UOTC and CMSR

[baseline]

Can anyone tell me, eihter unconfirmed or even better with a source, the status of MTQ 1 if i was to transfer to the TA? Could i miss doing my CMSR?

Seeing as MTQ 1 and CMSR are comparable for eligibility to attend TACC Mod 2 (which is all i can find on the matter) hopefully they are!

Cheers

BL

 

[Badgertastic]

As far as I'm aware (I transferred out after MTQ3) MTQ1 is indeed equivalent to CMSR, but without the CBRN aspects. How well that comparison stands up in reality (as opposed to on paper) will depend entirely on what OTC you were with - they vary a lot, and so do training years within them. At least in my experience, anyway!

Make sure that your OTC transfer the paperwork correctly, as I had interesting times recently when Glasgow got the impression that my unit were trying to give a recruit a tape...

 

[tearsbeforebedtime]

Basically what Badgertastic said. At the dizzying hights of Officer I have yet to do whatever it is that passes as CBRN or as it was NBC basic training. Didn't stop me going to RMAS or deploying twice.
I've heard that it is being binned anyway as it is
A.) Gay
B.) Useless
C.) an irrelevance at the moment.

PS once you get to a 'real' TA unit you will notice that all CBRN instructors are not the type of people you'd trust to look after your children. It attracts some interesting characters.

 

[Badgertastic]

I've heard that it is being binned anyway as it is
A.) Gay
B.) Useless
C.) an irrelevance at the moment.

PS once you get to a 'real' TA unit you will notice that all CBRN instructors are not the type of people you'd trust to look after your children. It attracts some interesting characters.

Exactly what I've heard, though we are breaking out the face wellies next week at my place to be given the obligatory MATT 4 tick in the box by just such a 'character'...

 

[tearsbeforebedtime]

The urge to gas the unit twice a year (in case someone can't make it!) is strong in ours although I have made them reduce it to once only and those who miss it will have to try harder to attend next year.

Running round in 4R trying to complete simple tasks is also high on the list for the more slow witted who may not realise that wearing full rig with face welly might impede dexterity, temprature regulation, rehydration and increase fatigue.
Inst :"What would you do if you needed to shit?"
Me: "Wait."
Inst: "Or?"
Me: "Sack the enabler"
Inst: "Oh, it's you Sir. Well if you'd like to watch my assistant..."

 

[Badgertastic]

Luckily my unit isn't too full of face welly fetishists - they've even removed it from the mil skills competitions in favour of more relevant activities... though changing a Bedford gearbox in 4R was interesting to say the least.

As was going through the suit changing drills as the demo pair in a lesson, paired with a shortarse who seemed to be enjoying stripping me off far, far too much - what is it about CBRN and pervs? Must be all the hot, sweaty rubber.

 

[Ex_Pompadour]

At this moment, no part of MLDP/MTQ1, 2 or 3 counts as TSC (which replaced CMS(R) a couple of years ago). There has been an email only today from Initial Training Group to this effect because an RTC tested an ex-OTC bod to TSC A standard (the 6 weekends) and sent them on to TSC B (the 2 week trade course).

It is likely, but not certain, that this rule will be relaxed in the very near future.

It does seem to go against common sense that MLDP1 doesn't equate to TSC when you could do MLDP1-3 with an OTC (at least until 2010), go to RMAS for revision and assessment and then hold a TA commission. But life is like that.

Ex_P

 

[tearsbeforebedtime]

And there we have a DS answer.

 

[Buttonz-UK]

At this moment, no part of MLDP/MTQ1, 2 or 3 counts as TSC (which replaced CMS(R) a couple of years ago). There has been an email only today from Initial Training Group to this effect because an RTC tested an ex-OTC bod to TSC A standard (the 6 weekends) and sent them on to TSC B (the 2 week trade course).

It is likely, but not certain, that this rule will be relaxed in the very near future.

It does seem to go against common sense that MLDP1 doesn't equate to TSC when you could do MLDP1-3 with an OTC (at least until 2010), go to RMAS for revision and assessment and then hold a TA commission. But life is like that.

Ex_P

Ex_Pompadour Do you have a source for this, i.e. the email from ITG you can forward to me?

I'm transferring from Southampton UOTC to a TA Fd Hosp and am having constant problems, being told I have to complete TSC A (6 weekends of training).

I have completed my MTQ's 1, 2 and Module 3

I've been told a course requisit to attend TSC (A) is a recruit selection day (RSD) certificate and as I am an obvious transfer i've not done an RSD as we don't do these at UOTC's.

If you have a reliable source, an person, email, policy, or document it would be much appreciated to find out what can be done.

 

[Buttonz-UK]

Quick one regarding testing OTC Bods to TSC (A) standard, how is this done, what is tested and how do we get on this to go straight to TSC B

 

[Ex_Pompadour]

Buttonz

You don't. There is a strict policy on this which is driven by a need to ensure that all soldiers are properly trained, with documentation to prove it. I've copied in the email from ITG, dated 28 Feb 11, which was not protectively marked.

Sirs et al,



There has been a incident where by an ex-UOTC OCdt has arrived at ATC(P) for TSC(B) having gained a Certificate of Refresher Training from an RTC having not completed TSC(A).

This is not to happen; RTCs may not conduct TSC(A) refresher testing for a soldier who has not undertaken TSC(A).

LF DTrg(A) is working on a process that will allow ex-UOTC OCdts to join the TA as soldiers (i.e. not as an Officer) without the need to complete all TSC(A). Until that policy is released, ATC(P) and 5 Trg Regt RLC will not be able to accept UOTC trained soldiers.

 

[Red7]

This really is a surreal situation, I transferred from an OTC to TA unit with MTQ 1&2 complete with no problems at all.

I also taught myself CBRN drills from a 1985 version of the Survive to Fight pam, so maybe something does need to be sorted out!

Is that email referring to a UOTC cadet that hasn't passed MTQ 1 but was mistakenly processed as a transferee by any chance? I was under the impression that a 'trained soldier' is a 'trained soldier' in regards to OTC/TA transfers.

 

[Bailey]

Is that email referring to a UOTC cadet that hasn't passed MTQ 1 but was mistakenly processed as a transferee by any chance? I was under the impression that a 'trained soldier' is a 'trained soldier' in regards to OTC/TA transfers.

No mistake, a trained solder is indeed a trained soldier, but a UOTC OCdt is a UOTC OCdt (not a trained soldier) as indeed an ACF cadet is an ACF cadet.

 

[chocolate_frog]

So what is teh point of the UOTC?

Surely it should be able offer (in two to three or more years) the chance for the OCDTs to skip 6 weekends and two weeks worth of training...

 

[telec]

So what is teh point of the UOTC?

Recruiting (and not by stealth). Not sure about how the other units are going, but as of next October, noone at my UOTC goes beyond MTQ1 unless they've booked an AOSB attendance of some description (thanks to SDSR or one of the affiliated studies.)

We also take some of the TA officers from the area for their initial 6 weekends, or something like that. They didn't go into much depth about that part.

 

[chocolate_frog]

If it that blatant now, is it time for the UOTC to actually do the bit in their title... train Officers whilst at University for instant use in the TA or maybe a shortened course at RMAS ie CC, PQOCC, LECC, TACC, OTCCC.

 

[Buttonz-UK]

Just to keep this thread updated.

Upon receiving the joining instructions from TSC (A) and contacting the training department for TSC (A) based at Malta Barracks, under exceptions parts 7 (B) Ocdts are EXEMPT from TSC (A) and should complete TSC (B) if joining the infantry only.

This was found in the joining instructions pack sent by the Initial Trg Gp. As far as i'm aware this still stands currently. Hope that clears things up for people and clarifys a reliable source.

 

[QRK2]

Just to keep this thread updated.

Upon receiving the joining instructions from TSC (A) and contacting the training department for TSC (A) based at Malta Barracks, under exceptions parts 7 (B) Ocdts are EXEMPT from TSC (A) and should complete TSC (B) if joining the infantry only.

This was found in the joining instructions pack sent by the Initial Trg Gp. As far as i'm aware this still stands currently. Hope that clears things up for people and clarifys a reliable source.

There is a new policy out which makes is very clear what UOTC training counts for, and it's not as simple as that, not least as it varies depending on how long is is since the individual was in the UOTC.

 

[Ex_Pompadour]

The new policy has been issued and is in force.

The key to this is when you passed your MLDP1 or 2 or Module 3 qualification, not when you last trained or when you left the OTC.

Only passed MLDP 1? If within 12 months, then retest at RTC and progress to TSC(Inf) or TSC(B) or Module 2. If more than 12 months, start again at TSC(A).

Only passed MLDP2? If within 12 months, then retest at RTC and progress to Module 3 or TSC(B) or CIC. If more than 12 months, start again at TSC(A).

Passed Module 3? If 7-12 months ago then retest at RTC and then repeat Module 3 or go to TSC(B) or CIC. If 13-24 months, retest at RTC and restart TAPO training at Module 2 or go to TSC(B) or CIC.

If you fail the retests, then its off to TSC(A) for you.

If you are from a non-infantry sub-unit of an OTC and joining an infantry TA unit as a soldier, then you have to do the TSC(Inf) weekends before CIC.

 

[waitout]

Don't suppose you can point me to a link for the policy on DII?