US in Iraq until 2009

#1
AMERICANS IN IRAQ UNTIL 2009 Apr 11 2005

Dossier plans 'prove Brits will stay'

By Rosa Prince

THE US Army plans to remain in Iraq until at least 2009, secret documents obtained by the Mirror reveal.

Contract tender forms for civilian workers disclose a huge expansion of interrogation and detention centres in Iraq to remain in place for a minimum four more years.

Yesterday Labour MP Alan Simpson claimed the revelation means that British forces will also have to stay the distance.

He said: "This is obviously the real withdrawal timetable. British soldiers will be used to protect US profits. Those who die are blood money for corporate America."

According to the documents from the Assistant Chief of Staff, Multi-National Forces, US chiefs plan a £70million expansion in holding centres for suspects. They will be staffed by 300 civilian recruits aiding intelligence.

In a sign the US has learned from the Abu Ghraib jail scandal, in which prisoners were abused, the civilian interrogators will be trained in the Geneva Convention.

Warning of the dangers of the job, the document says: "No persons supporting operations will be allowed to reside off a US secure facility, or travel unless in a military secured convoy."

Military bosses also want to appoint someone to the top-secret job of deciding which intelligence is shared with British secret services based in Basra.

The Army plans emerged the day after tens of thousands of Iraqis marched in Baghdad demanding the US quit.

Chanting "No America! No Saddam!" protesters loyal to Shia cleric Moqtada al-Sadr streamed into Firdos Square where Saddam's statue was torn down two years ago. Other demos were held in Ramadi, Baiji and Najaf.

Al-Qaeda's wing in Iraq, led by Jordanian Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, said it had seized and killed a top Iraqi police officer in Baghdad.

A second militant group claimed to have kidnapped Pakistani diplomat Malik Mohammed Javed who vanished from the capital on Saturday.

Click here for full story!

I know it's that wretched rag, and so completely suspect, but it's not entirely unexpected either!
 
#2
Interesting to see how well we are playing this game as well now.

UK general calls for reduction of immunity for foreign forces in Iraq

A high-ranking British Army officer emphasized the importance of reducing the size of the multinational forces' legal immunity in Iraq in the wake of the violations by these forces against the Iraqi people.

General John Kiszely, commander of the British forces in Iraq, said in a news conference attended by this newspaper yesterday that "each force participating in the multinational forces should be held responsible for the damage that they cause to the Iraqi people. They must offer the necessary apology and compensation to the Iraqi victims," adding that the British forces last week presented an official apology and handsome compensation to a transitional National Assembly member whose house the British forces had raided by mistake.

Regarding the withdrawal of the British forces from Iraq, the British commander said: "Under the current situation, it is very difficult to specify a definite schedule for the withdrawal of the British forces from Iraq due to the deteriorating security situation in the Iraqi governorates, except for some that are witnessing stability. In addition, the Iraqi forces have not reached yet the level of being capable of handling the security portfolio alone." He asserted that "this subject is left up to the Iraqi Government." He added: "If it asks us to leave, we will respect its decision because it is an elected government."

General Kiszely explained: "The total number of British troops in Iraq now is 7,000. There is no plan or intention to increase or decrease this number at the current stage." In the meantime, he indicated that if any allied country wants to withdraw its forces from Iraq, the coalition forces will replace these forces with others from other countries. He maintained that, for example, the Australian forces are being doubled in order to replace the Dutch forces that will be withdrawn from Iraq next December.

General Kiszely asserted that "the British forces will support and provide the Iraqi forces in the southern Iraq with all of their requirements, including weapons, equipment, and other requirements, because they are responsible for supervising these forces. In addition to that, the British forces completed a number of projects in important sectors, including drinking water, electricity, and other infrastructure projects that significantly helped resolve many problems that the people in the southern governorates are facing."

General Kiszely expressed satisfaction with regard to the improvement in the performance of the Iraqi security forces in the last six months and said: "These forces used to include only two National Guard brigades. They now comprise 27 brigades." He added that the total number of brigades in the entire Iraqi security forces, including the police, the Iraqi Army, and the National Guard, is 90 and is increasing constantly.

Source: Al-Zaman, Baghdad, in Arabic 5 Apr 05 p 1
Link that General John merely rearticulates the status-quo whilst subtly raising the issue of corporate integrity - good work fella! :D
 
#3
The Army is considering lowering troop strength in Iraq in early 2006 by 40,000 troops - which would leave around 100,000. Also there would be a redeployment of brigades out of quiet areas into those with a significant tango presence.
 
#4
tomahawk6 said:
The Army is considering lowering troop strength in Iraq in early 2006 by 40,000 troops - which would leave around 100,000. Also there would be a redeployment of brigades out of quiet areas into those with a significant tango presence.
That'll please the wife, and so will the shorter deployment lengths. Of course, that means when I come back from the Sandbox I'll have to hear forever more from other vets that I didn't do the "proper" tour like they used to :).
 
#5
Lets be optimistic. That means that there are more troops available for other sunny locations.
It keeps us all in business and not upsetting the general public at home.
 
#6
I am not surprised that forces will be staying in Iraq, Iraq has been under the brutal rein of Saddam for too long and have forgotten Dilomacy in every aspect. They are now proesting for the of iraq where under saddams rule, they would be executed. However the longer they are under a diplomatic country the more civilised they will become.
 
#7
Look, Germany is no longer fun for peacetime soldiering, exercises et cetera. If we bung as much money at the BAOE (British Army of the Euphrates) as we did at BAOR, then the Iraqis will be made up. The villa next to Herman the German's in Ibiza will be Aftab the Arab's...the up side is there will be no poxie frikkadelles in the schnelly wagon on Al Soltau or Bin Trauen ranges.

I tried to get people excited about moving to the RS or Kosovo but maybe the sunny Iraqi vistas, along with their horrid winter glooms will be attractive to DAT? It would be like a cross between Canada and vogelsang - but with noisome insects a la Belize...perfect for pi**ing the boys and girls off but not involving DAMCON. And no annoying claims for personal injuries from Kenyans...
 
#8
Calypso said:
Link that General John merely rearticulates the status-quo whilst subtly raising the issue of corporate integrity - good work fella! :D
Subtly?

I've read the transcript of this interview as well as a few others with General John. No offense, but the man seems very redundant to me. He keeps saying the same thing over and over again over the course of his deployment there.
But just out of curiousity, is this guy English or Welsh or Irish or Scottish?
 
#9
CarrotGirl said:
Calypso said:
Link that General John merely rearticulates the status-quo whilst subtly raising the issue of corporate integrity - good work fella! :D
Subtly?

I've read the transcript of this interview as well as a few others with General John. No offense, but the man seems very redundant to me. He keeps saying the same thing over and over again over the course of his deployment there.
But just out of curiousity, is this guy English or Welsh or Irish or Scottish?
CarrotGirl

Lt Gen Sir John Kiszely is late Scots Guards.
 
#10
hackle said:
CarrotGirl said:
Calypso said:
Lt Gen Sir John Kiszely is late Scots Guards.
So does that make him Scottish? and by Late Scots Guards, do you mean that they don't exist anymore? I hate to ask obvious questions, but I am clueless the clueless village idiot here!

With that aside, the man still seems to be repeating stuff all the time and it always makes the news as something new. Kinda puzzling!
 
#11
CarrotGirl said:
hackle said:
CarrotGirl said:
Calypso said:
Lt Gen Sir John Kiszely is late Scots Guards.
So does that make him Scottish? and by Late Scots Guards, do you mean that they don't exist anymore? I hate to ask obvious questions, but I am clueless the clueless village idiot here!

With that aside, the man still seems to be repeating stuff all the time and it always makes the news as something new. Kinda puzzling!
CarrotGirl

'Late Scots Guards' just means that he was Scots Guards before being promoted above the rank of Lt Col. The Regiment is very much still in being.

I have now re-read your comments about this British General "seeming very redundant" to you, "saying the same thing over and over again in the course of his deployment", and now "repeating stuff all the time." Thank you for your perspective.
 
#12
Hackle
I'm so sorry if that was offensive to you. I really meant nothing by it, and I've read interviews with both the British and the American leaders in Iraq Lt Gen Kiszely and Gen Casey and I have a lot of respect for him specially after the latest interview. Casey maybe not as much. I'm just saying that that he has been repeating stuff all the time about the length of the deployment and everything without people getting a clue that the British troops will be there as long as they're needed, so that is getting redundant. It's not meant to be an attack on him, I assure you. Thanks for the information about the Scots Guards. :) Is the general in question Scottish?
 
#13
CarrotGirl said:
Hackle
I'm just saying that that he has been repeating stuff all the time about the length of the deployment and everything without people getting a clue that the British troops will be there as long as they're needed, so that is getting redundant.
It's called using "talking points" by the PR people. You keep repeating the same thing and the theory is that the message will strike home.

If the message appears confusing it's usually because it's meant to be. Bear in mind that this is basically for the (voting) public's consumption and not necessarily for the fighting men and women. The boffins figure that if the average voter can't get the gist of an "answer", and the issue doesn't directly affect them, they'll bugger off, carry on with their own lives and forget about it. Naturally, most on this site are paying close attention to this issue and, understandably get pissed off when they can't get a straight answer.

You'll have seen this done in every political interview you've ever seen. It just appears odd to you because it's only recently that HM Forces' media people have been getting savvy to it.
 
#15
CarrotGirl said:
hackle said:
CarrotGirl said:
Calypso said:
Lt Gen Sir John Kiszely is late Scots Guards.
So does that make him Scottish? and by Late Scots Guards, do you mean that they don't exist anymore? I hate to ask obvious questions, but I am clueless the clueless village idiot here!

With that aside, the man still seems to be repeating stuff all the time and it always makes the news as something new. Kinda puzzling!
As Gen Kiszley is Late Scots Guards he is almost certainly English, and prob spent a period of time in the Surry Highlanders where most of the Scottish Officers have served.
 

OldSnowy

LE
Moderator
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#16
'Late' means that, once Col and above, you are really on the 'staff', and not employed by your Regiment.

Not only is he SG, but holds the MC for leading his Company of Jocks in a bayonet Charge in the Falklands.

Had the privelege to work for hom some time back - real Gent, and about as Scottish as Tony Bliar - i.e. English accent, and very posh indeed :D
 
#17
lunchy_bunsworth said:
As Gen Kiszley ... prob spent a period of time in the Surry Highlanders where most of the Scottish Officers have served.
lunchy you are not making as much sense as usual!

It's true that "Army families" (and there is still such a thing) tend to become gradually anglicised as a result of postings and schooling.

However I have just been ticking off the names of every current and recent senior offr in 'my own' regiment. Every single one I can think of is Scottish through and through. As am I :D
 
#19
hackle said:
lunchy_bunsworth said:
As Gen Kiszley ... prob spent a period of time in the Surry Highlanders where most of the Scottish Officers have served.
lunchy you are not making as much sense as usual!

It's true that "Army families" (and there is still such a thing) tend to become gradually anglicised as a result of postings and schooling.

However I have just been ticking off the names of every current and recent senior offr in 'my own' regiment. Every single one I can think of is Scottish through and through. As am I :D
Point taken. A bit of a generalisation (no pun intended).
 

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