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Water Wars

#1
Here is an interesting article from the BBC, arguing that a main driver for instability in the Middle East is chronic water shortages.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/8302161.stm

Water supplies are also critically short in other theatres, like Afghanistan, which then has knock on effects on the main economy (agriculture) and on hydro-electric power generation.
 
#2
HectortheInspector said:
Here is an interesting article from the BBC, arguing that a main driver for instability in the Middle East is chronic water shortages.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/8302161.stm

Water supplies are also critically short in other theatres, like Afghanistan, which then has knock on effects on the main economy (agriculture) and on hydro-electric power generation.
If we can't even get water management right in this country, what chance do other drier countries stand?

Litotes
 
#3
Surely this is where places like Scotland/Norway/Finland could actually cash in by laying a water pipe to these places and actually have a viable export.
 
#4
re-stilly said:
Surely this is where places like Scotland/Norway/Finland could actually cash in by laying a water pipe to these places and actually have a viable export.
That however requires foresight and investment, something our politicians have little understanding of!
 
#5
Not to sure how the Norwegians would take to that.

Norway having a superb Hydroelectric power system and wot with all the rain the consumer has been paying a lot less for their power.

Pipeline would only be effective if they were the size, diameter of the Libyans scheme "IMO" and that will cost a bob or two.

Oil rich states have gone for desalination in a big way and as it’s the oil poor with the problem who will be paying? The West?
 
#6
Mr_Deputy said:
There is no doubt that water will be a source of conflict in the future. Its a case of when and where it will happen.
Iraq and Turkey over the Tigris and Euphrates?

Berkshire and the People's Republic of London? :D

And those were on the tip of my tongue!

Litotes
 
#7
Don't see what the problem is with the countries that are located next to the seas, build desalination plants and then pipelines inland. End ex.
 
#8
Take Yemen for example a nation of approx 60Million men, all given an Ak47 at birth. A water situation that is going south very quickly. No real government to control the population. One border with Saudi...

What happens when there water runs out? I feel sorry for Saudi, they should in theory welcome the people of Yemen as they are the same religious sect. Unlikely... yes very, its more likely they will close up and end up having to attempt to control numbers crossing over.

Personally 60 Million armed men with little or nothing to loose, attempting to get into a nation that has it all is not what i call a good mix.
 
#9
johnboyzzz said:
Don't see what the problem is with the countries that are located next to the seas, build desalination plants and then pipelines inland. End ex.
Desalination makes sense for oil rich countries, because they have the fuel to burn to run the process. It's not very cost effective though, or everyone would be doing it.

The problem with water is that it is very, very bulky. And it leaks. And evaporates. Tankering and piping it around can be done, but in the quantities we are talking about, Mother Nature does the logistics far more efficiently with rivers. Until people started putting dams on them.

To give you some idea of the work required, here is what the Chinese are having to do- They are having to re-build their entire river system to try and stop the northern provinces drying up.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/8314447.stm
 
#10
Ha! When water kicks in as lacking people start getting nasty even in Europe. Over here there is a lot of talk about solidarity between communities on all levels. But once we get a couple of dry summers and there is talk of water restricitons, especially in the big cities, then all that goes to ratshite.
Previous summer there was talk of piping water to Barcelona from other parts of Catalonia and the fuss that was kicked up by those who had the water was incredible.
'Fcuk solidarity with the rest of Catalonia, that's our cloud juice and you can't have it even if we aren't using all of it.'
When it has been proposed to implement water movements from one province to another then it is even worse, next step would have been drawn knives.

Much of Catalonia is seriously beginning to think about Independence again, and there is a lot of solidarity about it. People can stick with one another over ideas or for mutual profit, but over water it's every bugger for himself.
This will be the cause of major problems as the world heats up and water becomes even more scare as a resource, those who control it will be forced to defend it or will use it as an increasingly important strategic/political weapon.

Screw North Sea Oil, the Jocks could be onto something better here.
 

rampant

LE
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#11
Walt_waltberg_walterton said:
Take Yemen for example a nation of approx 60Million men, all given an Ak47 at birth. A water situation that is going south very quickly. No real government to control the population. One border with Saudi...

What happens when there water runs out? I feel sorry for Saudi, they should in theory welcome the people of Yemen as they are the same religious sect. Unlikely... yes very, its more likely they will close up and end up having to attempt to control numbers crossing over.

Personally 60 Million armed men with little or nothing to loose, attempting to get into a nation that has it all is not what i call a good mix.
I think you'll find Yemen has a population less than 25million:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yemen
 
#12
Walt_waltberg_walterton said:
Take Yemen for example a nation of approx 60Million men, all given an Ak47 at birth. A water situation that is going south very quickly. No real government to control the population. One border with Saudi...

What happens when there water runs out? I feel sorry for Saudi, they should in theory welcome the people of Yemen as they are the same religious sect. Unlikely... yes very, its more likely they will close up and end up having to attempt to control numbers crossing over.

Personally 60 Million armed men with little or nothing to loose, attempting to get into a nation that has it all is not what i call a good mix.
A stupid person might suggest that the Saudi's might be able to see that problem coming, and then do without gold bath-taps for a while to sort out their neighbours' problems. An act of charity, and an opportunity to prevent an invasion of poor, angry people.
 
#13
re-stilly said:
Surely this is where places like Scotland/Norway/Finland could actually cash in by laying a water pipe to these places and actually have a viable export.
Thousands upon thousands of miles of pipes requiring hundreds of pumping stations at £X million each, running across tens of sovereign nations all requiring trade deals etc to even begin negotiating over the use of their soil...

Flawless plan :D
 
#14
angular said:
Walt_waltberg_walterton said:
Take Yemen for example a nation of approx 60Million men, all given an Ak47 at birth. A water situation that is going south very quickly. No real government to control the population. One border with Saudi...

What happens when there water runs out? I feel sorry for Saudi, they should in theory welcome the people of Yemen as they are the same religious sect. Unlikely... yes very, its more likely they will close up and end up having to attempt to control numbers crossing over.

Personally 60 Million armed men with little or nothing to loose, attempting to get into a nation that has it all is not what i call a good mix.
A stupid person might suggest that the Saudi's might be able to see that problem coming, and then do without gold bath-taps for a while to sort out their neighbours' problems. An act of charity, and an opportunity to prevent an invasion of poor, angry people.
They have seen it coming, but there response was different. Instead they have employed a number of other nations to start to monitor the situation there very closely! What will be the end result im far to low in the chain to predict.
 
#15
Jungelism said:
re-stilly said:
Surely this is where places like Scotland/Norway/Finland could actually cash in by laying a water pipe to these places and actually have a viable export.
Thousands upon thousands of miles of pipes requiring hundreds of pumping stations at £X million each, running across tens of sovereign nations all requiring trade deals etc to even begin negotiating over the use of their soil...

Flawless plan :D
Alternatively run them under the Sea to Gib, pumping station there to Malta??
from there they could be split to supply the countries required. Only need Malta's support, give them discounted or free no of Litres per annum would probably be OK
 
#16
re-stilly said:
Jungelism said:
re-stilly said:
Surely this is where places like Scotland/Norway/Finland could actually cash in by laying a water pipe to these places and actually have a viable export.
Thousands upon thousands of miles of pipes requiring hundreds of pumping stations at £X million each, running across tens of sovereign nations all requiring trade deals etc to even begin negotiating over the use of their soil...

Flawless plan :D
Alternatively run them under the Sea to Gib, pumping station there to Malta??
from there they could be split to supply the countries required. Only need Malta's support, give them discounted or free no of Litres per annum would probably be OK
I'm not quite sure you've realised how broke UK PLC is. We don't have the money to put pipe anywhere, especially not around continental Europe. As for other nations, the capital investment required would be astronomical. Definitely unfeasible.

Edited to add: have you forgotten the hosepipe bans of the '90s and early Noughties? We don't have a huge amount of water to give away ourselves.
 
#17
Jungelism said:
re-stilly said:
Jungelism said:
re-stilly said:
Surely this is where places like Scotland/Norway/Finland could actually cash in by laying a water pipe to these places and actually have a viable export.
Thousands upon thousands of miles of pipes requiring hundreds of pumping stations at £X million each, running across tens of sovereign nations all requiring trade deals etc to even begin negotiating over the use of their soil...

Flawless plan :D
Alternatively run them under the Sea to Gib, pumping station there to Malta??
from there they could be split to supply the countries required. Only need Malta's support, give them discounted or free no of Litres per annum would probably be OK
I'm not quite sure you've realised how broke UK PLC is. We don't have the money to put pipe anywhere, especially not around continental Europe. As for other nations, the capital investment required would be astronomical. Definitely unfeasible.

Edited to add: have you forgotten the hosepipe bans of the '90s and early Noughties? We don't have a huge amount of water to give away ourselves.
OK I accept defeat. but surely there must be water rich areas such as the Himalayas where water can be piped or extracted.
 
#18
Jungelism said:
re-stilly said:
Jungelism said:
re-stilly said:
Surely this is where places like Scotland/Norway/Finland could actually cash in by laying a water pipe to these places and actually have a viable export.
Thousands upon thousands of miles of pipes requiring hundreds of pumping stations at £X million each, running across tens of sovereign nations all requiring trade deals etc to even begin negotiating over the use of their soil...

Flawless plan :D
Alternatively run them under the Sea to Gib, pumping station there to Malta??
from there they could be split to supply the countries required. Only need Malta's support, give them discounted or free no of Litres per annum would probably be OK
I'm not quite sure you've realised how broke UK PLC is. We don't have the money to put pipe anywhere, especially not around continental Europe. As for other nations, the capital investment required would be astronomical. Definitely unfeasible.

Edited to add: have you forgotten the hosepipe bans of the '90s and early Noughties? We don't have a huge amount of water to give away ourselves.
We have loads up here, I am sure we could sell you some :)
 
#19
Thinking about it they already do this with gas and oil so why not water, surely can't be no more expensive than that. So I take back the defeat comment :)
 
#20
re-stilly said:
Thinking about it they already do this with gas and oil so why not water, surely can't be no more expensive than that. So I take back the defeat comment :)
Its not a battle, just a discussion! There's far more money involved with oil and gas, the people who really need water (massive generalisation) are in extremely poor "Global South" nations who simply can't afford the costs of putting in a multi-billion dollar pipeline. Everyone wants oil, and will pay through the nose to get it.
 

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