Wearing uniform outside the ACF

Discussion in 'OTC and ACF' started by breechring, Jul 16, 2008.

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  1. Im postin this up again because this discussion becam e nothing but a slanging match between ACF AIs and Regs. Can we have a serious debate about this please.

    I think there is a important issue here and I think that the AIs need to know why Regs get so angry when they see ACF people dressed up in uniforms what they have not been issued and probably no right to wear. Now I dont think that anyone in the ACf would wear a medal to they werent entitiled to but what about the uniform?

    I think that these people in the photo are proud of their regimental affiliation but I still think that they are making the rest of us look less professional. We are a really responsible youth organisation which is based on the army We need the army to look at us and know that although were not regulars we are proud of what we do as we rely on them for a lot of things

    And so these people in these photo need to know why regulars get so angry when they see this sort of thing. But can we keep it clean and not name any names and can the mods remove any posts that are just slagging off.

    Over to the army then
  2. I have a feeling I will be in the minority, but I have absolutely no problem with ACF (or other cadet organisation) AIs wearing their uniforms in public with one or two provisos:

    1. They do not wear any badges, medals, etc to which they are not entitled.
    2. They do not pretend to be something they are not.
    3. They do not bring the uniform (and by association, their organisation and/or the armed forces) into disrepute.

    The more astute will have spotted that was actually three!
  3. It's the fact that these people devote a tiny percentage of their life to the ACF, and that is their sole contribution to the armed forces, yet they still think it acceptable to wear the uniform to be married in. My view is that you would have to be either a Regular, or a Territorial who has done an operational tour or gained significant experience to be married in uniform; class B commissions, warrant officers with no warrant, non-substantive ranks don't cut it. Put simply; if you aren't liable to be called to serve and die in that uniform, you shouldn't wear it for ceremonial occasions.
  4. BZ. Do you object then to the cadet bands and detachments that form the majority of Remembrance Day parades up and down the country, or are you being selective in the choice of occasions where the wearing of uniformby those not currently serving is acceptable ?

    Flash. BBQ hog roast? You are being a bit uncharitable! Maybe a spit-roast though.....
  5. Remembrance Day: cadets present; official activity sponsored by cadet force. Best mate's wedding: private event; no military involvement.

    Ask yourself; does the ACF's liability insurance cover me at this time? If not, no uniform. Your job ends when the cadets go home.
  6. Surely cadets wearing uniform for things such as rememberance day would not be outside the ACF as they would be there with the ACF. You really should think about what you type before trying to start and argument with someone.
  7. I'm not trying to start an argument, but seeking clarification.

    Thankyou for the mini-lecture, by the way.
  8. BZ is right here. Regulars and TA are SERVING MEMBERS of the Forces and as such, entitled to wear uniform at the discretion of the CO.

    ACF members are not on active service and should only be wearing uniform at officail ACF functions and parades.

    It gets people's backs up because a large number of ACF instructors have never served with the cap badge they are wearing and should not be acting as if they have. If they are ex-serving members and retain regimental identity (and the CO says yes) then no problems.

    If you want to find out how passionate people are about this, read the thread on Walts (because that is what it can amount to)
  9. I'm sad to say that i come from this acf sector and i gotta just say i'm ashamd.
    I was a cadet til about 3 years ago and i used to look up to sum of these blokes mainly cos i didnt know any better. now i can see wot there really like now im an instructor. 3 of them changed capbadge recentlty so thay could strut about as colstream guards and bought to uniform to go with it. the bloke in the red tunic even bought mess kit even though his already had 2 from previous capbadges.
    what i would just like to say is please dont paint us all like this most of us know we're not in the army and are just youth leaders. we're not all walts.
    • Like Like x 1
  10. As I said in the first time i know these people and i wouldn't mind if they were good but sadly theyre training was apauling. They tried to train me on weapon handling drills and the bloke in the red tunic was bordering on being completly dangerous he also gets very lary when he gets a drink in him

    I suppose it is easier to deal with them being posers if they knew what they are doing but they dont.

    the tall officer in coldstream rig is reknowned for being someone who blame others for his cockups. everyone loved the nickname General Melshit and now everyone calls him that or his old nickname Billy liar!!

    I dont think he can take a joke through

    can i say again that we get back to what i asked at first. what is it about ACF pople wearing uniforms swords bearskins and all that that makes regs cross . I now it makes me think they are embarrassing but why do regular soldiers hate it so much?

    this will be a big issue in the mess this year and these pople need to know what regulars think of them. Im happy to tell them how stupid they look
    • Show again braincell Show again braincell x 1
  11. I went to a fueneral a few years back of a TA colonel with many years of "proper TA" experience and who spent the last decade or so of his life running a cadet contingent. The cadets and adult staff formed a (uniformed) guard of honour.

    I suppose it was an "unofficial" event, but it was entirely appropriate in my opinion.
  12. I posted the original question about wearing uniform to weddings in the ACF, and I am please that despite it attracting a lot of attention in 24 hours the post was removed as the thread had slipped in to major ACF banging.

    I think the question is still relevant, and I acknowledge the attempt by many people who posted who tried to keep the thread sensible.

    I am an ex-regular, who served 10 years, I did my bit and I am rightly proud of my achievements since leaving.

    I am also proud to be an adult instructor in the ACF.

    Sadly we are like many youth organisations underfunded, understaffed, and dare I say we have a number of "walts" who do not appreciate the effect that their actions have on the organisation.

    I am keen to wear the uniform of my unit, my regiment and my cadet unit. I also own No 1 dress, No 2 Dress, Mess Dress and several sorts of webbing, assault vest, and C95. Not one item has been issued; all are funded by my job and cadets.

    I wear the uniform most appropriate to the event, not to show off but to ensure that I represent the unit in the most positive way.

    I ensure my cadet unit gets access when we can to No 2's, grey coats and No 1 dress, if that dress is appropriate.

    I wear my cap badge and qualification badges with pride, and when asked what a badge means or how did I get the badge I explain.

    I encourage the cadets to show an interest in their regiment (cap badge) and positively portray the Army and TA.

    I would never where my uniform to a wedding, but I would where my uniform if appropriate to my son's passing out parade.

    I encourage all of you to show some support to the ACF, particularly in the times of knife crime, urban poverty and general disregard for other people.

    I am concerned that at least three people in the photo do not parade at a unit of the cap badge who they violated when they donned the No 1 dress for the wedding, I am shocked at the general disregard for dress regulations with red sashes etc, I am concerned that the each stand in the photo with sword/sabre etc.

    Clearly in order to mastermind the event several military organisations have been approached for a loan of fat git or dwarf size uniforms.
  13. doesn't your second statement invalidate your first?
  14. SOME Cadet Force staff devote a tiny percentage of their life to their force and cadets, some, OK a tiny percentage of CFAVs, spend almost a third of their week on cadet matters. That said, officers and NCOs in my humble opinion should not throw on No.1 or No.2 dress for the sole purpose of looking good.

    Uniform in the cadet forces is there to show cadets who's in charge - are cadets at weddings? If it is two CFAVs marrying then a honour guard of cadets is appropriate, but not uniform for the groom and bridal party.

    Having said that, funerals of ex-cadets who fall in the service of their country or former officers of the Cadet Forces should be given the respect of Best Dress possible.
  15. Could be that 99% of cadet AIs I have come across look gash.Joe Public does not see them and think "Oh theres a cadet instructor" they think "Oh theres a soldier".

    It very often shows real servicemen/women in a bad light.

    Added to that thier job ends when the cadets leave, and they have no right or reason to wear uniform in private events.