USA Pakistan relations deteriorate - USA given notice to leave Pakistan

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by cavemandave, Nov 26, 2011.

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  1. Government officials immediately blocked Nato supplies to Afghanistan and condemned the early morning airstrike on the Afghan border as a “grave infringement” of Pakistan’s sovereignty.
    Pakistan’s prime minister, Yousuf Raza Gilani, called an emergency meeting of his cabinet’s defence committee to consider the response.
    In a late-night statement the committee condemned the attack and asked the US to vacate the Shamsi air base, where the CIA is believed to base predator drones, within 15 days.

    'Highly likely' Nato was responsible for killing 24 Pakistani soldiers - Telegraph
  2. Can we do the same thing in Bradford???????????????????
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  3. Obviously there's a lot more to this story than ISAF slotting PakMil for the hell of it.

    The Grauniad has since expanded on this:
    Nato air attack on Pakistani troops was self-defence, says senior western official | World news | The Observer
    "Edrees Momand of the Afghan Border Police said that a US-Afghan force in the area near the Pakistani outposts detained several militants on Saturday morning.
    "I am not aware of the casualties on the other side of the border but those we have detained aren't Afghan Taliban," he said, implying they may have been Pakistani or other foreign national Taliban operating in Afghanistan."

    While the Pak Mil are crying foul - as their troops were kipping, a military infraction is easier to explain than aiding and abetting Pak Taliban Lashgars going cross border with their knowledge!

    "For their part, a statement by the Pakistani military claimed that it was they who were attacked first, forcing them to respond to Nato's "aggression with all available weapons".

    According to Pakistani officials the 40 or so soldiers stationed at the outposts were asleep at the time of the attack. Government officials said the two border posts that were attacked had recently been established to try to stop insurgents who use bases in Afghanistan to attack Pakistan from crossing the border and launching attacks."

    Here in Asia the Beeb showed the first part of their damning two-part doco "Secret Pakistan" yesterday, which is unequivocal about ISI's continual support of Terry and how it was ramped up significantly by 2006.
    The furore over this will come as no surprise as the Pak politicos pander to the military and the fundies who will end up in strangling what passes for democracy what rule of law that still exists.

    This is one match the Pak's can no longer pretend to fix.
    If there is ever to be democratic rule in Pakistan ISI needs to be disbanded and its senior leadership detained.
  4. Don't you wish....?
  5. dear pakistan, with ref to all your aid including that £650million for schools, **** right off
    lots of love DfID.
    ps merry winter festival
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  6. How nuanced. I take it you put your entire braincell into this post. Congratulations
  7. I take it he meant we should stop UK DfID funding for Pakistan.

    Nothing to do with any attack but I wouldn't fund them anyway. Calm your froth and I'll explain why.

    1. We can't afford it any more.

    2. There is no proof that giving them money benefits the UK in any way whatsoever.

    Oh stopping funding would include most of the other shitholes we pour our hard-earned into.

    Does that explain it for you better?
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  8. On SST The Memogate Brouhaha (FB Ali)
    The former Brigadier is right to put these events together, we have Pakistan's US ambassador offering abject terms to a clearly interested DC behind Pindi's back as well as comprehensively ratting them out. This is a Pakistani version of the dolchstoßlegende but in this case for real.
    Now a couple of dozen of Pindi's guys are killed in an US airstrike on Pakistan soil.

    Things have gone screaming downhill between Pindi and DC since the Abbottabad hit, this looks like the start of a messy divorce. It's a dysfunctional relationship in which a deluded DC has played appeaser to a very bad actor. The ISI has stood behind the Haqqani network and that provided the social infrastructure out of which AQ grew. This should have been addressed forcefully after 9-11 but DC was stuck in a rut following a different agenda and its been left to fester. The last decade has involved Pindi fighting a blatant proxy war against ISAF that now has become public knowledge. Pakistan has also been politically destabilized by the Pashtun war.

    There have been incidents before but this constellation of circumstances does not look good. This probably means a much hotter war in Afghanistan minus the Karachi LOS and well before Barry's dumb electorally set drawdown timetable. Pindi has a habit of nuclear brinksmanship combined with transnational terrorist spectaculars. The prospects for a wider Pakistan-US war just rose significantly.

    The Iranians will be delighted.
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  9. Thank you for explaining it to me. I had no idea that was what he was talking about.

    I just feel that it is a simplistic answer similar to the idea that we would be richer as a nation if we sent them all home or stopped tax loopholes.

    The idea that it does not benefit the uk is wrong. A huge proportion of our G4 comes through there and to an extent we have to bribe them. Secondly despite their uneven showing they are quite valuable in the war in Afghanistan. Yes I am sure they have links to terrorists but they could make the country a lit more unstable if they wish. Supporting them keeps them at least notionally onside.

    However you may think this is all rubbish, I'll leave you to your daily mail.
  10. Why do I get the feeling that this current crisis has the potential to change the game in a very bad way?
  11. Real Politik is a dirty business that often resembles the Godfather movies: "Keep your friends close but your enemies closer." I have no problem giving "Humanitarian Aid" to countries who's cooperation we need to buy. However, aid to countries that have nothing to give us in return should be stopped immediately. Pouring money into some worthless African nation in a futile attempt to stop Africans dying of disease, malnutrition or machete's is an expensive luxury we can no longer afford.

    In any case, there are close to 7 Billion people in the world, and an increasingly finite amount of resources. The herd needs to be culled.:roll:

    Oh, and it's the Sunday Mail, thank you very much.^_~
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  12. Is this the stabtoreg talking or his simpleton alter ego?

    Everyone with half a brain cell understood the post and that if Pakistan was playing hardball with the NATO/ISAF convoys we could really put them in the hurt by withdrawing aid.

    A potential hawl of £500 million a year is invaluable to feed your poor... and your nuclear power stations* and space programme.

    *I'm a bit ambivalent on this matter... people should have power, but is a nuke the best way to provide in these, er, sensitive countries?
  13. I am well aware of where the G4 used to come through. We don't need notional onsides and more importantly if it is only notional assistance then WTF are we doing there? Paying the Taliban not to attack until we get across the border so they can attack us there? You are sure they have links to terrorists - everybody is sure.

    What does a newspaper have to do with my opinion-forming BTW? Or is that you standard insult to somebody who doesn't agree with you but has right wing views? How about an alternative POV? All you are doing is regurgitating the status quo via a CoC blurb of why we do things the way we do. In which case the Seppos will be paying thePakistanis a **** sight more than we are so see my initial argument of why do we bother - and yet they still stopped the G4.

    FYI my papers of choice are the Times and I do read the Guardian - much the same way as I read books on Marxism - know your enemy.
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  14. It's funny... we have a thread on whether or not the word 'cnut' is the most offensive insult... but many on here seem to regard 'Daily Mail/Wail/Hate reader' as on a par.

    Personnally I read the Daily Sport.
  15. We shouldn't become obsessed with the Pak G4 chain. On our H14 the border was closed for 3 months largely due to diplomatic charges that UK PLC wouldn't cough for. It made not a jot of difference to output. The SLOC is broken; anything of value arrives by air. Food is supplied by contract via KAF & kenya - fuel can be piped down via the stans. The G4 arguement is one of convenience to seemingly justify a sizeable FCO payout via DFID. When we come to leave the Pak SLOC may be of more use, but given the significant investment in rail infra through the NLOC, now may be a good time to buy shares in Khazak Rail!