Ventilators causing more harm than good.

Apparently when you have the Covid 19 - your lungs fill with fluid and that's why you have diffidently breathing. Now ventilators are designed for helping people breathe that have things like brain damage etc. However if the lungs are 'full of fluid' and are literally just 'air bags', forcing air into the lungs - pressurises the fluid in the lungs and forces it into the lungs walls - causing more damage.

Can anyone that's a doctor, or medical expert confirm? I don't want some ned type binman giving his opinion - only those with actual medical knowledge should respond.

Cheers.
Deep suction via the ET tube, 30 degree incline at head of bed, and ability to utilize a myriad of vent settings, combined with enthusiastic chest physio.
Plus try it without a vent, then see how difficult it is.

In light of the general tone of response....

Tits, bollox, ****.
 

Slime

LE
Having corona virus is more useful for a thread like this, I was told that my lungs now look like they are filled with popcorn due to the virus.

So I’ve already popcorn and can sit back and enjoy the thread :)
 
Apparently when you have the Covid 19 - your lungs fill with fluid and that's why you have diffidently breathing. Now ventilators are designed for helping people breathe that have things like brain damage etc. However if the lungs are 'full of fluid' and are literally just 'air bags', forcing air into the lungs - pressurises the fluid in the lungs and forces it into the lungs walls - causing more damage.

Can anyone that's a doctor, or medical expert confirm? I don't want some ned type binman giving his opinion - only those with actual medical knowledge should respond.

Cheers.
I think you may be confusing the word "ventilator" with the words "lilo foot pump" there, doctor.
 
Last edited:
Maybe they should dangle patients up on meathooks to drain their lungs?

Bob Hoskins is your man

This is on my viewing list for Friday , along with The life of Brian .
You may all have forgotten , but it's the Easter bank holiday next week end .
 
This is on my viewing list for Friday , along with The life of Brian .
You may all have forgotten , but it's the Easter bank holiday next week end .

Great film, I lived in the Docks when it was made.
East India had just shut, and I'd moved down river to digs in the Royal Docks.
Ah memories of my yoof.
 

DAS

War Hero
Apparently when you have the Covid 19 - your lungs fill with fluid and that's why you have diffidently breathing. Now ventilators are designed for helping people breathe that have things like brain damage etc. However if the lungs are 'full of fluid' and are literally just 'air bags', forcing air into the lungs - pressurises the fluid in the lungs and forces it into the lungs walls - causing more damage.

Can anyone that's a doctor, or medical expert confirm? I don't want some ned type binman giving his opinion - only those with actual medical knowledge should respond.

Cheers.
This is so much bollocks that it's a whole new level of utter internet bollocks.
Ventilators are designed to help people breathe when either they can't themselves or their ability to do so is impaired.
Your lungs are not full of fluid because if they were you would be dead. The fluid impairs gas exchange. The last thing a ventilator will do is damage / burst if you will, a lung. There are a bunch of electronic safety built in with mechanical backup to prevent over pressure.

It might be a good idea if you did a little research - not the mail/sun/mirror/telegraph before talking utter bollocks.
 

mercurydancer

LE
Book Reviewer
I'm a trained nurse so have a very informed view. Most people who have had a general anaesthetic will have been on a ventilator for a short period, maybe hours. So no, ventilators arent designed specifically for comatose patients. Originally ventilators were for surgical procedures. Most ventilators are used for those who are too weak to breathe without assistance, for many reasons. There are several types of ventilation, from positive airway pressure (CPAP) laryngeal mask to full intubation (basically a tube into the windpipe)

OK if you need a ventilator it is because you cannot breathe on your own. This is due to COVID causing pneumonia. . If it is at that stage you are well on the way to being rubber ducked. Its not the ventilator its the disease that causes the problem.

It is very simplistic to say that the lungs are bags of fluids in pneumonia as it is not that accurate, there is fluid in the lungs, but the important thing is that oxygen cannot get to the sacs in the lungs unless you have respiratory pressure. If you cannot breathe on your own then death is 100%. Pushing oxygen into the lungs gives a chance.

That said I am a little surprised that the focus is on ventilators. Certainly we are going to need them, but there are a spectrum of people who are going to need support of some kind, but less than ventilation. The most fortunate are those who have the odd sniffle. The next lot are going to feel awful, with fever and coughing, far worse than any flu. Then those who are suffering respiratory problems but can breathe unaided. This is the category (which I fall into) where things like typical asthma inhalers could be useful, but the press does not focus on this. A steroid inhaler could be immensely useful here. You know, the brown one? The blue one, salbutamol is also a standard treatment for breathlessness, but it works only for a short time. When I have felt breathless, although I am far from asthmatic, I have taken a blast of steroid inhaler and felt better for some hours. What I fear is that this category of patients are going to be ignored but with treatable respiratory issues, and descend into respiratory failure.

The worst categories fall broadly into two parts (and I am speaking very generally here) Pneumonia on its own causing respiratory failure and also sepsis. I suspect that the younger patients who have no underlying conditions who have died have developed sepsis. The latter is the most dangerous, and can cause death within a few hours. This is not a new phenomenon. Sepsis is when the infection is not just the lungs but the whole body and organs just PUFO. Ventilatory support during sepsis is vital, whilst the medics can get to work sorting out getting the other organs working again. Blood transfusion is important* and is a very important reason that if you are OK, donate blood NOW. Difficult if the onus is on self-isolating but we are going to need the red stuff in huge quantities soon.

Would I want to be ventilated if the need arise? I would stick the tube down my own bronchus and squeeze the bag myself!

*Get the crimson in me Jim son!
 

mercurydancer

LE
Book Reviewer
Funny how almost every health authority around the world is begging, stealing, borrowing, buying and building thousands of ventilators when even random armchair experts on Arrse know that they are actually killing patients faster than CV19 by itself Is killing them.

Somebody should tell somebody.
Nonsense. See my post.
 

BratMedic

LE
Book Reviewer
This is so much bollocks that it's a whole new level of utter internet bollocks.
Ventilators are designed to help people breathe when either they can't themselves or their ability to do so is impaired.
Your lungs are not full of fluid because if they were you would be dead. The fluid impairs gas exchange. The last thing a ventilator will do is damage / burst if you will, a lung. There are a bunch of electronic safety built in with mechanical backup to prevent over pressure.

It might be a good idea if you did a little research - not the mail/sun/mirror/telegraph before talking utter bollocks.
But but but Tracy said that her mate Sharon on Facebook said that a friend of her sisters is a hospital porter's wife and he told her that a hospital cleaner told him that...


...and so on into chav-infested fuckwittery...
 

Latest Threads

Top