Warning over surveillance state

Here we go again, Brown and Co are having there bonfires pished on yet again.

Warning over 'surveillance state'

Electronic surveillance and collection of personal data are "pervasive" in British society and threaten to undermine democracy, peers have warned.

CCTV cameras and the DNA database were two examples of threats to privacy, the Lords constitution committee said.

It called for compensation for people subject to illegal surveillance.

The government said CCTV and DNA were "essential" to fight crime but campaign group Liberty said abuses of power mean "even the innocent have a lot to fear".


Civil liberties campaigners have warned about the [Full Story]

"There can be no justification for this gradual but incessant creep towards every detail about us being recorded and pored over by the state"

Lord Goodlad

"Over the past seven years we've been told 'nothing to hide, nothing to fear' but a stream of data bungles and abuses of power suggest that even the innocent have a lot to fear"

Shami Chakrabarti, Liberty
Scientia potenza ipso est. Knowledge itself is power, the Romans realised that 2000 years ago. The quote by the way was obtained from a book about the develpment of military int over the centuries. I think the title was the Puppetmasters. The bottom line is, the more you know about someone the more power you have over them.
lsquared said:
The K.G.B. did it, the 'Stasi' did it, why are we surprised?

2 organisations much admired by the communist Labour Party.A third one would be the Securitate.

Add to the CCTV surveillence and DNA database collecting the monitering and recording of everything citizens access on the internet and phone records kept by the state and you have the ingriedients of a truly sinister government keeping tabs on it's citizens.

Still,it's all in the name of the fight against terrorism.So that's all right,then.Not.
They plan to spend Billions on these Control Measures, but safety of the Data Aside, is their effectivness worth the cost?


TV Licensing - 'It's all in the database'.

TV licensing collate extensive information about every purchase of new Televisions in the UK. All is gathered from retailers of TV's and collated and scrutinised on a massive Database at the TV Licensing (agency).

So if they have all this information, and they also have all the information about exactly who has paid for a TV License and who has not; why do we have to put up with their adverts that are beamed into our living rooms threatening us that, 'It's all in the Database'..?

It kind of makes you wonder just how effective the 'Database' really is if they have to spend millions of pounds of TV Licence payers money to try to persude those that haven't paid, to pay !

If they know, as they proclaim to do, surely they should be banging on those doors and should be leaving the rest of us alone.

Another overfunded Public Sector 'Service' that lost it's way many years ago and has fought a yearly battle to justify is existance.
Read this book:



It tells you all you need to know! Britain (well, England and Wales technically as Scotland has a separate legal system) is a liberal democracy with a common law tradition. We have a tradition of rights and liberties in the UK dating back from Magna Carta including habeas corpus, the Bill of Rights and the Act of Settlement. We even fought a civil-religious war in the 17th century over the liberties underpinning these rights.

This tradition continued until the latter part of the 20th century. When ZaNu Labour were elected, they quickly went around dismantling this system (we have no written constitution). This was mainly motivated by the Marxist/Communist backgrounds of most frontbenchers, and the European social democratic tradition seen as the way ahead. European nations have a slightly different tradition and civil law system, going back to Roman times. This has transformed the relationship between the state and the individual and the balance has comprehensively shifted. Before 1997, there was a presumption that the liberties and rights of private individuals should not be interfered with unless there was a definite suspicion of wrongdoing.

Nowadays, every offence is arrestable, hundreds of different types of official can enter your home without a warrant, you can be arrested for expressing legitimate political opinions near Westminster and you can be detianed without charge for longer than in Zimbabwe.

The Damien Green arrest was a real wake-up call to democracy and a knee-jerk action of a desperate regime in its death throes. I am encouraged by the high profile of David Davis MP and I believe the Tories will work to restore the balance to our system of laws and rights.

There are further red lines ahead. In particular, ID cards and the intention of the government to store and share as much personal information they can get their hands on. I urge non co-operation and disobedience with regard to these proposals. I've got a certificate (from No 2 ID) that says I will refuse to register on the identity database or have an ID card, regardless of criminal sanctions. I'm keen to find out more about whatever technological s olutions there are to keep emails etc private through encryption. ID cards are scheduled for 2012, and as such, will hopefully be a mere footnote on the gravestone of Labour.

We may see increasing civil disobedience if the screw tightens further and the state seeks to take even more powers. That is the only way to reverse these iniquitous power-grabbing initiatives, mass protest and resistance. If enough people disobey the law, they can't all be arrested and prosecuted!

Apparently 16 February is "photograph a copper" day. This is because, if legislation going through Parliament is passed, you could be sent down for 10 years for taking photographs of people that may be of use to terrorists. I sympathise with the inspiration behind this campaign, but feel sorry for annoyed coppers who will be tempted to lock up photographers for whatever public order offences they can think of!
Our votes still count. We can still elect people who will say 'no' if only we do enough research about their backgrounds before we vote. They won't necessarily be all from the same party. We all have different philosophical views, but there are old labour, liberal and conservative MPs who all seem to have a good sense of right and wrong, just different approaches and theories about economics.

I think people who care about this stuff ought to give our long-serving parliamentary system a chance. It's kept things civilised and peaceful here for a very long time. But don't vote based on sort of tribal loyalties. Get to know your candidates and then pick. Make it clear to anybody canvassing on your doorstep that it's important to you to that you find the new culture of 'anti-terrorist' legislation being used to rifle through peaceful people's papers, or throw them out of party conferences, to be heavy-handed and un-British.

It can still be fixed the calm old-fashioned way, but it will require some work from all of us.
So, all of Brown & Co's efforts to Spy on the Law Abiding British Citizens is futile, as it appears to be taking the USA Spy networks to come up with the useful leads.

And as we are already the most Watched and Spied on nation on the planet, it must surely be an indication that the Government's claims that we need all this technology for our security is all a load of made up bollox.

So what's the real reason Mr Brown? Becasue as your so called environment Tsar is talking of Flight Rationing, and the talk of limited currency movements has already been drip fed into the media, there can be no other plausible answer than - 'Complete State Control of all subject.'

CIA warns Barack Obama that British terrorists are the biggest threat to the US
Barack Obama has been warned by the CIA that British Islamist extremists are the greatest threat to US homeland security. American spy chiefs have told the President that the CIA has launched a vast spying operation in the UK to prevent a repeat of the 9/11 attacks being launched from Britain.

They believe that a British-born Pakistani extremist entering the US under the visa waiver programme is the most likely source of another terrorist spectacular on American soil.

Intelligence briefings for Mr Obama have detailed a dramatic escalation in American espionage in Britain, where the CIA has recruited record numbers of informants in the Pakistani community to monitor the 2,000 terrorist suspects identified by MI5, the British security service. Daily Telegraph

"There is no doubt that a great deal of valuable intelligence vital to British national security is procured by American agents from British sources."

And not from ID Cards, Biometrics, Spy cameras or Data bases, but just good old fashioned Agent handlers applying the craft.
It seems that every day a new method for the Government to be able to spy on us is being created.

All in the name of 'Security'.

Spy centre will track you on holiday
The Sunday Times

THE government is building a secret database to track and hold the international travel records of all 60m Britons.

The intelligence centre will store names, addresses, telephone numbers, seat reservations, travel itineraries and credit card details for all 250m passenger movements in and out of the UK each year.

The computerised pattern of every individual’s travel history will be stored for up to 10 years, the Home Office admits.

The government says the new database, to be housed in an industrial estate in Wythenshawe, near Manchester, is essential in the fight against crime, illegal immigration and terrorism. However, opposition MPs, privacy campaigners and some government officials fear it is a significant step towards a total surveillance society. [Read More]
UK citizens' private information being lost at record rate

The Sunday Times

The personal information of UK citizens is being lost and stolen at an unprecedented rate, the UK’s privacy watchdog said today.

Nearly 100 data breaches were reported to the Information Commissioner’s Office (ICO) in the last three months alone, with millions of bank details, addresses, emails, private health information and employee salary statements lost or stolen in 2008.

Data breaches jumped by 36 per cent last year, the ICO said. Personal information is now lost - on average - more than once a day. [Read More]
Surveillance has destroyed practical policing. Not a lot of it is used as evidence, unless it is a straight forward violence scenario.

The proper tea leaf's cover up.


Book Reviewer
Once all the emails are gathered in you may comfortably assume that the keyword search will include golliwog, pikey, one-eyed etc. Then the illegals deportment centres, or whatever they are called, can be emptied onto the street and refilled with all those social undesirables who don't understand that Gordon Mugabe is the saviour of the world. See you in Haslar.
Posted this one as there is a Comments section available for all to add their two peneth.

The Government is creating a surveillance state
Daily Telegraph
Even in the name of countering crime, why should the state know everything about us?

The evidence is growing by the week that the Government is creating a surveillance state. It was confirmed yesterday that a database containing the international travel records of all citizens is being compiled; and Jacqui Smith, the Home Secretary, is drawing up plans to keep similar details of every phone call and email that is sent. In addition, the records of all children are to be held on a system called ContactPoint, a national ID database is currently being developed, all health records currently held by GPs will be centrally available and a database of DNA profiles, ostensibly for criminals, is being built by stealth. Meanwhile, the ubiquitous CCTV cameras in every public space make personal privacy increasingly hard to maintain. Even in the name of countering crime or combating terrorism, why should the state know where you are going, where you have been and whom you call while watching everyone's movements on camera? [Read More]


War Hero
Not wanting to fall foul of Jarrod, I thought it safer to resurrect this thread.


Leicestershire Police have been playing with Facial Recognition software for a while now, and it seems that they have been sufficiently impressed to purchase it. For those who can't be arrsed to read the article, other forces have visited while they have been trialling it and were similarly impressed, though it only has a 45% accuracy and needs a skilled operator to make it work at all. Somewhere I read that they are rolling the system out across the US. It appears to be in use in Chicago and last year their police made their first arrest using the system.

"Pierre Martin, 34, was arrested on May 2 and charged with armed robbery in connection with two incidents from earlier this year. During one of those events, a video camera owned by the Chicago Transit Authority (CTA) and wired to the city’s three detective branches and the Criminal Information Prevention Center at police headquarters was rolling when Martin allegedly encountered his victim. Months later, investigators were able to use the footage recorded using the CTA cameras and comb through a database of 4.5 million criminal booking shots in order to identify Martin as a person of interest. He is the first individual to be picked up by the CPD using the facial-recognition technology, but only one month after a city-wide roll-out he is likely to not be the last."

The extensive use of video by the Police at the London riots in 2011 shouldn't have surprised me (but did), and the introduction of facial recognition systems will make their job easier and faster in the future. Combine the large CCTV population in the UK (one camera per ten people) with facial recognition systems, and I'm guessing that automated policing will become a growing feature on our policing landscape, both on the roads, and on the street.

As part of this trend, the end of the Tax Disc is presumably based on DVLC's confidence that they have sufficient ANPR cameras in place to make it more efficient (and cheaper) to catch tax dodgers automatically, than to check discs physically.


War Hero
No I haven't got a tin-foil hat on . . . . but this was another interesting item I picked up on.


"Scotland Yard has been testing software designed to analyse social media, previous convictions and associates connected to known gang members to predict whether they might reoffend."

Cool tool. Expand it a little wider and we could have Minority Report. Surely though, GCHQ must have been playing with this sort of software for a while now.

"The analytics project is said to be the first of its kind to be used by police in the UK, although the Ministry of Justice already operates a system used to predict the likelihood of different types of released criminals reoffending."

Didn't know they did that. Not sure it's working very well if they do though.
Scientia potenza ipso est. Knowledge itself is power, the Romans realised that 2000 years ago. The quote by the way was obtained from a book about the develpment of military int over the centuries. I think the title was the Puppetmasters. The bottom line is, the more you know about someone the more power you have over them.

Even before the Romans rled the world Sun Tzu had a handle on the need for military intelligence.

Depending on the translation he wrote:

"Know your enemy as you would know yourself and you will win a hundred battles."