US Iraq deaths at four-year low - Are we winning?

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by Polemarch, Jun 2, 2008.

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    "US military deaths in Iraq are said to have fallen to their lowest monthly level for four years, after about 20 soldiers were reported killed in May."

    With this following hot on the official US line that al-Qaeda is being beaten does this mean the US policy in Iraq is working? Is the war being won or is the reaility of the situation very different? Where exactly are we with Iraq right now?
  2. No we are not winning.
    Colonel Tim Collins at the start of the invasion said

    We go to liberate, not to conquer.
    We will not fly our flags in their country
    We are entering Iraq to free a people and the only flag which will be flown in that ancient land is their own.Show respect for them.

    I think we can agree that the british troops bought into this idea that however illegal the invasion was, however much we suspected that Blair was lying about WMD and however wrong it felt to invade Iraq that if we could get rid of Saddam, liberate Iraq from oppression and help it to restore itself and rebuild into a better place for its people after such a long time of suffering from Saddam and the decade of sanctions that we had inflicted upon them, then it would all somehow be worthwhile in the end.
    Our forces were going to be sent there anyway no matter what they believed and so squaring it away in our heads as 'for the best' and somehow helping the Iraqi's was at worst a coping mechanism and at best naieve.
    The US have built massive PERMANENT bases in Iraq. They intend staying in Iraq for ever and ever. They had and have no intention of leaving.
    They have no respect for the Iraqi people and care about what happens there only in so much as it affects them.
    Why are we still there?
    Because we have lost so many of our servicemen already and have spent a fortune on this war. Because we have already gone so far down this wrong road, few are willing to put their head up above the parapet and say "STOP" "No More" "Enough"
    There is a mindset in places of power that because we have come so far with all this that it would somehow be 'unbritish' to stop and pull out.
    What stupidity this is.
    The same applies in Afghanistan.
    It's a war we have no hope of winning.
    Stupid stubborn men sending our troops into harms way because they can't step outside of their own pride and the momentum of the past.
    No we are not winning. Nor will we ever unless we bring our boys home and let the yanks get on with their self serving empire building on their own.
    Really we should know better than to continue behaving like this.
  3. Let's look at it from point of view of the insurgents. At least some of them are not idiots and are aware about presidential elections in the USA.

    The insurgents realise that there is a good probability of the withdrawal of American (and other foreign) troops from Iraq. So it would be logical not to waste resources and prepare for future struggle for power.

    If mr.McCain would be elected or the democrats would 'pospone' the withdrawal then I suspect that the level of attacks against our American friends would be restored very soon.
  4. Still lost 20 soldiers in a month and they see this as a sort of victory?
  5. The US losses in Iraq were 51 or 52 for April-a 6 month or so high.Not too much can be read into a single month's figures.

    The trend for US(and other allied deaths) has been down since last October or so.

    The US surge seems to be paying results with less violence in Iraq.
  6. When Gen Petraeus stops using words like "fragile" and "reversible", or phrases like "not yet turned a corner" and "no light at the end of the tunnel", then, maybe, just maybe we can call the fat lady's agent and start preliminary discussions about what she might one day sing for Iraq.

    Even at that point, there will be expatriates to be persuaded home, an economy to build, ongoing inter-ethnic rivalries to be managed . . . . .

    I'm leaving all talk of 'victory' to the guy who, in an uncharacteristic moment of near-lucidity, once said this, to his senior policy advisors:

  7. And what will have been achieved at the end of it all ?
  8. another massive memorial wall in Washington with the names of all the US dead?
  9. Poetry gentlemen, your terse exchange was pure poetry.