UK to allow Chinese into 5G network

@PFGEN The west as a whole seems to have forgot when buying cheap you get what you pay for, In my experience and I suspect I am not alone in this. That go cheap and you tend to end up buying twice.

But then I'm not a economist, what would I know.

Its a direct rip off of a unit made by a company owned by a friend of mine. It's a Chinese copy right down to a coupe of faults.
Colour me surprised.

Sad is it not, that I doubt your friends company is the only one that finds themselves operating in a market where they have to compete against their own product...
 
Trump is currently in Japan twisting their arm over trade and threatening to impose massive tariffs on Japanese cars and auto parts on "national security" grounds.
www.cbc.ca/news/world/trump-japan-visit-trade-1.5149911?cmp=rss
Behind the smiles and personal friendship, however, there is deep uneasiness over Trump's threat to impose tariffs on Japanese autos and auto parts on national security grounds. Such a move would be more devastating to the Japanese economy than earlier tariffs on steel and aluminum.
No doubt the devious Japanese were about to send the command signal for all "their" cars in the US to smash into everything else on the road, causing complete carnage in a second Pearl Harbour attack. Fortunately those far seeing American national security chaps have nipped that one in the bud.
 
Huawei have been kicked out of the SD Association, who set the standards for memory cards, on the orders of the US government.
Huawei's voice in future tech standards restricted
Huawei also has disappeared from the member list of the SD Association, which is known for developing the standards of the SD Card, the most popular memory card format used in portable devices.
"The SD Association is complying with U.S. Department of Commerce orders," the group told Nikkei in a statement on Friday.
One industry analyst notes that in future Chinese tech companies will choose to join in on standards processes being led by the EU or Japan rather than the US.
"It is foreseeable that Chinese tech companies will choose not to join the technology alliances led by the U.S. in the future," amid the ripple effect of the ban on Huawei, Jonah Cheng, chief investment officer at J & J Investment, and a former veteran tech analyst at UBS, told Nikkei.

Apart from the possibility that China would develop its own standards, it would be more attractive to Chinese companies to join the open standard-setting alliances led by the European Union or Japan rather than those led by the Americans, Cheng said.
The US doesn't seem to be even pretending any more that it's about anything other than trade leverage.
 
D

Deleted 24582

Guest
Huawei have been kicked out of the SD Association, who set the standards for memory cards, on the orders of the US government.
Huawei's voice in future tech standards restricted


One industry analyst notes that in future Chinese tech companies will choose to join in on standards processes being led by the EU or Japan rather than the US.


The US doesn't seem to be even pretending any more that it's about anything other than trade leverage.
China is the enemy.


As Trade Tensions Rise, Fewer Americans See China Favorably

National Security encompasses many aspects. Trade is one of the vital ones.

The Chinese stock has fallen rather badly here. It will only get worse. But Donald
was an idiot If he thought this would end quickly. It will be a protracted battle, but hey “No Sacrifice, No Victory”.
 

pdq_bar

Swinger
While ago I was asked to join a panel at an industry meeting on solar cell technology. I was the novelty act. The captains of industry were all yakking on about how they were going to make shed loads of cash selling production machinery to the Chinese. I stood up and told them they were idiots and just how long did they think that business model would last. There was a short pause before the laughter started. How could the idiot be so stupid and normal jogging commenced. They ain't laughing now, every single company at that meeting no longer exists. The Chinese took delivery of what they were shipped and cloned the lot.

In 2001, I worked for a textile machine manufacturer in Bradford. (The electronics on these machines is pretty sophisticated - Switched reluctance drives - very complex control systems and capable of being controlled by many different types of comms. Our biggest competition was an Italian firm who had exactly that happen - sold three looms and then about 6 months later out came a Chinese version. Our kit was also cloned and the Chinese market for us dried up as well. Both companies went out of business early 2000s.
Was a bit of a wake up call.
 
HARDtalk's Zeinab Badawi speaks to Robert Strayer, US Deputy Assistant Secretary for Cyber and Communications. How dangerous is the superpower rivalry in technology and information? Currently there is much focus on the tensions between the US and China over the Chinese tech giant Huawei. Washington says the Chinese can't be trusted because they may use their technology infrastructure for spying. Beijing says this is nonsense. Strayer is on a mission to dissuade Europeans from doing business with Huawei. But is Washington losing the cyberwar?

30 minutes

BBC World News - HARDtalk, Robert Strayer

Scheduled repeats: BBC World News - HARDtalk - Next on
A podcast of the show will probably appear here: BBC World Service - HARDtalk - Downloads
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
Western world lost its edge in the telecom world at the start of the century when people were falling over themselves to offshore predominantly to China. That started the race to the bottom. The West thought it would maintain an edge through keeping R&D, design etc in their own countries. Who thought that would be a winner needs their collective heads seen too.

In a game of numbers we can't win on paper. The Chinese have too many students going through university and engineering schools compared to us. They're also in it for the long term. They send their best students to universities in the West where they are masters of soaking up knowledge.

That said not all they produce in China is of the quality we have in the west. They still have an inherent flaw in that just good enough is sufficient. End result is that a lot of their kit is still shit and that includes Huawei. At home I have a fibre optic link installed by the national operator. The ONU is made by ZTE. Its a direct rip off of a unit made by a company owned by a friend of mine. It's a Chinese copy right down to a coupe of faults. Does the national operator give a flying f..k, not likely because it's cheaper. Of course its cheaper, if you don't have to pay for the R&D then its going to be cheaper. The gateway I was provided was from Huawei. I'd have to try really hard to find one that's worse. That was binned with the derision it deserved.

While ago I was asked to join a panel at an industry meeting on solar cell technology. I was the novelty act. The captains of industry were all yakking on about how they were going to make shed loads of cash selling production machinery to the Chinese. I stood up and told them they were idiots and just how long did they think that business model would last. There was a short pause before the laughter started. How could the idiot be so stupid and normal jogging commenced. They ain't laughing now, every single company at that meeting no longer exists. The Chinese took delivery of what they were shipped and cloned the lot.

At the moment the current Chinese philosophy is to use the capital they have gained to buy companies in the West. They send out delegations on what are essentially shopping expeditions. Our governments seem only too happy to welcome them in the name of international relations. Oh dear, its not going to end well. In some countries I've been sent to its not just been tech but minerals. Anybody want to take a guess as to how much of Africa is essentially owned by China. Next targets there I suspect are South Africa and Zimbabwe.

Huawei and 5G is just the tip of the iceberg and it's only because the orange one has finally asked a few questions that some people are finally waking up to the reality of what has been going on for a long time.
Perhaps if the orange one had asked the question in a less belligerent, more subtle manner... sadly, it’s not his style.

I see what you’re describing happening all over. ‘Strategic partnerships’ and technology-exchange initiatives which are entirely one-way.
 
Maajid Nawaz is discussing this on LBC 12:00 -14:00 and asks "Are we handing too much power to China?"
He assesses that China is in a pre-colonial state and believes that it 5G is part of their geostrategic aims. Maajid say's he doesn't know the tech side but whether 5G and other critical infrastructure allows them to spy on the UK or not, giving a totalitarian one party communist state a monopoly on our infrastructure is a serious mistake.

One caller worked on installations for 40 years and tells him to calm down as it's the way the networks are built that makes them secure. He conceded the geopolitical argument.

LBC UK - Listen Live | Global Player
 
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I, for one, welcome our new insect (eating) overlords.

SWMBO has a Huawei phone. I pity the poor peasant who has to scroll through her daily usage.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
Maajid Nawaz is discussing this on LBC 12:00 -14:00 and asks "Are we handing too much power to China?"
He assesses that China is in a pre-colonial state and believes that it 5G is part of their geostrategic aims. Maajid say's he doesn't know the tech side but whether 5G and other critical infrastructure allows them to spy on the UK or not, giving a totalitarian one party communist state a monopoly on our infrastructure is a serious mistake.

One caller worked on installations for 40 years and tells him to calm down as it's the way the networks are built that makes them secure. He conceded the geopolitical argument.

LBC UK - Listen Live | Global Player
Pre-colonial? They’ve already bought up half of Africa.

We’re strategic Pygmies by comparison.
 
Pre-colonial? They’ve already bought up half of Africa.

We’re strategic Pygmies by comparison.
His take on colonial is when their assets come under threat and they resort to military force to protect those investments. The financial aspect is not as important as the long march.

ETA Ian Payne had some callers who think the backlash against Huawei is a racist imperialist agenda. Well there are some familiar expressions.. I wonder what their political leanings are?,

There seem a remarkable number of callers and texters who claim to have installed Huawei kit. Some say it's no problem and well tested.
 
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There is a short interview by CBC Radio with someone from RUSI on the Huawei decision here:
CBC News: The House with Chris Hall
It runs from 1:30 to about 9:00 and is worth listening to. Click on the link with "Jan. 25, 2020: UK limits Huawei in British 5G networks, but could Canada do the same?" and a player will open up at the bottom which lets you skip ahead and also adjust the volume.

Here's the CBC News summary of it.
U.K.'s proposal to limit Huawei's role in 5G networks most 'pragmatic' path, expert says

In short, James Sullivan, "a researcher at the Royal United Services Institute" said that this is a pragmatic decision. He said simply banning Huawei is not a "golden ticket to securing 5G networks", that it is important to have diversity of supply, and that no single vendor should be trusted. Good cyber security is part of the system design and will not come by simply picking a vendor based on political or feel-good factors. It is important to have a variety of vendors, and that economic factors such as cost should also not be ignored.

I recommend listening to the interview.
 
I, for one, welcome our new insect (eating) overlords.

SWMBO has a Huawei phone. I pity the poor peasant who has to scroll through her daily usage.
Our new BT fibre broadband router - Huawei label on the front.Engineer reckoned he’s installed hundreds of them.
 

Wordsmith

LE
Book Reviewer

Yokel

LE
Not saying much, but Huawei has been subject to scrutiny that will not be made public. It's commercially based, but I'd be surprised if the doughnut shaped building didn't take an interest in the results.

Wordsmith
I thought there was some sort of arrangement involving HM Government personnel being present on Huawei premises in order to carry out inspections and checks?

Or was that Lord Rifkind thinking out loud?
 

endure

GCM
Our new BT fibre broadband router - Huawei label on the front.Engineer reckoned he’s installed hundreds of them.
The majority of the Openreach street cabinets are Huawei too
 

endure

GCM

Yokel

LE
The majority of the Openreach street cabinets are Huawei too
Is all Huawei equipment produced in China or do they have manufacturing in the West? If they are a global player than that probably means global manufacturing operations.

What sort of presence do they have in the UK - other than sales and support?
 
I thought there was some sort of arrangement involving HM Government personnel being present on Huawei premises in order to carry out inspections and checks?
If that is a perceived arrangement then there is already a pretty big problem.
 

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