war on democracy

#1
Did any one see tonights progam ?. John Pilger certainly shed some uncomfortable light on the United States foreign policies in Latin America. From their backing of Pinochets coup in Peru to the attempted overthrow of Chavez in Venezuela in 2002. I was in Venezuela a few months ago and whilst Chavez has his opponents the majority of the people seem to support him.
 
#2
From their backing of Pinochets coup in Peru to the attempted overthrow of Chavez
Before anyone else says it - Pinochet's coup in Peru? Wasn't overthrowing one government enough for the man? :wink:

I always have a problem with Pilger in that I always have the feeling that Aubron Waugh (of all people) may have been close to the truth in inventing the verb 'to pilger', namely 'to present information in a sensationalist manner to reach a foregone conclusion'. Pilger does seem to get a trifle over-enthusiastic in some of material, and you do sometimes wonder (well, I do) about how careful he's been in his analysis.
 
#4
There is one safeguard known generally to the wise, which is an advantage and security to all, but especially to democracies as against despots. What is it?

Distrust.

Demosthenes
 
#5
We'll have to see how folks in Venezuela feel in 5 years, when they realize that Chavez now controls the media and voting, and that he's good buddies with Kim Jong Il (I'm not defending all of America's actions in the region, I'm just saying...)
 
#6
There's more to this story than is out in the general public. I'll just say this; Think AQ/HEzbollah in South America.


http://archives.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/americas/11/07/inv.terror.south/

Sources told CNN they believe the tri-border area is being used as a haven and source of funding for terrorists linked to Iran's Party of God and to organizations that work closely with Osama bin Laden.

In Ciudad del Este, on the Paraguayan side of the Parana River, the commercial district is a mosaic of businesses owned mostly by Arab merchants. International and regional intelligence sources said those businesses and a mosque in the city serve as a revolving door for Islamic extremists.
 
#8
Mr_Jones said:
Pilger is a bit of a tw*t and Chavez will prob turn out to be a demagogue etc etc

but there was a lot of evil stuff done during the cold war. By both sides.

Shouldn't pretend there wasn't imo.

edit: not having a pop at anyone btw. just saying
Well said.
 
#9
In-Limbo said:
There is one safeguard known generally to the wise, which is an advantage and security to all, but especially to democracies as against despots. What is it?

Distrust.

Demosthenes
Ooo thank you very much 'In Limbo'.
Who would credit such wisdom coming from a washing machine.
I saw one of those Demosthenes in Currys but the wife wanted the Zannussi so we got that instead.
 
#10
Got a friend who's a South American expert. He's a bit of a soft leftie, votes Lib Dem etc, and he says that Chavez is a classic facist thug.

Saw a bit of Pilger hoping to get an insight into the region, turned off when I realised he was up to his old trick of situating the appreciation.
 
#11
chavez may be far from perfect but he was voted it and won another election
which is more than the shaved chimp has managed :twisted:
so far people aren't disappearing in Venezuela and theres no terrorist/ rebel faction on the go.
amnesty gives Venezuela a fairly good report though they think Chavez is a proto tyrant in some ways better than our report .
if the answer to chavez is a coup your asking the wrong question though might be intresting looking into the motives of who'd want a coup its certainly not in the intrest of the majoirty :evil:
 

Biped

LE
Book Reviewer
#12
Well, AQ/Hezbollah in Venezuala, or naughty people just like them providing the septics with the reason for 'regime change'. Well, that's alright then. Just a good thing they've got no invisible WMD's isn't it!
 
#13
#14
brighton hippy said:
chavez may be far from perfect but he was voted it and won another election
which is more than the shaved chimp has managed :twisted:
so far people aren't disappearing in Venezuela and theres no terrorist/ rebel faction on the go.
amnesty gives Venezuela a fairly good report though they think Chavez is a proto tyrant in some ways better than our report .
if the answer to chavez is a coup your asking the wrong question though might be intresting looking into the motives of who'd want a coup its certainly not in the intrest of the majoirty :evil:
So was Saddam, the Ayatollah, and Hitler.
 

cpunk

LE
Moderator
#16
I wouldn't believe Pilger if he told me he was lying. The man has a reckless disregard for the truth which should, long ago, have stopped reputable broadcasters from commissioning work from him; unfortunately, memories are short.

Two friends of mine won a large amount in libel damages from Granada TV over a claim in a Pilger 'documentary' that they were involved in training the Khmer Rouge in laying AP mines. He had no evidence whatsoever to back this up: he just went ahead with it.

I watched some of his film last night: it was dire.
 
#19
Don't suppose he mentioned that Chavez was bankrolled by his former employer - a man with an insurance firm. That firm now has the contract for all government insurance.
 

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