Train crashes in Lake District

#2
First press conference from on-site police & medics;

1 dead, 5 serious, 17 others in hospital

Investigating a set of points on the track

ADDED

Initial reports suggest that the structure of the carriages are intact; they did not crush or break into bits; saving many lives. Front of train snaked back on itself and all the carriages were derailed. Very little damage to the front locomotive, the window wasn’t even shattered!

The ambulance service seem to have played a blinder. Thankfully, most passengers were able to stumble down to a triage station. RAF hellos evacuated the most serious.
 
#3
Given the state of the train im v suprised there werent more fatalities. Very lucky to have walked away from that one!
 
F

fozzy

Guest
#4
Muckshifter said:
First press conference from on-site police & medics;

1 dead, 5 serious, 17 others in hospital

Investigating a set of points on the track

ADDED

Initial reports suggest that the structure of the carriages are intact; they did not crush or break into bits; saving many lives. Front of train snaked back on itself and all the carriages were derailed. Very little damage to the front locomotive, the window wasn’t even shattered!

The ambulance service seem to have played a blinder. Thankfully, most passengers were able to stumble down to a triage station. RAF hellos evacuated the most serious.
Yes - well done to all involved. The Pendolino trains are constructed to very high standards of crashworthiness, with crumplezones and reinforced components. Looks like excellent design saved lives here.

Also looks like it's going to be a bitch to clear up.
 
#5
Just want to say RIP to the lady who died! and a speedy recovery to those injured
 
#6
I was rather annoyed with the beeb going on about the fact that the emergency services had to use single track roads for access.

How dare there be an incident without direct motorway access.

RIP the lady that died but it could have been so much worse.
 

Ventress

LE
Moderator
#7
The BTP had units from all over the North, Scotland and Midlands attend, even London units. As usual a totally proffessional response to such a tragedy.

Great joint effort rom all the services.

Credit to the service.
 
#8
fozzy said:
Muckshifter said:
First press conference from on-site police & medics;

1 dead, 5 serious, 17 others in hospital

Investigating a set of points on the track

ADDED

Initial reports suggest that the structure of the carriages are intact; they did not crush or break into bits; saving many lives. Front of train snaked back on itself and all the carriages were derailed. Very little damage to the front locomotive, the window wasn’t even shattered!

The ambulance service seem to have played a blinder. Thankfully, most passengers were able to stumble down to a triage station. RAF hellos evacuated the most serious.
Yes - well done to all involved. The Pendolino trains are constructed to very high standards of crashworthiness, with crumplezones and reinforced components. Looks like excellent design saved lives here.

Also looks like it's going to be a bitch to clear up.
I take it they aren't built here in the UK then?

RIP to the deceased and condolences to her family
 
#9
Alstom's Washwood Heath works, Birmingham.
 
#10
HM rail inspectors look for evidence. They are looking carefully at a certain set of points (I seem to remember a similar problem with a set of points at Pottersbar). The line may be closed for days even week(s).

Sir Richard Branson has visited the people in hospital and the crash site, and has said the driver did more than most drivers would have done ‘he could have got up, and ran back to the next carriage where he would have been safer, but he stayed and tried to steer the train to safety’.

Paramedics call it a miracle that so few people where hurt, considering the number of people on the train.

Clean up process will be a nightmare, chief police officer has just stated ‘we will need to build a temporary road, so that we can get heavy lifting gear in, and have to lift the wreckage in a manner that doesn’t endanger the health and safety of the men clearing this up’.

And on a final note,
This is the second incident with virgin trains in the last 5 months with another virgin trains hitting a car and derailing. Also, if the points prove to be faulty then it’s the second time that points have caused deaths.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copmanthorpe_rail_crash
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grayrigg_rail_crash
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potters_Bar_rail_crash

Could this turn into another ‘Pottersbar’?
Where the maintenance company are to blame for lack of training?
If so, will this be the last straw, and should the maintenance of the rails be nationalised again?
Could the government pull their fingers out and do this?

RIP to the lost...
 
#11
predatorplus said:
Sir Richard Branson has visited the people in hospital and the crash site, and has said the driver did more than most drivers would have done ‘he could have got up, and ran back to the next carriage where he would have been safer, but he stayed and tried to steer the train to safety’.
Apparently this makes the driver a hero. Isn't such conduct practically in the job description? Is Branson expecting his drivers to desert their seat and go and find somewhere safer whilst the train hurtles on?
 
#12
predatorplus said:
but he stayed and tried to steer the train to safety’.
Can trains be steered?

Presumably the driver's first indication that something was wrong was when his engine was derailed into the field where it now lies. The poor sod would have been hanging on for dear life as the engine was tipped on it's side.
 
#13
Ancient_Mariner said:
predatorplus said:
but he stayed and tried to steer the train to safety’.
Can trains be steered?

Presumably the driver's first indication that something was wrong was when his engine was derailed into the field where it now lies. The poor sod would have been hanging on for dear life as the engine was tipped on it's side.
he tried to slow the train down, as it derailed it carried on for 3/4 of a mile on the gravle, the driver slowed the trains down from about 110mph to 95mph before the went down into the field, he has had an operation on his neck, and is moving his fingers and toes....
 
#14
Looking more and more like Network rail are in the sh*t again. That or their contractors. Time to bring all maintenance in house and sort the fcuking organisation out.
Am impressed the train survived in the state it did.
Mistersoft - although alstrom are based in Birmingham weren't the trains built in Italy?
 
#15
Sadly, bringing it in house is no guarantee it will change anything. The safety world simply doesn't work that way.

In very simple terms, it actually works by allocating a cost to a life.

In the case of rail:

each passenger is worth £450,000
each worker is worth £125,000

They then look at how much it is going to cost them over a period of time NOT to do the improvements and compare this to how much it will cost to do the improvements.

If you consider the figures for the Automatic Braking System, it worked out as around £150,000,000 to install it but cost of deaths of passengers and workers due to not installing it was less than £7,500,000. Guess what? It wasn't installed nationwide and never will be.

Other factors are obviously taken into account, (eg public opinion, areas of higher than normal risk), but in a nutshell, this is how it works.

This system of doing the least possible as cheaply as possible is known as "reducing the risk As Low As Reasonably Practicable" and is known internationally as ALARP.

If anyone wants to know why UK roads are in such a crap state, the cost of a life on the roads is set at £50,000.
 
#16
I'm going to do a sven... where did you get those figures from?

Seems strange only *that* much emphasis on safety - when for schemes the environmental impact has to be "best pratical environmental option" - which admittedly is as ambigous as a labour politician caught with their trousers down smoking a spliff - but encourages best practice
 
#17
crabby said:
I'm going to do a sven... where did you get those figures from?

Seems strange only *that* much emphasis on safety - when for schemes the environmental impact has to be "best pratical environmental option" - which admittedly is as ambigous as a labour politician caught with their trousers down smoking a spliff - but encourages best practice
HSE website and British Rail Yellow Book amongst others.

What else would you expect a decision to spend money on new infrastructure to be based on? it is an investment and, as with most things these days, the bottom line is financial.

ALARP is an accepted safety industry methodology.
 
#18
crabby said:
Looking more and more like Network rail are in the sh*t again. That or their contractors. Time to bring all maintenance in house and sort the fcuking organisation out.
Am impressed the train survived in the state it did.
Mistersoft - although alstrom are based in Birmingham weren't the trains built in Italy?
Alstrom is a French company that bought out Fiat eyetie something that invented the tilt mechanism, hence Pendolino. I did see on one report that the trains were definitely built in Birmingham. Alstrom are no different to any company and outsourcing to a third world country is quite common and Birmingham just seemed to fit the bill.

Of course without going into long and boring investigations, Alstrom might no longer be French as virtually the whole of the German train industry is owned by Bombardier, the Canadian company. If I was Alstrom, I wouldn't be proud to STAY French but enough of my prejudices.
 
#19
As a person who now drives trains, may I add that a) trains cannot be steered and b) the PLS (permissable line speed) was 95mph. That means he was either slowing down before the event or was slowing down after the PLS.

BTW, the crumple zone you all talk of is actually the drivers' cab, everything to the rear of the bulkhead behind him is the 'safe' zone. The idea being that if the driver dies in the accident, he can be blamed :pissedoff:
 
#20
Looks like railtrack are examining 700 sets of points over the next 24 hours - so what the FCUK has stopped them from checking these points normally?

They now reckon bolts and spacer bar missing from points, just like potters bar. When the fcuk will network rail get a grip and make more regular inspections?

It's a disgrace - as if our transport system wasn't enough of a joke already
 

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