Turkish army chief wants Iraq op
- Thread starter whitecity
- Start date
THis could get interesting......
Who would the US back?
Who would the iranians back?
Who would the Syrians back?
What price a barrel of oil?
What effect on the surge, when every Kurdish Solider, fcuk off stright up north to take on the Turks. I can just see the Sunni's extracting maximum pain in Kirkuk and Mosul......
Who would the US back?
Who would the iranians back?
Who would the Syrians back?
What price a barrel of oil?
What effect on the surge, when every Kurdish Solider, fcuk off stright up north to take on the Turks. I can just see the Sunni's extracting maximum pain in Kirkuk and Mosul......
The Turkish military have been making noises about invading Northern Iraq for a while now, why has it ballooned up now?
If the Turkish military do stage a coup how will the Americans react? It would totally screw up there application for membership of the EU and make resolution regarding Cyprus very difficult.
If the Turkish military do stage a coup how will the Americans react? It would totally screw up there application for membership of the EU and make resolution regarding Cyprus very difficult.
Here's the current official US State Department view...
State Department Press Briefing, 12 April 2007
State Department Press Briefing, 12 April 2007
You guys need to go back through ypour BBC monitoring unit reports. Nobody probably bothers to read this any more.
Iran, Iraq and Turkey all used to mount cross border operations in this region over the last 30 years. They were always carefully co-ordinated so that earch army was deconflicted in terms of time and space so that they never confronted each other. Because it was tucked away, your media ( apart from BBC Caversham park) never noticed it.
This is only coming to light now because the loose american cannon has entered the equation, perhaps EU membership might be tipping the issue as well??
Iran, Iraq and Turkey all used to mount cross border operations in this region over the last 30 years. They were always carefully co-ordinated so that earch army was deconflicted in terms of time and space so that they never confronted each other. Because it was tucked away, your media ( apart from BBC Caversham park) never noticed it.
This is only coming to light now because the loose american cannon has entered the equation, perhaps EU membership might be tipping the issue as well??
Here is a little tale of Kurdish doings:
http://www.rawstory.com/showoutarti...om/news/feature/2007/04/Kurdistan_Shlomi.html
http://www.rawstory.com/showoutarti...om/news/feature/2007/04/Kurdistan_Shlomi.html
True but according to the Turkish Press (no idea if this is the Scotsman or news of the world in Turkey) the military has been voicing rather loudly its wish for a secular president. Take into account that the president is elected by Parliament, a parliament currently 2 thirds controlled by members of the former Islamic party ousted in the late 90s. The military, academics and lawyers donât want a religious presence within the state, yet the "Islamic cronies with secret plans" control the government. The Turkish military has flexed its muscles before when it didnât like the government, why not again? And if it does whatâs saying its new found pair of brass ones one mean some holidays over the border for some units? Take into account the elections happen at the start of May then things be me interesting pretty soon.
http://www.turkishpress.com/news.asp?id=171049
http://www.turkishpress.com/news.asp?id=171049
The Kurds want a state, and at the moment they see the US as shielding them so they can establish one - hidden behind the figleaf of "federalism".
Trouble is, the Turks, Iranians and those Iraqi politicians currently not spread over their Parliamentary dining room all agree that they're not going to get one. You will see them co-ordinate their operations as they have done before.
The US is in a bit of a pickle here - it can back the Kurds - staunch defenders of female circumcision, errm sorry I mean freedom and democracy and keen members of Peshmerga death squads getting payback on the Sunnis, errm sorry I mean the Iraqi Army or a member of NATO robustly pursuing terrorists who murder civilians within their borders errm or do I mean a nation state seeking to sort out troublesome ethnic minorities using methods they developed on the Armenians and Assyrians a century or so ago.
I believe the phrase is "sh!t sandwich".
In the short term in Turkey I see the decision depending on the outcome of the arguments between those who seek to play the long game, simply wait for the US to leave then do the deed while the world watches the rest of Iraq burn and those who want to go and mallet the terrorists right now and screw the US, if it really is a war on terror then shut up and step aside Uncle Sam.
Trouble is, the Turks, Iranians and those Iraqi politicians currently not spread over their Parliamentary dining room all agree that they're not going to get one. You will see them co-ordinate their operations as they have done before.
The US is in a bit of a pickle here - it can back the Kurds - staunch defenders of female circumcision, errm sorry I mean freedom and democracy and keen members of Peshmerga death squads getting payback on the Sunnis, errm sorry I mean the Iraqi Army or a member of NATO robustly pursuing terrorists who murder civilians within their borders errm or do I mean a nation state seeking to sort out troublesome ethnic minorities using methods they developed on the Armenians and Assyrians a century or so ago.
I believe the phrase is "sh!t sandwich".
In the short term in Turkey I see the decision depending on the outcome of the arguments between those who seek to play the long game, simply wait for the US to leave then do the deed while the world watches the rest of Iraq burn and those who want to go and mallet the terrorists right now and screw the US, if it really is a war on terror then shut up and step aside Uncle Sam.
Well said One_of_the_strange,
This will ultimately unravel when the US:
a) is forced to take sides - which it has to do as everything needs to be a black and white equation, and/or
b) makes self-interest policy changes (based upon domestic considerations) and is thus 'forced' to find a quick 'solution'.
If we look at Kosovo as a precedent, the end game does not look rosy!
This will ultimately unravel when the US:
a) is forced to take sides - which it has to do as everything needs to be a black and white equation, and/or
b) makes self-interest policy changes (based upon domestic considerations) and is thus 'forced' to find a quick 'solution'.
If we look at Kosovo as a precedent, the end game does not look rosy!
The Kirkuk referendum time bomb
TODAY'S EDITORIAL
March 5, 2007
One of the most important yet underreported stories about Iraq is the situation in Kirkuk, where Shi'ite and Sunni, ethnic Turkmen and even Christian Arabs and the government of Turkey are campaigning against efforts to incorporate the city into the Kurdish region. While international media attention is focused on Baghdad and Anbar province, the deteriorating security situation in northern Iraq -- home to some of the country's largest oil reserves and a region that has become a prime target of jihadist terror during the past 15 months -- has largely gone unnoticed. Iraq's 2006 constitution mandated that residents of Kirkuk are to vote on the future of the city, home to nearly 800,000 people, in a referendum that is scheduled to occur by Nov. 15.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/op-ed/20070304-093225-4817r.htm
TODAY'S EDITORIAL
March 5, 2007
One of the most important yet underreported stories about Iraq is the situation in Kirkuk, where Shi'ite and Sunni, ethnic Turkmen and even Christian Arabs and the government of Turkey are campaigning against efforts to incorporate the city into the Kurdish region. While international media attention is focused on Baghdad and Anbar province, the deteriorating security situation in northern Iraq -- home to some of the country's largest oil reserves and a region that has become a prime target of jihadist terror during the past 15 months -- has largely gone unnoticed. Iraq's 2006 constitution mandated that residents of Kirkuk are to vote on the future of the city, home to nearly 800,000 people, in a referendum that is scheduled to occur by Nov. 15.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/op-ed/20070304-093225-4817r.htm
As I understand it, the Turkish military is duty bound by Ataturk's constitution , to seize the helm and defend secular rule in Turkey, if need be. The other part of the precedent to remember is that - eventually - they handed it back.
The late, great Kemal Ataturk (who had an entire menagerie, all called Abdul*) understood Islam to be the brake holding his nation back from prosperity and a place in the modern world.
There's a thought.[hr]
* Monty Python's Flying Circus 'Fish Licence' sketch, circa 1970, IIRC
The late, great Kemal Ataturk (who had an entire menagerie, all called Abdul*) understood Islam to be the brake holding his nation back from prosperity and a place in the modern world.
There's a thought.[hr]
* Monty Python's Flying Circus 'Fish Licence' sketch, circa 1970, IIRC
Secularism hasnt got the Turks anywhere, certainly not into Europe after over forty years of trying.
Thankfully the Turks have now finally awakened to the fact that their destiny is East and always will be.
Ataturk might be a nationalist hero in Turkey but he's considered a heretic and traitor by most muslims for his role in ending the Caliphate.
His mausoleum is under extraordinary security for that reason.
Thankfully the Turks have now finally awakened to the fact that their destiny is East and always will be.
Ataturk might be a nationalist hero in Turkey but he's considered a heretic and traitor by most muslims for his role in ending the Caliphate.
His mausoleum is under extraordinary security for that reason.
The Dep PM of IRaq (the Kurdish one) has been speaking about it. I heard him on NPR, this week, warning the Turks not to mess with Kurdistan, IIRC it was 10 Apr 07, on during boardcast "Of the World". I can't find a link...but his comments and the Turkish spring offensive seem to upped the ante!
Don't foregt, a PKK fighter in Turkey is a terrorist, but when he is peshmegar in Baghdad he is a friend and if he trains in Iran....it is simple is he with us or against us?!
Don't foregt, a PKK fighter in Turkey is a terrorist, but when he is peshmegar in Baghdad he is a friend and if he trains in Iran....it is simple is he with us or against us?!
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