Warrior AFV in Afghanistan

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by gobbyidiot, Oct 17, 2007.

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  1. Did anyone read the reports at the weekend about the (supposed) massive detterent effect of Warriors in Afghanistan (apologies if someone has raised it). I think it was in the Scotsman. The gist of it was that with a Warrior standing in a visible position commanding the ground the Talibs didn't even approach having had bad experiences before.

    Now you'd think that a cannon shell just couldn't be as effective as something bigger with a decent amount of explosive, but here's a thought. I went to a massive firepower demo years ago and of all the stuff fired Rarden was the most frightening. Really, really vicious and accurate. Maybe the "high velocity finger of God" effect knocks the stuffing out of people even if the actual lethality is lower?
  2. On the MoD website as well, plus here:

  3. So, sensibly applied, armoured warfare works.
    Perhaps if a little less was spent on turning every fcuker into Reasonably Special Forces with pink-panther-alikes?
  4. Horses for courses, PE4. WR is excellent, WMIK is too. Having both options in your toybox makes sense. comparison of two different systems always is tricky.
  5. oldbaldy

    oldbaldy LE Moderator Good Egg (charities)
    1. Battlefield Tours

    Do you mean this:

  6. Last summer we had no means of escolation! apart from soft to hard hat. our Brigade Comd said he asked for it last year and was fobbed off, even though the Government stated that "no extra troops or equipment have been requested" about time top brass listened to the Tom on the ground.
  7. Like Themanwho said it's horses for courses, they're just going to have to be very careful in how they use them. The Soviets brought in large numbers of APCs/IFVs and tanks into Afghanistan and then proceeded to get lots of them shot up by the Mujahideen. Getting mobbed by RPGs, mines or IEDs are going to be a worry if they're used badly.
  8. Appologies, I was not advocating an either or scenario, just right tools for the job. IMHO the powers that be seem, to me anyway, to have been trying to do this on the cheap and while taking nothing whatsoever away from Paras & Marines and Non mech Inf, they were trying to do exactly what you thought I was saying vis armour, but with inf.
    <cliche alert>
    When push comes to shove, it's a fcukin' war innit?
    Therefore chaps need all types of asset on the ground. Nicht wahr?
  9. Have to agree the more options of different types of vehicles the better but as we learned in Iraq were not fighting against a mickey mouse outfit and its about time the suits listened to the blokes and commanders on the ground.

    Got to go quick a black 4x4 with 4 blokes in suits have just arrived outs........
  10. As has been said, horses for courses. WR has no chance in the Green Zone unless it has escorting foot borne inf. However in the overwatch role it is excellent - much like Mastiff. WMIK is much better close in due its increased mobility. VIKING also an excellent piece of kit.

    It seems Afghan is a theatre where everyone has a part to play and it is true All Arms battle field, where all our kit and personnel have an important part to play - perhaps we should all get high pay band!
  11. Oldbaldy - "Do you mean this" - thanks, I did.

    On the subject of the Soviet experience with AFV in Afghanistan, I know we aren't comparing like with like (USSR v Mujahidden, Allies v Talibs), but do you ever think that we all spent nearly fifty years cacking ourselves about the supposed awesome power of the Soviet Union, major exercises in Germany were all based on the idea of rolling retreat, when in fact they might have been rubbish and if they had ever attacked western Europe they might have got a hiding?

    Certainly the dire warnings about what would happen in Afghan haven't meant much so far. I can remember some ex-Soviet analyst a couple of years ago on the box saying that the one thing we mustn't do was put AFV's in Afghan. Well, maybe decent kit, skilfully deployed, with trained crew is a bit different from junk, full of conscripts, led by disenchanted cynics.
  12. But is that not...

    Oh, sorry - you mean it was the SOVS that were not trained and led by disenchanted cynics....