Tories to pull Army out of Germany.

#1
Good money saver, but where are they going to put them all so as not to make it a little boring?

British forces will pull out of Germany for good, nearly 70 years after the Allied victory in World War Two, as part of a Tory defence "revolution" being drawn up by Dr Liam Fox.

The Shadow Defence Secretary told The Daily Telegraph that ending Britain’s 25,000 strong military presence on the Rhine would be part of a fundamental reorganisation of Nato forces designed to free troops for military operations outside Europe.

The decision would close one of the unfinished chapters of the last war that saw the British military go from occupying force in the ruins of Nazi Germany in 1945 to guarantor of German security against the threat of Soviet invasion during the Cold War.

The announcement of what would be a major reassessment of Britain’s role in European defence came just 24 hours after the European Union surprised Westminster by handing responsibility for its diplomatic relations to the Labour peer Baroness Ashton.

Dr Fox’s decision to call time on Britain’s military links with Germany is a signal of his determination to force through a “wholesale recasting of our foreign and defence policy”.

He also called for the public to be told the truth about the “cost of defeat” in Afghanistan, including Britain being relegated to “the third division” of world politics.

He gave warning that setting a timetable for withdrawal would “tell our allies that we quit if the going gets tough and it says to our enemies that they may be able to outlast us”.

Generations of squaddies and their families have passed through Germany, where the British presence has had a profound economic and cultural impact on garrison towns. It is now centred on the 1st Armoured Division in Herford near Hanover
More at the Telegraph.
 

Auld-Yin

ADC
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#2
Ord_Sgt said:
Good money saver, but where are they going to put them all so as not to make it a little boring?


More at the Telegraph.
There will be a 'Defence Review' and he will sack them all. No need then for barracks or equipment.
 
#4
The same place they have always gone, redundant RAF stations. Then when the Army are cut they are transformed into prisons to take all the ex service personnel.

Can't beat a bit o recycling
 
#5
Auld-Yin said:
Ord_Sgt said:
Good money saver, but where are they going to put them all so as not to make it a little boring?


More at the Telegraph.
There will be a 'Defence Review' and he will sack them all. No need then for barracks or equipment.
I don;t think Fox wants to do that. I truly believe that he is very pro-forces and will puch hard for a budget INCREASE.

However, it may well be that Cameron has different ideas and either ignores him or gives Dr Fox an entirely different cabinet seat.
 
#6
Auld-Yin said:
There will be a 'Defence Review' and he will sack them all. No need then for barracks or equipment.
Beat me to it. The Conservatives have their own backers to bribe from the public purse, after all. Same shit, different recipient.
 
#8
Bout bloody time,too.Without subsidising the german economy by billions of Euros,we might afford some decent kit for the poor lads on AS.Plenty of space in home barracks with people on tour-let 'em practise street patrols to scare the sh1t out of chavs-no gats,mind.Pick-helves would be fine though.Just keep 'em below waist height :D
 
#9
We wouldn’t be there now if we had been feasible in the last 20 years to get us back to the UK regardless of SOFA or any other agreement. Some of the factors to be considered are:

Successive governments under invested in and sold off Barracks and Married quarters leaving 1 (UK) Div stranded in Germany.

The MoD ids skint and therefore can not afford the wholesale investment in the above that would allow a whole division to move back to the UK.

Environmental legislation means that contaminated land has to be cleaned before it can be handed over and all MoD land is considered contaminated. The Mod does not have the mney to clean up and hand back these sites.

I fear the Tories may find it easy to ‘say ‘than to ‘do’

I also think that the good Dr Fox is being rather disingenuous by claiming that these 25,000 troops would be freed up for Afghanistan. I am sure the lions share of the 25,000 have deployed from their cold war haven to hotter climes over the last few years
 
#10
It sounds like a good idea in practice, but misses out all the investment in recent years, are they going to (for example) disassemble CATT and move it back to the UK?

Not to mention finding accommodation for 20,000 soldiers!
 

Grumblegrunt

LE
Book Reviewer
#11
they'll move em somewhere cheaper like poland or uzbekistan, jordan is nice and sunny!

I reckon they'll suss out that the TA is a good move and turn all the tanks over to them. shame they sold all the drill halls.
 
#12
All those begging for a Tory govt to save the Forces, as the saying goes "be careful what you wish for - you may just get it!" the Tories will not be the Forces' friend, they never have been.
 
#13
To close Bruggen (Javelin Barracks) which is due to happen in 2014 is going to cost upwards of £100 million.

This is due to all the fuel issues when the RAF were in Station.

What about the cost of closing JHQ and the £8 million it is costing to sort only the housing in Innsworth, before they lease all the extra housing from the new builds to house the ARRC.

We will be paying the EU and NATO millions, if not Billions to have them in the UK.

Saving money? I think not.
 
#14
heidtheba said:
To close Bruggen (Javelin Barracks) which is due to happen in 2014 is going to cost upwards of £100 million.

This is due to all the fuel issues when the RAF were in Station.

What about the cost of closing JHQ and the £8 million it is costing to sort only the housing in Innsworth, before they lease all the extra housing from the new builds to house the ARRC.

We will be paying the EU and NATO millions, if not Billions to have them in the UK.

Saving money? I think not.
Heid it’s been a while mate

Yep my point exactly, easy sound bite, however the reality is very different
 
#15
this isnt news - been on the books for years - BFG is shrinking year on year

political spin on plans that are already being worked on

nothing to see here folks - move on
 
#16
CAARPS said:
heidtheba said:
To close Bruggen (Javelin Barracks) which is due to happen in 2014 is going to cost upwards of £100 million.

This is due to all the fuel issues when the RAF were in Station.

What about the cost of closing JHQ and the £8 million it is costing to sort only the housing in Innsworth, before they lease all the extra housing from the new builds to house the ARRC.

We will be paying the EU and NATO millions, if not Billions to have them in the UK.

Saving money? I think not.
Heid it’s been a while mate

Yep my point exactly, easy sound bite, however the reality is very different

Been quite busy mate, hope all is well.

The Germany issue, is a complicated one. Herford, Celle, Fally, and Senne, Paderbourn, not to mention the build at Gutersloth is not going to close for at least 30 years, as that is what the lease is. To pull out earlier whould cost even MORE.

Another politition taking sh1te.
 
#17
Can anyone explain how where troops are stationed affects their ability to deploy out of areas?

The more I hear what Liam Fox has to say the more I am worried, he just keeps coming out with a never ending stream of nonsense that seems to have come straight from the pages of either the Beano or Lions, Donkeys and Dinosaurs

I think he is making Bob Ainsworth seem like a good option
 
#18
llech said:
All those begging for a Tory govt to save the Forces, as the saying goes "be careful what you wish for - you may just get it!" the Tories will not be the Forces' friend, they never have been.
You're right, but in our current political system they're the only other option we have - and crap as they might be, they're a knight in shining armour compared to Labour.
 
#19
Well…………


The Crabs are talking about closing 6 RAF bases are they not?


RAF Cottesmore in Rutland
RAF Wittering in Cambridgeshire
RAF Marham in Norfolk or RAF Lossiemouth in Morayshire
RAF Kinloss in Morayshire
RAF Linton-on-Ouse and RAF Leeming, both in North Yorkshire.

There ya go… BFG'S new homes.
 

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