What has happened to the CDS?

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by John_Jorrocks, Sep 7, 2007.

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  1. General Dannatt has spoken out publicly as CGS.

    Have I missed the comments made by the CDS, the First Sea Lord and the Chief of the Air Staff or is it simply that over-stretch is an Army only problem?

    Am I alone in thinking their silence rather undermines the CGS or is it simply the way it has been reported, ie: they have said their piece?
  2. They are probably thinking that if they give Gen Dannatt enough rope...
  3. Just jealous of Jacko's current high profile.
  4. I'd really like to see the defence chiefs united on this, all come forward and say, "Hey, we agree - sort it."

    Is the Navy stretched, though? I suppose of all the services the Navy has an easy time of it (comparatively) right now. Except for the Royal Marines of course.
  5. Yeah, I'll tell that to my matelot mate, 1/4 of the way through a 12-monther in Afghanistan. He's not paddling around a boating lake either... :roll:
  6. I said I suppose. The news pretty much never mentions the Navy unless it refers to the Royal Marines. Also, I said comparitively. No need to go on the defensive, if the Navy is overstretched right now I'll accept it, no problem.

    So how is the Navy overstretched? (Honest question)
  7. The Revd Dannatt clearly feels that he has protection from above...
  8. Bouillabaisse

    Bouillabaisse LE Book Reviewer

    Trying to do the same number of directed tasks with fewer hulls and less money being spent on maintenance of the operational ones. Also the reason Dozy's matelot mate is in Iraq is a lot of dark blue guys are filling admin slots in sandy places to allow brown jobs to do the operational stuff. I know or know of a fair few RNR people doing 6 month stints.
    There's also the same sort of Catch 22 retention issue of more people leaving because of increased deployements meaning more deployements for those remaining meaning more leaving.

    The reason 1st Sea Lord isn't shouting about it like Dannett is partly because its less of a public issue (because people don't know what the Navy's up to) but mainly because he doesn't want to rock the boat whilst he's still after 2 new carriers. The Navy will do what they're told and be quiet until the first Navy JSF launches off the second carrier.
  9. Bouillabaisse, I thank you. I was genuinely unaware of the Navy being involved in any great depth in current Ops. I was aware of fleet reductions but same level of tasking though.
  10. From RAF top brass v recently, apparently the RAF Board line is not to engage with media and go public with many of the battles being fought on our behalf at MOD/govt level. IMHO I can only assume that the RAF support the tenet of the arguements raised by CGS, but are voicing the same concerns behind closed doors.

    I hope.

    Although I must admit to wishing that the problems/concerns we have were made public to try and leverage some support, this would however prob undermine the MOD - govt relationship.

  11. Re: leverage. I agree wholeheartedly. The only way to force the current administration into any kind of concession is if the Sun editorial backs it (which at the moment it fecking well should) and screams about it.

    Protesting behind closed doors has proved utterly useless. The MoD is not necessarily the friend of the unformed services.

    The Forces are being comrehensively outmanouvred by the politicians and mandarins and hence being squeezed. I don't like to think that CDS et al might lack the moral courage to speak out. I hope, as you suggest, they're quiet only because they hope to achieve more outside the public gaze but I'm becoming increasingly doubtful.

    Who remembers the Para brigade commader's pre-tour requirement appraisal? That disappeared and the kit didn't materialise. He got jumped on pretty quickly and forced to re-cant as well it seems. "Well, when I said I'd like an armoured battlegroup, I didn't really mean an armoured battlegroup as such, I meant I'd like some candy floss and a kiss-me-quick hat really"

    The conclusion I came to about the "Broken Army" question was the, frankly, if the Army will be broken, the govt doesn't really care. Its not considered a significant issue. A cynic might point out that the perception is that there were never many New Labour voters in the Forces anyway. The only thing the Govt runs scared of is a swing in public opinion.

    Can I still be charged if I'm only on RARO now?
  12. What is the point of speaking up ?

    The part-time prat will probably be dealing with haggis-gobbler business and the only things that get done are those directed by the haggis-gobbler in-chief 'Stalin' Brown.

    I'm not an expert but after nearly 40 years in, the RAF have always 'managed' the MoD better than the RN and us. I suspect it is because they are trained to do so from the Pilot Officer Prune stage.
  13. He's not filling an admin slot, though I know a couple of others who are in HQ roles, but they're on 6 month tours.
  14. 'the RAF have always 'managed' the MoD better than the RN and us. I suspect it is because they are trained to do so from the Pilot Officer Prune stage.'

    I always thought the RN had the PR and MoD management well squared away. Fair play to them.

    I suppose the reason they have had a bad deal of late is that their capital ships are exactly that - projects involving large amounts of capital. Although they do OK for subs. As for the RAF - everyone talks about Typhoon but thats the usual British wasteofspace scenario leading procurement.

    Fcuking hell its all politics anyway. In an ideal world we'd all get enough money, kit, hospitals etc allowing us to kick arrse in the manner to which we had become accustomed.
  15. In these thankfully enlightened times, no perjorative thought should be attached to anyone who wishes to indulge in such acts with rare Scottish wildlife.