Type 31 Frigate

My next question, is there sufficient ASW equipment left over to fit out another 1 or 2 T26s?
No, 8 sets.

Non negotiable requirement is to generate enough high end escorts fir a CSG.
Everything else to be covered by low end non war fighters, aka T31 and OPVs who’s job will be to die bravely while the cavalry heads to them.
It’s no good save the RN abd others talking about getting more ships, the numbers in real terms of frigates will remain the same.
 
Surely only the ships which are actually operational need this fitted, and there will always be a couple in some sort of long term maintenance period, so 8 sets doesn't necessarily mean only 8 ships.
Unless - of course - it is the ASW equipment that is requiring the maintenance? ;)
 
Surely only the ships which are actually operational need this fitted, and there will always be a couple in some sort of long term maintenance period, so 8 sets doesn't necessarily mean only 8 ships.

If you have more ships fitted for but not with, you have a couple more very expensive ships.
If the RN hasn’t the penny’s to buy 5 T31’s at £1.25 Billion all up, ready to go, where does it find the best part of £2 Billion for a couple more T26?
 
If you have more ships fitted for but not with, you have a couple more very expensive ships.
If the RN hasn’t the penny’s to buy 5 T31’s at £1.25 Billion all up, ready to go, where does it find the best part of £2 Billion for a couple more T26?
The issue isn’t spare sets, it’s the number of systems that go with the sets.
I really wish you would make your mind up what the issue is.
 
I really wish you would make your mind up what the issue is.

The issue is MONEY, as in, they are blisteringly expensive at £1 Billion each, we don’t have none. Guess why T26 Is being built at such a painfully slow biennial drumbeat, they are designing an entire extra class of el cheapo Frigates to fill in the gaps. It doesn't matter if there were a dozen spare 2087 sets scuffing around, killing off the entire T31 programme of 5 Frigates would only generate enough money for ONE extra T26. 13 Frigates become 9. As as T45/T26 are being ring-fenced fir Carrier Strije, that means the RN is right out of the meaningful enduring presence and constabulary business.

Repeat after me, no one will be buying extra high end Frigate to grow the RN, any ‘growth’ will be in the number of OPVs.
 

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I really wish you would make your mind up what the issue is.
It varies dependant on what he hears a staff officer talking about at the coffee machine.
 
If you have more ships fitted for but not with, you have a couple more very expensive ships.
If the RN hasn’t the penny’s to buy 5 T31’s at £1.25 Billion all up, ready to go, where does it find the best part of £2 Billion for a couple more T26?
They'll have to get it from the same place as the 2 and a bit billion that T31 would actually cost in reality.
 
Apparently Babcock might close Appledore if they don’t win the 31 contract.

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No surprise,. The Carillion debacle cost Babcock dearly. From personal experience as a contractor Babcock were a damn sight more efficient than Carillion and have been at the crappy end of the MOD procurement stick.
 
Not sure how the Canada order for the T26 changes things, will BAES have enough SQEP to support all the T26 builds across the world and T31e?
From an industrial-strategy point of view having two capable builders and exporters of warships would be preferable, but Babcock's reputation is not great at the moment in MOD circles. Giving them the T31e order might be seen as rewarding failures in the support area.
 
Babcock (the acquisition of Appledore aside) are not - and never have been - a shipbuilder. They have some good people and some sub-optimal facilities for build. Trouble is they can't decide what they want to be and are caught between eyeing up the bunce and potential prestige that comes with the T31e (and its far from convincing export potential) and reconciling that with the capabilities and politics of their existing facilities.

The politics around Rosyth are about to become toxic again. You just have to read the transcript of the defence Select Ctte questioning of SoS last week to see that. Questioning in which SoS and the two VSOs with him, came across as deeply unimpressive by the way. Being savaged by John Spellar of all people is not a good look. Nor is being unable to correct Ruth Smeeth.

A number of people seem to think that the purpose of the T31 is to keep Rosyth open until the first QEC docking is required. Conveniently ignoring the fact you could dock it elsewhere in the UK. Or even overseas......
 
. . . . The politics around Rosyth are about to become toxic again. You just have to read the transcript of the defence Select Ctte questioning of SoS last week to see that. Questioning in which SoS and the two VSOs with him, came across as deeply unimpressive by the way. Being savaged by John Spellar of all people is not a good look . . . .
Mmmm . . . That was a very good read !!
 
Babcock (the acquisition of Appledore aside) are not - and never have been - a shipbuilder. They have some good people and some sub-optimal facilities for build. Trouble is they can't decide what they want to be and are caught between eyeing up the bunce and potential prestige that comes with the T31e (and its far from convincing export potential) and reconciling that with the capabilities and politics of their existing facilities.

The politics around Rosyth are about to become toxic again. You just have to read the transcript of the defence Select Ctte questioning of SoS last week to see that. Questioning in which SoS and the two VSOs with him, came across as deeply unimpressive by the way. Being savaged by John Spellar of all people is not a good look. Nor is being unable to correct Ruth Smeeth.

A number of people seem to think that the purpose of the T31 is to keep Rosyth open until the first QEC docking is required. Conveniently ignoring the fact you could dock it elsewhere in the UK. Or even overseas......
I thought the idea of type 31 was to keep an English yard open in the event the neverendum goes to Yes
 

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