Tornado GR.1 simpit

D

Deleted 184863

Guest
The caption test is not my clearest memory. The F3 had some different captions with many the same. ISTR the F3 lit all the captions on the test, but the GR1 may have been different.

I may still have some notes on the CWP somewhere, I will try to dig them out.
 

NSP

LE
It's all very well spending a fortune building this thing - but for X-Plane...? Can you actually blow anything up in that...?
 
That's both scarily obsessive and awe-inspiring at the same time.

Big shout out to @Fox3WMB who hasn't been on the site long, but is already one of the most knowledgeable and helpful chaps on here.
Wot 'e sed...
 
F3, not GR1.
Many things were the same, some looked the same but worked differently, some were completely different. I did a weapons course where we learned a lot about each other's versions.

"Also when I switch the SPILS on a computer generated voice says "SPILS switched on" and another PC based simulator does the same thing. Did it do that?"

We had no computer-generated voice in the early days (and after hearing the experiences of the Yanks, nobody wanted it). In later years, they may have added it, but I don't think so. I think the F3 always had the SPILS on. Some switches were permanently left in set positions, but you had to check them as a technician may have failed to put it back to the standard position after testing. They also came back from deep servicing with some of the switches in unusual positions. Brand new ones that were picked up from the factory needed checking very carefully.

That must have been a pretty special day, picking up a brand new F3 from Warton. All shiny and new, good for 1500mph, though I expect it was a much more docile delivery flight.

I imagine it was boring driving from Coningsby or Leeming or wherever to Warton, but a sense of anticipation.

Did the F3 NEED a Nav to conduct a ferry flight? No weapons or anything, just move the airframe from A-B a hundred miles or so. Could the pilot alone do everything needed for a ferry flight, or did some systems require a Nav/backseat occupant?
 
That must have been a pretty special day, picking up a brand new F3 from Warton. All shiny and new, good for 1500mph, though I expect it was a much more docile delivery flight.

I imagine it was boring driving from Coningsby or Leeming or wherever to Warton, but a sense of anticipation.

Did the F3 NEED a Nav to conduct a ferry flight? No weapons or anything, just move the airframe from A-B a hundred miles or so. Could the pilot alone do everything needed for a ferry flight, or did some systems require a Nav/backseat occupant?
If it didn’t I bet there was no shortage of volunteers.
 

Nemesis44UK

LE
Book Reviewer
It's all very well spending a fortune building this thing - but for X-Plane...? Can you actually blow anything up in that...?
I know, right?

There's a Tornado module being made in DCS I believe and that's a sim which allows you to blow things up.
 

R0B

War Hero
It's all very well spending a fortune building this thing - but for X-Plane...? Can you actually blow anything up in that...?
You can shoot other aircraft down and you can add ground targets wherever you want although I think that is part of the X-Trident Tornado aircraft package not necessarily a function of X-Plane 11. I haven't bombed anything with dumb bombs yet as I need to workout hope to do that but I've used Storm Shadow which just needs GPS co-ordinates so a bit too easy.

I'm using X-Plane as I'm a Mac/UNIX user and despite being in software development since 1987 I've never had to use Windows and don't have anything with Windows on it. If I did make the whole cockpit then decide to buy a PC and use DCS I only have to wright a module to run on the PC and talk to the Arduino, the cockpit should be portable to other systems.
 

R0B

War Hero
If it didn’t I bet there was no shortage of volunteers.

I was at Honington just before the first GR.1's arrived for the Tornado Weapons Conversion Unit (TWCU) and then IX Squadron. There was about zero chance of getting a backseat ride.

One of my friends from nearby was an armourer and got two rides, one in a 617 squadron aircraft on a trip over the three dams in Germany. Lucky git.
 
D

Deleted 184863

Guest
That must have been a pretty special day, picking up a brand new F3 from Warton. All shiny and new, good for 1500mph, though I expect it was a much more docile delivery flight.

I imagine it was boring driving from Coningsby or Leeming or wherever to Warton, but a sense of anticipation.

Did the F3 NEED a Nav to conduct a ferry flight? No weapons or anything, just move the airframe from A-B a hundred miles or so. Could the pilot alone do everything needed for a ferry flight, or did some systems require a Nav/backseat occupant?
Very much need a nav for new aircraft collections. Again, simulator instructors were chosen because of familiarity with handling multiple emergencies. I had no problems with the two I picked up, but there were horror stories. The RAF immediately put them into the hangar for a Minor Servicing, so they could discover whatever was wrong.

Certain systems needed setting up in the back after power on. For passenger rides, when the pilot was just doing general handling in good weather, this would be set up by a nav before the canopy came down. Some groundcrew were backseat qualified for this switchery only, so they could be taken somewhere to go fix a broken jet. These guys (and gals) were also 'split-brains' - they had half a qual in a second set of aircraft systems, so very competent people. That way they could fix most common problems involving two systems on their own. The Chief Techs would just detail the appropriate 'split-brain' for the problem(s), and off you'd go. On arrival, some of the problems needed two people to deal with, so the aircrew were trained in turnaround servicing, and one would act as the split-brain's dogsbody - "OK, give me 3 pumps on the hydraulic handpump..great, now push in Fuse 360" and the like.

The upshot of all this for the GR1 sim is that some means must be provided to operate all the stuff that the backseater had to do, from winding up the nav kit to operating weapons and attack sequence switchery. Not all controls or indicators were repeated front and back. There were several phases of flight, like very low level or air combat, where the navigator did everything except fly the aircraft, and the pilot was just 'my driver' as I heard a GR1 nav describe him.
I'm not sure how this might be done. Maybe some combination of either extra switchery to replicate the nav-only stuff, or auto sequencing. You could have bits of nav switchery happening automatically after the appropriate front seat switch selection. You've probably got this sussed already.

Equally, with the F3, the early radar needed so much fettling and TLC that the navigator didn't have time for anything else, so all the early F3 pilots were chosen because they could operate the rest of the jet on their own, navigate, and monitor the radar. All the navigation in the air, except on a ferry flight, was in fact done by the pilot. This was also handy when, after a long fix, your split-brain forgot his backseat switchery, and you found yourself flying on head down instruments with no nav kit in a thunderstorm over the middle of Belgium. This changed by about 1991 when the radar got better.

When you pick up a new jet, there's a different, BAe, form. In fact, as the BAe man pointed out to me, I was signing for the jet myself, not 'on behalf of the RAF'. I promptly faked my own signature by using my other hand.
I was planning on a normal take-off, but was then told that everyone who'd built it would come out to watch - and they did! I shall say no more.
 

Bubbles_Barker

LE
Book Reviewer
The inventory might end up on e-bay when the Saudis have replaced theirs. I used to work in ESG where we kept most of the electronic stuff but I think I may have had an interesting interview if I was caught measuring things back then. The Radar components used to be kept in a secure cage and we have to have vetting to be allowed to work in there - those same bits are on e-bay now.

I've seen the Boscombe project to bring a Tornado back to ground running status (I tried to nick the canopy closing sound from one of their videos to use but I noticed it caught some people talking in the background) and they probably have better use of it than I although I am picturing it out the front of the house now and I quite like it. I really need to get in one to measure and make the cockpit shape.

Does Bicester keep RAF stock now? I only remember it for getting Army stuff from, everything RAF came from 16MU at Stafford.
Stafford closed many moons ago and, as is the way of the MOD, air stock moved to Germany (Dulmen) just as RAFG closed down. It returned to the UK and is now almost entirely in Donnington, including all the Tornado gash being held for the Saudis.
 


this guy bought the front end of an F-15 and has been converting this into a home flight sim.
different aircraft, I realise, but I imagine he'll have had some relatable problems and experiences to yourself.
 

Nemesis44UK

LE
Book Reviewer
Have we lost him already? Now showing as deleted. That's a shame.
Oh no!

I think that he may've fallen afoul of some ARRSERS on another thread where he was pro-guns, or anti-vax or anti-abortion or something.
 

R0B

War Hero
Finished the Under carriage indicator. Mine on the left, real one on the right. The Night/Day switch moves a dark diffuser under the six LEDs to dim them a bit. I have it in night mode as the LEDs are a bit bright.
IMG_2930.jpg
 

Latest Threads

Top