US Army Storms Iran Consulate

#3
Are the fcking cretins in Washington actually trying to utterly destroy the region? Or do they somehow, in some vague and random world, actually think they are doing the right thing?
 
#5
CarpeDiem said:
Are the fcking cretins in Washington actually trying to utterly destroy the region? Or do they somehow, in some vague and random world, actually think they are doing the right thing?
yes to both i fear :(
 
#6
Sven said:
Is this a proper consulate which has diplomatic protection? If so are the Americans acting illegally?
If it is, this action is just utterly idiotic. It, more importantly, would set a v dangerous precedent.
 
#7
In fairness Iran haven't exactly got a great record for respecting embassies :twisted:
 

diplomat

MIA
Book Reviewer
#10
The status of an Embassy and a Consulate is covered in the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations (VCDR), 1961 and the Vienna Convention on Consular Relations (VCCR), 1963.

http://untreaty.un.org/ilc/texts/instruments/english/conventions/9_1_1961.pdf

http://untreaty.un.org/ilc/texts/instruments/english/conventions/9_2_1963.pdf

Therefore under the above 1961 VCDR agreement and in accordance with international law, diplomatic missions enjoy an extraterritorial status and thus, although remaining part of the host country's territory, they are exempt from local law and in almost all respects treated as being part of the territory of the home country.

The status for a consulate is slightly different as they are there to provide services for individual persons and business, and NOT to engage in diplomatic relations between countries. The Consul him/herself may or may not however, be an accredited diplomat and as such enjoy full diplomatic priviledges. Yet, Article 31 of the VCCR does state that

'1.Consular premises shall be inviolable to the extent provided in this article.

2.The authorities of the receiving State shall not enter that part of the consular premises which is used exclusively for the purpose of the work of the consular post except with the consent of the head of the consular post or of his designee or of the head of the diplomatic mission of the sending State. The consent of the head of the consular post may, however, be assumed in case of fire or other disaster requiring prompt protective action.

3.Subject to the provisions of paragraph 2 of this article, the receiving State is under a special duty to take all appropriate steps to protect the consular premises against any intrusion or damage and to prevent any disturbance of the peace of the consular post or impairment of its dignity.


I would be very surprised if the US had not ascertained the exact status of the Consulate concerned and its staff before taking this action, although Article 31 suggests that a 'tricky' legal interpretation of the VCCR may have been necessary!

Those are the facts and conventions, interpretation is for the lawyers I am afraid! Not a very sensible action though I would suggest, unless legal precednce has already been set elsewhere. Iraq today, is not perhaps the best place to set a legal precendent under international law!
 
#11
Sven said:
Ord_Sgt said:
In fairness Iran haven't exactly got a great record for respecting embassies :twisted:
In fairness, do we lower ourselves to their level or maintain the moral high ground
I'm rarely in agreement with Sven but he has hit the nail on the head here.

Unless we want a free for all, immunity for consulate/embassy buildings must be maintained. Nail the staff outside if they playing silly buggers.
 
#12
Does this action have anything to do with the coming surge?
Just maybe this and the surgy thing has more to do with provoking Iran into a war than it does with Iraq, maybe?

Muzzelflash and nigegilb, use a wider angled lens when focusing in on this puppy.
 
#13
If you read that article, it seems the consulate was set up without the express permission of the Iraq Gvt.
I suppose that legally, if this office did not have offical accreditation, then they have no protection and the raid is therefore legal?
 
#14
A swift in and out is a much more sensitive option (and would provide lots of int) compared to the stray JDAM/Cruise missile approach :wink:
Just adding a little more fuel to the middle east fire really, isn't it.
 

diplomat

MIA
Book Reviewer
#15
Daede said:
If you read that article, it seems the consulate was set up without the express permission of the Iraq Gvt.
I suppose that legally, if this office did not have offical accreditation, then they have no protection and the raid is therefore legal?
Daede, your assumption would be correct if the article is factually accurate. If it is not approved and accredited by the legitimate government of Iraq (the one with the seat in the UN not a Kurd Govt), then it would not enjoy the priviledges of the VCCR 1963. Otherwise we could all set up consulates and claim diplomatic priviledges.
 
#16
We did not enter the consulates of the russians for 50 years during the cold war, despite a number of hot wars-by-proxy.

The difference here is that the Iranians are NOT a world power, do not have nukes, cannot invade the west and at this time are directly costing the lives of western forces next door to their country.

They are on the sh!t list for doing his, and possibly on the invasion list too.

Might is right in this case. 'We are going o kick in your door for messing with us! What are yer gunna do about it?'

Iran needs a good slapping. The mullahs in Iran are if anything worse for the surrounding region than the Iraqi sunni ones. At least Saddam was a bit secular, the Iranians are just old fashioned fanatical lunatics.
 
#17
Hold them hostage for a couple of years and treat them like shit...................the President of Iran is an expert with form on how to trash embassies
 
#18
Giblets said:
We did not enter the consulates of the russians for 50 years during the cold war, despite a number of hot wars-by-proxy.

The difference here is that the Iranians are NOT a world power, do not have nukes, cannot invade the west and at this time are directly costing the lives of western forces next door to their country.

They are on the sh!t list for doing his, and possibly on the invasion list too.

Might is right in this case. 'We are going o kick in your door for messing with us! What are yer gunna do about it?'

Iran needs a good slapping. The mullahs in Iran are if anything worse for the surrounding region than the Iraqi sunni ones. At least Saddam was a bit secular, the Iranians are just old fashioned fanatical lunatics.
Now this is a fine example of holding the moral high ground

Then :roll:
 
#19
Sven said:
Giblets said:
We did not enter the consulates of the russians for 50 years during the cold war, despite a number of hot wars-by-proxy.

The difference here is that the Iranians are NOT a world power, do not have nukes, cannot invade the west and at this time are directly costing the lives of western forces next door to their country.

They are on the sh!t list for doing his, and possibly on the invasion list too.

Might is right in this case. 'We are going o kick in your door for messing with us! What are yer gunna do about it?'

Iran needs a good slapping. The mullahs in Iran are if anything worse for the surrounding region than the Iraqi sunni ones. At least Saddam was a bit secular, the Iranians are just old fashioned fanatical lunatics.
Now this is a fine example of holding the moral high ground

Then :roll:
Nuts to the moral high ground. The moral high ground would have us without fighter aircraft, nuclear weapons etc..

The moral high ground is allright if both parties abide by the Geneva convention, or if neither party is guilty of raiding embassies, but this is not the case with Iran.

Sometimes you just have to say 'Fight Fire with Fire' or better still, 'I have tried to be nice, I have tried to be diplomatic, I have given you every opportunity to be reasonable, but now I have had enough, now I am going to smash in your 'orrible dial without mercy or quarter given'.
 
#20
A great deal of allied assets including SF are tied up with trying to prevent the flow of arms and specialists crossing the border from Iran into Iraq. Insurgents are using factory made "IED's" handed to them from the Iranians. I rarely say this nowadays, but good on the Yanks for swinging their weight around. Iraq has enough problems without Iranians meddling in affairs.
 

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