Trade unions and their allegiances

Discussion in 'The Intelligence Cell' started by Rudie, Feb 11, 2008.

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  1. I left the army in '99 and joined the railways the following year.Any new start in the railway industry is promptly advised to join the union straight away,in most cases the RMT,likewise for most jobs.
    How ever,after learning that my union held it's AGM in Dublin in July 2006,and invited Gerry Adams as a guest speaker,who thanked the RMT for "its support over the decades",I felt it left me no choice but leave the union,as I could no longer contribute and be a member of such an organistion that gave these people a platform.It wasn't that long ago that PIRA were targeting the rail network and killing recruits waiting for trains.I seved four tours across the water,like many in here,and the thought of being a paid up member of any union with even the slightest affiliation to Sinn Fein was completely unacceptable.
    There is how ever a large number of ex servicemen/women who are RMT members,who have not left,as union protection is paramount.
    I posted a similar post on a dying thread recently,so I apologise if this seems familuar.
    My question is,how do ex servicmen feel when faced with this?Do you tell the unions to f*ck right off,out of loyalty to your past,or do you get yourself union protection as "The war is over" as one of my ex RAF Regiment RMT collegues informed me.
  2. That is something open to debate, as Cromwell first went into Ireland and the PBI have paid ever since!
    Will it ever be over for the hard core idiots / terrorists?

    An intresting comment that the RMT would even offer comfort to such mindless idiots.

    Bananarama had rodies who were linked to the Provo's! 'Tarts'!

    Perhaps you should email the RMT general secretary and ask him? Then post his reply on here!
  3. Or an open letter via a major broadsheet newspaper. It is certainly a quandary, as many workers will need the supportof their union at some stage, but at what cost should that support be elicited. I admire your prinicples, and wish you all the best.
  4. I wrote two letters,one to the man himself,and the other to head office.Did I get a reply?Did I f*ck.
  5. Today trade unions are more toothless that they were under the Maggie government. The word TRADE is also debateable in many cases!

    UNISON in my own experiance is, or has been working hand in glove with the management and Unison is supposed to be one of the biggest unions here in the UK.

    Yet still members pay their dues to the Party and for what exactly?

    If you feel you have a case against your employer and you are getting nowhere with your union rep, or country mounty, then take it throught to the legal bods, our lass did and she has just been paid out after being unfairly dismissed, because she had a fall at work.

    If you are intrested THOMPSON's she dealt with and as a union member, well unison anyway, she got the help for free. And until more take in her case the government to court, or the threat of court, nothing is going to change, not with this shower of SH1T in charge of this country!

    For those who remember the first Firemans Strike, WE went out for less money than the Firemen were getting before their strike, then Maggie gave us a 29% rise in 1979, good old Mags!
  6. Can you join a different union, or do RMT have a monopoly?
  7. Then write to your MP and ask under the "Freedom of Information Act"!
  8. Alsacien

    Alsacien LE Moderator

    You bring an interesting topic to the table.
    As a Thatcherite (ex)squaddie now manager unions have always been on the wrong side of the fence - but I find myself mellowing as I mature in perspective.
    I think you need to take it case by case though.
    Why did this union associate with Adams and co.? Were they anti-government? Anti-establishment? Staffed by ****@rs?
    Find the reasons, check the history, look at the current situation and the people involved, what they want to do, how they want to approach it, and make your choice.
  9. Yes,I can join TSSA,the clerical union.Although the RMT is the main railway union,ASLEF being the drivers union.
    My point was,how ex servicemen/women felt being a part of it.
    I was infantry for 12 years,when I joined,I joined the regimental family for life,it's something that will stay with me for the rest of my days.I chose the army,the railways is just where I've ended up.There are plenty of ex military who wear their RMT badges like a badge of honour.Me?I ditched mine for the veterans badge(which I'm not allowed to wear).
  10. Sounds like a story that the Daily Mail would like to run with!

    Not allowed to wear!! :x

    Not British then!!
    Comrade!! :x
  11. Alsacien

    Alsacien LE Moderator

    There is no "honour" in a union - it is self-serving and also indulges in selfish interest for the individuals running it.
    That said, the regt. will not sort you out as your age/health etc become issues - then your personal circumstances will become more important than youthfull ideals. Draw your own line while the options are all open and stick by it.
  12. Have you seen the RMT website, the 6th annual garden party for CUBA

    Perhaps the RMT was not your best choice, however unions are still letting their membership down and being encouraged to do so, but this government and who pays for the Labour party funds, that's right the unions.

    EU law now states that you can form your OWN co-oprative and it has to be recognised in the eyes of the law, just a thought.
  13. The official line is the only badge that you are allowed to wear(besides company name badges,etc)is one single trade union badge.To be fair,nobody has ever jarred me up for wearing a veterans badge for the last four months.In fact,I've recieved a few positive comments from customers.
    This was not the case when I worked for Railtrack/Network Rail a few years ago.I wore a small regimental badge on my lapel and was told to remove it immediately,as I might offend somebody.
  14. In the same way we could offend New Labour by discussing politics?

    Sounds like a P1SS poor excuse, what does is say in the dress code? (Standing Orders)

    Sounds Starlinists to me!
  15. Rudie

    In the 1950s there were (allegedly) Intelligence Reports that IRA were recruiting engineering and science graduates to build a sophisticated sabotage capability.

    I think it was 1962 that the Garland Plan fell into the hands of Southern Irish Police and was passed to the British.

    Was the plan deliberately lost ? Make your own mind up.

    But it would seem to feed the paranoia later to develop amongst Cold War warriors (who would plan to overthrow Harold Wilsons govt and so on) who saw the IRA in terms of Soviet activity against the West. The avowedly Marxist IRA was reputed to have been financed to the tune of a million a year by the Soviet.

    The Garland Plan was published in the appendices to the Scarman Report of 1972 which was looking into the causes of the eruption of trouble in Ireland (the Human Rights marches and so on). Scarman concluded that it was not a plan to overthrow government.

    In the (o) IRA plan was a plan to sabotage industry and agriculture and to also infiltrate the unions to spread their political ideas and influence. Very much reinforcing the views of such as Airey Neave that reds under the beds in the unions and (O) IRA were all aspects of soviet subversion plans.

    I think the leftist Socialist Workers Party has always been IRA supportive. On the extreme right an "Elite" apparently well funded group called League of Saint George has also been reported in press as IRA supportive and did not sue. I think that another far right group was suspected of being founded by IRA.

    (one of our concerns in the late 80s was reports of member(s) of SWP and of League of saint george meeting with one of the men arrested for paramilitary activity within Kent TA. This being one of the reasons we asked Kent Police to investigate Deal Marines barracks security as an associate of the paramiltary had gained work with civilian security at the barracks.

    The charity "British Irish Rights Watch" (Michael Mansfield and Co) has a charity status including to educate on the Ireland situation. yet their curriculum does not include any mention of the Sean Garland terrorist plan. I complained that they were using charity status to educate only to their agenda (whatever that might be). The Charity Commission position is that a charity should only take reasoned and informed advice. IE They do whatever they like under charity status.

    There was a case taken to European Court of Human Rights with British Irish Rights Watch and their sister charity "Inquest" helping the (IRA) case seeking judgement for non judicial execution against UK Govt of three IRA in Gibraltar (farrell savage McCann).

    In 1995 there was a custody death at Margate. Kent Police (I reported it to Attorney General and there was abandonment of the inquest and a new Coroner appointed in the case) deployed two open case Deal Bombing police witnesses. The Supt as invigilator for police complaints and the coroners officer.

    Problems arose when toxicology handle by the supt came back with a totally different result to the duplicate samples handled by Coroners Officer. The charity "Inquest" (so much admired by the charity British Irish Rights Watch) did not merely send its specialist custody death sub group. It sent the bereaved family a free barrister. And she advised the family to expedite inquest to gain grounds for appeal. A couple of things. One "Inquest" did not make public interest custodianship appeals to Attorney Genberal because it is charging up a cul de sac to prove the end is blocked. But they appeared to be conspiring to gain grounds to do just that in this case. Two they attached importance to the case enough to send a barrister. So they were acting out of policy and out of character for reasons best known to themselves.

    What was happening was that the Coroners Officer (who had been involved in initiating the evidence handling chain at the Deal barracks bombing) was being allegedly accused by the supt of being unsafe to administer an evidence chain. Whereas the Coroners officer was allegedly reporting the supt to coroner for losing his toxicology samples for four days and then admitting them back to evidence. the question did arise at inquest if it was possible to introduce a paracetomol overdose to a sample missing for fouyr days when the Coroners sdample sent to another lab shew no overdose at all.

    So what would appeal to Attorney General against the inquest have achieved ? In my view the biggest propaganda coup ever gifted to the IRA. They would have attached the reliability of Kent Police Deal bombing investigators as a secret of govt law officers.

    I cannot say that Attorney General John Morris agreed my report. As he forbade any replies in writing. But it is a matter of history that the Coroner stood down in the case and a new Coroner, who was functus officio Deal bombing coroner, took over. No appeal arose.

    Now if you look up Sean Garland's anti extradition web site you can read messages of support from trades unionists around the globe.

    I think he is a bit of an hypocritical joker. This man who planned sabotage against our industry is the first voice in Europe to complain against UK for alleged nuclear pollution. Not because equipment on our nuclear plant fails to work to spec after a GMBU dominated manufacturer workforce seem to have failed to achieve specified reliability standards ?

    You can read that Sean was set a very low bail by a Belfast court and skipped to Eire.

    Call me an old cynic but at the time TB was PM and he had cocked up by not including the Garland Plan in the Good Friday Decommissioning terms. I don't think TB was at all put out that wee Sean avoided extradition to the States (to answer matters like whether he is now funded more by North Korea and whether he got a bit lively printing dollar bills).

    It is obviously your choice. But when I get blacklisted I like to have prevented at least one murder. I would feel it a waste to be blacked over a badge dispute. Funnily enough I am blacklisted by Civil service Commission but can clear at top secret when I am wanted to work as a contracting sparkie at an MOD contractor factory or an MOD pharmaceutical supplier factory.

    Now MI5. They write me nice letters about sabotage reports. But if I seek to build on that good will by asking them about some deaths on my rural beat back in the 70s they aint my friend no more !

    Hypocrisy is the name of the game.

    Be it charity, security service, politicians or unions.

    Don't argue unless you are prepared to fight and don't fight unless you are prepared to kill.

    Would you kill a man over a badge ?

    But I would kill a man to secure a barracks.

    I would leave your dispute and go with the RMT flow. But it is up to you.