Venezuela about to go down the tubes...a lesson for Corbyn and the Labour Party perhaps?

[javaguzzisti]

Imprisoning or killing vagrants is a social policy, but I doubt that anyone would suggest that it is socialist in nature.

It could easily become a Socialist policy though.

 

[Sadurian]

It could easily become a Socialist policy though.

Although perhaps not a Socialist socialist social policy.

 

[HectortheInspector]

The idea of the State taking over from the private or religious philanthropy goes back to the Tudor Poor Laws from 1587, a bit before Marx.

The more paternal and social engineering side could be said to be an idea of Disraeli in the Reform Act of 1867. That gave the relative poor the vote, and that was the real foundation of the later Labour Party.

The "Socialism" of Venezuala is just lip service paid by an organised crime syndicate. They have the economic competence of the Krays.

 

[Sadurian]

There's a suggestion that blocking the US aid convoy from Columbia might lead to the first real clashes.

Desperate Venezuelans beg Maduro to accept aid coming across the border

If the protestors are willing to fight with the security forces, it will push those security forces to choose a side pretty quickly. Whatever their personal views, I wonder how many would stand by if their mates and colleagues were being beaten up.

Should any such violence break out, of course, it could be the trigger for wider civil conflict within the country, giving Maduro the opportunity to crack down even harder but at the risk of creating the civil war he 'could not rule out' a day or so ago. I don't see such a civil war or widespread violent protests helping his cause at all.

 

[captaincalamity]

There's a suggestion that blocking the US aid convoy from Columbia might lead to the first real clashes.

Desperate Venezuelans beg Maduro to accept aid coming across the border

If the protestors are willing to fight with the security forces, it will push those security forces to choose a side pretty quickly. Whatever their personal views, I wonder how many would stand by if their mates and colleagues were being beaten up.

Should any such violence break out, of course, it could be the trigger for wider civil conflict within the country, giving Maduro the opportunity to crack down even harder but at the risk of creating the civil war he 'could not rule out' a day or so ago. I don't see such a civil war or widespread violent protests helping his cause at all.

It just needs someone to find the secret warehouses stuffed full of food that only the elites have access to and then it will all kick off...

 

[Sadurian]

The USA and Russia are going head to head about Venezuela in the UNSC.

U.S. and Russia push rival United Nations actions on Venezuela | Reuters

I doubt that either side expected to get their draft resolution voted through and are using the forum (the UN one, not ARRSE) as a ballpit to slap at each other ineffectually. I don't recall that happening before....

 

[FourZeroCharlie]

. . . are using the forum (the UN one, not ARRSE) as a ballpit to slap at each other ineffectually. I don't recall that happening before....

Irony?

Or have you just appeared, wraith like, from another dimension* after 60 years?

*or Goole

 

[Sadurian]

Irony?

Or have you just appeared, wraith like, from another dimension* after 60 years?

*or Goole

I'm just in shock at seeing the representatives of two large countries treat the UN Security Council chamber as some sort of playground name-calling fight. I mean, it's almost like they think that petty and ultimately ephemeral one-upmanship is more important than sorting out problems in the wider world.

Next I'll be discovering that those internet ladies who keep emailing me are not, after all, 'gagging for it' and 'in my area now'.

 

[vvaannmmaann]

Next I'll be discovering that those internet ladies who keep emailing me are not, after all, 'gagging for it' and 'in my area now'.

Godammit.

 

[Sadurian]

Indigenous Pemon on Venezuela's border with Brazil vow to let aid in | Reuters

The Pemon, a semi-automonous indigenous people on the Venezuelan border, have said that they will allow foreign aid to come through their territory, even against the wishes of Maduro's security forces.

An interesting development from a political point of view, but the practicalities of distributing aid that has entered the country 'illegally' mean that I doubt it will make too much of a difference.

 

[Ho2331]

We know what they mean when we use them or hear them , but they aren't really accurate measures of political doctrine.

Generally people understand it to be: Right wing equals racist bankers. And left wing to be economical illiterates - who hate jews but love any other minority group.
However, like you have said; it's not as simple as that.

 

[MrDave]

The Worlds richest need to pay more tax!

 

[Sadurian]

The Worlds richest need to pay more tax!

Yeah, tax the wealthy, that'll learn 'em to be so rich. Taxing the rich will certainly encourage wealth creation, won't it?

How much tax do Maduro and his family pay towards the Venezuelan economy?

 

[Sadurian]

Looks like the 23rd is the date on which to place your bets as to who will be in charge for March. Anyone wanting to dress in combats and run around with live ammunition should begin applying now.

Showdown looms as Venezuela's Guaido sets aid entry date | Reuters

 

[MrDave]

Yeah, tax the wealthy, that'll learn 'em to be so rich. Taxing the rich will certainly encourage wealth creation, won't it?

How much tax do Maduro and his family pay towards the Venezuelan economy?

Wealth creation! Tell that to all the people who work full time jobs while having to to claim benefits, while their bosses tell them how lucky they are to have those shit jobs. Meanwhile their bosses are living it up.

 

[Oddbod]

Wealth creation! Tell that to all the people who work full time jobs while having to to claim benefits, while their bosses tell them how lucky they are to have those shit jobs. Meanwhile their bosses are living it up.

tell me again how some mouth-breathing, uneducated, congenitally lazy person should be paid the same as someone who has done their best to be a productive member of society & who actually does a day's work for a day's pay.
I've employed both over the years & the idle "owed a living" types neither lasted nor did much in the way of work.
Their only worth would be as soylent green, for pigs...

 

[MrDave]

tell me again how some mouth-breathing, uneducated, congenitally lazy person should be paid the same as someone who has done their best to be a productive member of society & who actually does a day's work for a day's pay.
I've employed both over the years & the idle "owed a living" types neither lasted nor did much in the way of work.
Their only worth would be as soylent green, for pigs...

Stop putting words in my mouth. You're a typical Tory, making it up as you go along and hoping that no one will notice!

 

[Sadurian]

tell me again how some mouth-breathing, uneducated, congenitally lazy person should be paid the same as someone who has done their best to be a productive member of society & who actually does a day's work for a day's pay.
I've employed both over the years & the idle "owed a living" types neither lasted nor did much in the way of work.
Their only worth would be as soylent green, for pigs...

Well Socialism is supposed to give to everyone according to 'their needs'. Unfortunately, what a person needs is determined by the state. Socialist state leaders also somehow determine that what they really need is a disproportionate share of the state's wealth. Maduro's needs are quite obviously greater than everyone else's by a vast degree because... he is Maduro.

I have no idea about the veracity of the information used on this site but the information isn't publicly available so we have to go with what we can. Salary, Income, Net Worth: Nicolas Maduro - Paywizard.org. Maduro is officially paid 12x the minimum wage, the maximum he can claim by law. On top of that, of course, there is the income derived from unofficial means. Even 12x minimum wage doesn't fund his stepsons' lifestyle.

Rich Kids of Venezuela including Chavez’s daughter flaunt cash as country starves

I'm still wondering how much tax he and his family pay.

 

[Oddbod]

Stop putting words in my mouth. You're a typical Tory, making it up as you go along and hoping that no one will notice!

Aye righto & you're a typical envy ridden socialist failure.

I'm actually a former long standing member of UKIP & consider the current Tory Party to be a bunch of centre left, wet liberals.
The Labour Party is well on its way to Venezuelan stylee, one party, extreme socialism, with a dose of antisemitism thrown in for good measure.
There was a party like that in Germany for a while...

 

[Sadurian]

Venezuela opposition moves to seize control of oil revenue

The (democratically elected) Venezuelan Congress are starting moves to bring the country's state-owned PDVSA oil company under their control and away from Maduro's. It's an obvious move given that the company is theoretically one of the country's main sources of revenue and is currently being controlled by the unelected Maduro.

The Congress want to replace the company's board with their own people. Maduro is saying that they are trying to steal it, a predictable but somewhat dubious accusation from a man who has no legitimate rights to the company in the first place. The proposed new board members all currently live in the USA, which suggests that they are anti-Maduro and likely to be more sympathetic to US interests than to Russia ones. It is possible if they are US-educated that they might also have the first clue about how to run a large company in a market-led global economy. Also proposed is a US director as part of the board.

The move is definitely a proposal at present, how practical it would be is open to debate. Certainly, unless the US director is a non-voting advisor already working in the oil industry then I doubt that his appointment would be popular to Venezuelans.

There is also the usual bluster from Maduro about a US invasion will lead to a second Vietnam. He might want to rethink that as Vietnam saw the incumbent leader of the South ousted. In any case, the USA are saying that they have no intention of invading or using military forces so Maduro is valiantly fighting a strawman.