a usual part of the day job, anyone wearing the uniform is expected to step into that space when required. Mackey was unlucky but he still had a duty to step up and he was rightly censored by his subordinates for not doing so.

If you want someone's 'fantastic brain', bring them in as a consultant, don't put them in a senior leadership position because, despite the politically correct lobby desperately wishing it were otherwise, the demands of leadership remain fundamentally the same as when the head of the Ugg tribe decided to conquer the cave of the Ogg tribe. If you can't give a lead, you can't be a leader.

Mackey's lucky. He gets to retire on a fat pension and live comfortably for the rest of his life; the head of the Ugg tribe got a one way trip to the Sun God if he failed. Our forefathers were much wiser about these things.
 
I would agree if it hadn't been happening right in front of him.
Had he been at NSY, heard that the attack was in progress, and made for the scene, then, while it would fit with a copper's instinct, he would be better placed to assume his strategic leadership role from where he was.
But.......it happened right in front of him........so the picture changes. 'I need to get away from here, and command this incident from somewhere else', sounds poor. Sounds like an excuse.
I acknowledge that I am not a strategic leader. But I am a human being. And a cop. I accept that going into harm's way is part of the job.
That’s the bit that colours my thinking too.

If we presume that he acted rationally, the most extreme interpretation of his actions is that he made a conscious, rational decision to head to NSY to take command. In doing he had the moral courage to accept the inevitable outrage and derision resulting from that action. I no more think he has time to make that kind of decision than had to decide to itnerovene.

I think he was a passenger who allowed events to overtake him. To some extent, I am sympathetic; he’d just come out of a grilling from MPs which would have required considerable emotional energy. He was situationally unaware and had seconds to react.

If he was a credible strategic leader, he’d have had some collateral. If he’dealt with his decision in a timely, open and honest manner he could have saved slme
Face. If he was / had done both, he’d probably get some sympathy.

He’s not a strategic leader; he’s an over promoted manager. He failed to manage the immediate consequences of his actions.

The worst thing perhaps is that he is serving until retirement, eking out a zombie existence where no one trusts him and he can’t contribute strategically to the future ; he’s irrelevant, a distraction who is consuming the credibility of his board colleagues. .
 

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