UK Transport Crisis?

I have lurked on here for a long time and have never joined a forum before but this subject makes my blood boil.

I have driven HGV’s for nearly 30 years of every type except for mixers, would I do it again – NEVER!

I will give you a bit of my background, 6-7 years ago I had part of a load hit me on my bonce, the load was secured properly by me and also had internal curtains restraining the load but these didn’t quite fit the length of the load space -industry standard at the time and may still be!

At the time I was with an Agency working for a firm, result sick pay of @£56 per week and had to sue the firm for compensation after they filed for insolvency two days later. Did the Jobcentre help me -did they f***! I got nowt and still do.

During the fight for compo I was sent for various scans etc. and they found I suffered from sleep apnea so lost my licence until it was sorted, during this time my licence needed renewal and my old style National & International CPC that I studied bloody hard for was worthless and I needed 40 hours of EU mandated training oh and a bloody medical because I reached the magical age of five oh. Who was expected to pay for all this – yep Joe Muggins.

If you wonder why there is a driver shortage just look at the conditions any driver has to endure.

I have started work at every hour of the day and finished likewise, finished your day in less than 8 hours and pointy shoes in the office will send you out again to max out your hours – can’t have a lowly driver doing less hours than him. One spotty so called Transport Manager fresh from Uni told me “not to ask me any questions about my truck as he didn’t know one end from another”

Expected to drive something that should either be in a museum or sent to Africa as scrap while Billy Bigballs who owns the Company has a new top of the Range Rover or BMW while paying you the bare minimum he can get away with, also applies to 95% of transport companies. I have been supplied with work boots ONCE in all my years or been given a tenner towards them if I gave them the receipt – no doubt so Billy Bigballs can claim it off his tax.

EVERY other road user treats you as scum, if you have never cut into a HGV’s braking capability just so you can save a few seconds or had to beat that wagon on the roundabout or traffic lights well done you – you are a dying breed.

I challenge any of you to do a days work either as a distance driver of on multidrop around any large town or city in this country and find somewhere to park during the day that allows you to also answer the calls of nature and find something to eat, no local clowncil wants a lorry park.

Imagine every where you go during the day and every a***hole asking where you have been you should be here thirty minutes ago or so and so does it so much quicker- well bully for them.

Aldi & Lidl even wanted you to unload at one time I don’t know if that is still the case, asking them if they would drive the truck back to base usually got the same answer.

Who wants to work 15 hour days or 60+ hours a week and take home the same as someone in Tesco’s in the warm & dry doing 40 hours, Hey there is a pandemic you can now work longer hours if you deliver food and want to.

Name any other occupation where enforcement of rules is actively carried out against your profession so rigorously every day, because I can’t think of one, nor can I think of one where I could earn the same driving a truck in 2015 as I could earn in a factory in 1988.

Everything you own has been on a truck driven by that piece of s**t in front of you that is now in your way, that same person everyone from the top downwards has dumped on. I learnt the hard way don’t take no s**t from anyone especially Mr Security who says your too early and go away – no problem see you another day perhaps because you ain’t getting it today now. Oh how the tables have turned.

Mr/Mrs We must follow the EU Rules, Mr Foreign Driver doing it for less, Mr Billy Big Balls, Mr Pointy Shoes, Mr Enforcement, Mr Local Councillor, Mr Warehouse Bod, Mr Security, Mr Roaduser and Mr I am more important than you, you are ALL to blame and I for one am glad it has finally come.

Keep s***ing on the downtrodden in that hole and the s*** piles up and he climbs out.

You might think automation is going to come to your rescue, just don’t put your house on it.

I missed all 3 of my kids growing up and it won’t happen to my Grandkids.

Still wonder why no one wants to drive a truck? Would you do it?

Sorry for the long winded rant.
ssshhhhhh, stop talking like that or you'll be called a 'Socialist' long may it continue...eventually it might lead to scrapping 'In Work Benefits' people shouldn't be kept afloat by public finance, it's the employers responsibility. If you can'y make sufficient profit whilst paying your staff a decent wage, then you shouldn't expect to a) be in business b) reduce profits...
 
collecting data
So does TESCO,
Translating that data into driverless vehicles is something else,
The brain to look after, control and act on that data is the clever bit,
it's also the hardest
I totally agree. Tesco collects data to increase its sales. The loyalty cards are not really about rewarding you, it's about what you buy and how they can pitch the next sale. It helps them put the right stock in the right shops at the right time.

Everyone laughed when Elon Musk said he was going to send people to Mars. Anyone laughing now? He is a man that can do things. His rockets are, quite literally, out of this world and the work he is doing will end up putting people there. Not yet, but they will go.

He is going to revolutionise transport too. His company is analysing that data and learning, every bloody day.
 

Truxx

LE
One thing they should be doing right now to help with the driver shortage is to scrap the requirement for a driver who is only going to drive in the U.K. to have the pointless drivers CPC card.
I personally lost 9 drivers who were farmers who drove for us in their quiet periods. It was the same with lots of old lads who did a few days a month of weekend cover.They all said bollox to the expense and wasted time of non courses that has generated a whole industry of non productive wasters to staff it.
Do that and you instantly expand the pool of available part timers by thousands.
And yet the RHA did not put that bleeding obvious one on the list.

Proper (free) rastplatze

Toilets and showers esp for ladies

Shitcan speed limiters set at 56 (or less) and set them at 60 (the legal limit in UK) instantly meaning a 10% reduction in trucks required for a given total tonnage over a given distance

Bin EWTD in favour of simple drivers hours.
 

anglo

LE
I totally agree. Tesco collects data to increase its sales. The loyalty cards are not really about rewarding you, it's about what you buy and how they can pitch the next sale. It helps them put the right stock in the right shops at the right time.

Everyone laughed when Elon Musk said he was going to send people to Mars. Anyone laughing now? He is a man that can do things. His rockets are, quite literally, out of this world and the work he is doing will end up putting people there. Not yet, but they will go.

He is going to revolutionise transport too. His company is analysing that data and learning, every bloody day.
I don't doubt driverless vehicles will come about, I don't dispute that,
What I dispute is the when.
 
I totally agree. Tesco collects data to increase its sales. The loyalty cards are not really about rewarding you, it's about what you buy and how they can pitch the next sale. It helps them put the right stock in the right shops at the right time.

Everyone laughed when Elon Musk said he was going to send people to Mars. Anyone laughing now? He is a man that can do things. His rockets are, quite literally, out of this world and the work he is doing will end up putting people there. Not yet, but they will go.

He is going to revolutionise transport too. His company is analysing that data and learning, every bloody day.
I’m sorry but I hear this great sunlit uplands sales pitch over and over again.
Im no Luddite, I was involved in the flying game for the major part of my life. Flying bus driving lends itself to automation. ( in an airway there is very few things to hit and they all talk to each other with transponders.)
Haulage , is a subject I know a lot about , especially in the U.K.
In the wide open interstates of the US of A, automated Platooning over long distances may well have a place. And I have little doubt the likes of Jeff Bezos will be able to buy the acquiescence of politicians to alter state laws where necessary to cover for the equipments inadequacies . likewise mr Musk will probably get his way there.
However in the crowded complicated British isles with its very convoluted supply chains , the subject of which I and a number of us on here know a great deal about. We from a coal,face experience see huge problems for the kit that simply are decades away from being anywhere near safe enough to be let loose in our unregulated world .and even then will need huge and costly rebuilding of the whole system , possibly in ways that are no way near cost effective on their own merits but will be necessary for the automated kit to function at all. None of this you address but just keep banging on about” it’s the future”
To what end? A vast amount of spend on new infrastructure, So we can create a new class of unemployed whose skills are no longer needed which we will need to pay for ! But DHL’s profit margin will be up a little.
Here at big weights it’s going to be a niche toy with very expensive insurance premiums
 

Daz

LE
Can't see the Inland Revenue letting that one go, even if it means a lower tax take coming in

IR35 is here to stay unfortunately, even if it will lead to a less flexible, less mobile workforce
Can't see the Inland Revenue letting that one go, even if it means a lower tax take coming in

IR35 is here to stay unfortunately, even if it will lead to a less flexible, less mobile workforce
Considering that was one of the forces for driving driver rates down, for the company it was great, no NI to pay, no holiday pay, no sick pay etc I can see why companies liked it, but for a driver it was really a false pay rate, not to mention it contributed to the tax gap which HMRC has been tasked to reduce.

And as an aside, DVSA has stated that unless the driver operates the truck under his own O license anyone employing Ltd company drivers would be in breach of their O license as a general rule.

"Senior Traffic Commissioner, Richard Turfitt, included a section on “Employees” within his Statutory Guidance, in which he stated:

“In road haulage, it is rare for someone to be genuinely self-employed [a Ltd Company contractor] unless they are an Owner-Driver.”

For rare, insert "sod all chance"
 
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syrup

LE
Just been speaking to one of my hauliers

They've been quoted £20 p/h Mon - Fri day rate for drivers.

As someone who has moved from the Transport Manager Role in to general Logistics I'm kind of glad it's happened.
Plenty of multi millionaires out there who've made a mint out of driving down wages so they can undercut other hauliers
 

jarrod248

LE
Gallery Guru
I agree , our GP practice use e-consult to weed out the usual suspects, the practice had one GP physically in the premises and the remainder available by video call from home/Pub.
The only staff that permanently remained in the front line were the nursing staff and the admin ladies.
If anything it has been easier to get an appointment to see a GP.
Definitely will change how we work as loads can be done by phone.
 

Truxx

LE
I’m sorry but I hear this great sunlit uplands sales pitch over and over again.
Im no Luddite, I was involved in the flying game for the major part of my life. Flying bus driving lends itself to automation. ( in an airway there is very few things to hit and they all talk to each other with transponders.)
Haulage , is a subject I know a lot about , especially in the U.K.
In the wide open interstates of the US of A, automated Platooning over long distances may well have a place. And I have little doubt the likes of Jeff Bezos will be able to buy the acquiescence of politicians to alter state laws where necessary to cover for the equipments inadequacies . likewise mr Musk will probably get his way there.
However in the crowded complicated British isles with its very convoluted supply chains , the subject of which I and a number of us on here know a great deal about. We from a coal,face experience see huge problems for the kit that simply are decades away from being anywhere near safe enough to be let loose in our unregulated world .and even then will need huge and costly rebuilding of the whole system , possibly in ways that are no way near cost effective on their own merits but will be necessary for the automated kit to function at all. None of this you address but just keep banging on about” it’s the future”
To what end? A vast amount of spend on new infrastructure, So we can create a new class of unemployed whose skills are no longer needed which we will need to pay for ! But DHL’s profit margin will be up a little.
Here at big weights it’s going to be a niche toy with very expensive insurance premiums
I defy anyone who can come up with an automated truck that can manage Canterbury on any day, let alone a Friday.

I did it once. Holy schermoley. Next time it will be 3 in the morning.
 

Daz

LE
Just been speaking to one of my hauliers

They've been quoted £20 p/h Mon - Fri day rate for drivers.

As someone who has moved from the Transport Manager Role in to general Logistics I'm kind of glad it's happened.
Plenty of multi millionaires out there who've made a mint out of driving down wages so they can undercut other hauliers
That's cheap
 

No Boots

Swinger
ssshhhhhh, stop talking like that or you'll be called a 'Socialist' long may it continue...eventually it might lead to scrapping 'In Work Benefits' people shouldn't be kept afloat by public finance, it's the employers responsibility. If you can'y make sufficient profit whilst paying your staff a decent wage, then you shouldn't expect to a) be in business b) reduce profits...
Socialist, how very dare you.
I wouldn't vote for them clowns if my c**k was in a guillotine.
My Brother is a rep for unite who voted for flabbot to be leader, pffft, even he doesn't talk politics as he always is loses the arguement.
All this automation talk is all very good for a select few hauliers who do trunking, RDC's etc but it will not work for say AO or any big ticket delivery firms.
I can't see anyone getting a text message saying your delivery is in the truck outside your door or at the top of your too narrow road, knock yourself out unloading it.
Who grows up now and says I want to drive a truck? let alone spend £££'s to qualify and earn £10-12 per hour.
Everyone in the industry have to accept they are part of the problem including agencies taking around 30% of the drivers rate, it's been a race to the bottom and drivers have paid the price for being thick as pigs***t and saying nowt.
 
Is this a case of TESCO trying to use this as a means of claiming green credentials?

 
Yep! Right across the employment spectrum!

I can recall bricklayers earning £160 a day roughly 25 years ago and Polish bricklayers touting themselves around the sites for £30 a day.

Most other manual workers suffered similar fates as the Eastern European’s started queuing up to get in.

I recall reading of a bus company winning a contract to run bus services in Norfolk somewhere and their recruitment team jumping straight on a plane to Poland to recruit drivers despite there being loads of locally based bus drivers where the new contract was looking for work.

A friends lawyer wife went to Poland for a few days work for a company and when she arrived at her hotel, they told her that due to a problem with the room, she was being moved to a sister hotel for the first night but would be brought back to her original hotel the following evening.

The hotel also told her half jokingly that the unexpected move was her fault. When she enquired just how she was to blame for it, the response was that all the Polish plumbers were now working in London!

The reason Blair didn’t hang about letting them all in was partly because he was seriously lobbied big time by various industries to open the gates of the UK to cheap Labour from abroad.

If companies have now got to up wages to get the job done, good luck to the people doing the work finally getting decent wages!
Exactly!
And it was a so called Labour government, the party of the working man, that did it.
Shameful.
 
Socialist, how very dare you.
I wouldn't vote for them clowns if my c**k was in a guillotine.
My Brother is a rep for unite who voted for flabbot to be leader, pffft, even he doesn't talk politics as he always is loses the arguement.
All this automation talk is all very good for a select few hauliers who do trunking, RDC's etc but it will not work for say AO or any big ticket delivery firms.
I can't see anyone getting a text message saying your delivery is in the truck outside your door or at the top of your too narrow road, knock yourself out unloading it.
Who grows up now and says I want to drive a truck? let alone spend £££'s to qualify and earn £10-12 per hour.
Everyone in the industry have to accept they are part of the problem including agencies taking around 30% of the drivers rate, it's been a race to the bottom and drivers have paid the price for being thick as pigs***t and saying nowt.
Like I said, don't agree to readily with the situation of workers suddenly finding they actually do have a say in wage levels, and that as 'Foreign Workers' from the EU have been shut out, then what some have been saying about the use of EU workers, to artificially restrain wage levels was true all along...That's Socialism Comrade...but don't tell anyone I said that....
 
I've not read the whole thread, so sorry if this has already been covered.

This "crisis" is only going to be short term, in the grand scheme of things. Like many roles, the way out is already off the drawing board and actually being tested. Indeed, the Government has already changed the laws to allow full blown testing to take place in the UK.



What does this mean? In the medium term, the long distance trunking routes will be automated. No need for the trucks to stop for rest breaks, no worries is they are caught in traffic and driving hours start to come into play. Make no mistake, big companies are going to go for this as soon as the technology is sorted. They'd be mad not to. Yes the machinery will be eye wateringly expensive to start, but no staff overheads, no training, no NI payments, no pensions to worry about, no sickness, no disciplinary issues.....what's not for them to like.

These machines will run 24 hours a day only stopping to load/unload and fuel up (think electric for this, and they will sort out the tech so that they can charge during the loading/unloading downtime.

It's going to take longer for the multidrop stuff, but again, it will come.

It's going to cut down times on the long distance routes (just think, routes from the south of Europe to the UK only stopping to recharge.


It's happening across many walks of life. The militant underground drivers have all but sealed their own fate too!


Not without it's own problems to be overcome, but you can see why it's an attractive proposition for TFL. No more strikes, no more pay rises.
I've posted this photo in another thread, but this is the result of predictive braking.
This is what happens when a computer decides to brake for you at 55 mph.
Our driver, miraculously, walked away from this.
This is why I disengage this 'safety' feature every time I start the engine.

Bhl.jpg
 
I've posted this photo in another thread, but this is the result of predictive braking.
This is what happens when a computer decides to brake for you at 55 mph.
Our driver, miraculously, walked away from this.
This is why I disengage this 'safety' feature every time I start the engine.

View attachment 580586
I used your pic a few posts ago stew to illustrate the joys of EBS.!
delighted to hear your lad is ok.
is he framing the underpants?!!.
 
I used your pic a few posts ago stew to illustrate the joys of EBS.!
delighted to hear your lad is ok.
is he framing the underpants?!!.
Sorry, never saw your post.
Eddie is a biker, I think he now wears the pants with pride :-D
 
Is this a case of TESCO trying to use this as a means of claiming green credentials?

So it needs trucks at one end to take containers to the train, and more trucks at the other end to pick them up, when the same container could have been trucked all the way?
 
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