Tim Bax on Rhodesian COIN

Discussion in 'Southern Africa' started by bakerlite, Aug 15, 2011.

Welcome to the Army Rumour Service, ARRSE

The UK's largest and busiest UNofficial military website.

The heart of the site is the forum area, including:

  1. _Chimurenga_

    _Chimurenga_ LE Gallery Guru

    Errrmmm ... isn't Steven Hatfill the guy that falsely claimed service in the Selous Scouts and/or Rhodesian SAS ?
  2. Schaden

    Schaden LE Book Reviewer

    Steve Hatfil was at University of Cape Town Microbiology doing his PhD in the 1980's - he was called Captain Courageous by two actual ex RLI mates of mine who were in the dept at the time - waltier than the most walty of walts - very strange little man - got himself arrested for anthrax terrorism in yankland and the FBI drained the pond at the bottom of his garden looking for evidence. Turns out his boss was the terrorist and old Steve got mega moola - but still a weird little fecker.
  3. Great stuff, perhaps they used the bucks to purchase land in Puerto Rico:

  4. It will come as little surprise to those who took note of Schaden's warning on this fella
    that his name does not appear in Col Raid-Daley's Selous Scouts Nominal Roll.
    Whilst BSAP SB worked closely with the Scouts it would be wrong to claim to have earnt his wings.
    As a consequence I would seriously doubt as well him being in SB either.
    Though this too can be checked with the Regimental Association if he persists with his spurious claims.
  5. Schaden

    Schaden LE Book Reviewer

    They're also talking complete shite - Fireforce isn't particularly transferable to other coin ops - in Afghanistan it would be a complete cock up and even if it did work - the point is that kill ratio's actually don't mean all that much - what is required is for everyone to come to realise that the only way out of the quagmire - for both side - is to sit down and negotiate.
  6. Fire-Force was not a new concept, as tactically there was very little difference to the concept of AirCav in Vietnam, only in Rhodesia we had far fewer assets getting troops on the ground with modest air support but a more known enemy and easier terrain. In Afghanistan helo insertions with airstrikes in support are going on daily. Though the thought of jumping into the Kunar from a C-47 might raise an eyebrow or two! I always wondered why the Sovs never tried "externals" hitting the muj training camps in the FATA areas during the '80s under the guise of the DRA acting in "hot pursuit". Had they been determined, and a little more competent than they in reality were, they may have had their own Chimoio or Westlands Farm successes. However neither the Sovs nor the DRA had either the stomach politically or the capability militarily with their conscript forces of carrying out such attacks. Just an aside, Terry is a far different enemy than the muj the Sovs ever fought [with the possible exception of the Panjshiris]. Few of the muj were ever willing to close with the enemy, let alone have the technical know-how & sophistication of IEDs, and the thought of suicide bombers was entirely foreign to their MO. There is no relevant comparison of Terry/muj to the terrs of the Rhodesian war.
    Bodycounts are never an accurate measure of whether you are winning a COIN war. Floppies don't have neither the hearts nor the minds that matter any longer.
    The similarity which you elude to is correct, that without gaining their acceptance we might as well go home, and therefore the only solution will have to negotiated and this will mean money and loss of original principal of leaving a government that will not be susceptible to AQ. Sickening, considering the amount of coalition blood & treasure spent to see the Karzai kleptocracy walking away with bulging bank accounts, leaving some form Terry government to return. A not too dissimilar hand of cards as dealt to General Elphinstone in 1842's winter withdrawal, merciful only for not needing to go through Khord Kabul, Gandamak and Jegdalek on our exit.
  7. Without wanting to hi-jack your thread did anyone ever run across a chap who called himself Frank (aka Danny) Larsen?

    He used to hang around Aldershot in the mid 1980s claiming to be ex Rhodesian SB and stated he was involved in developing the process used to turn SEP to work for the SS in counter-gangs.

    Some times he would appear in uniform sporting a Capts rank IIRC but dont rember ever seeing him in head dress so I dont know what cap badge- maybe RAMC because he claimed to be a shrink as well.
  8. Steve Hatfill to my knowledge never served in the Selous Scouts, RLI or RhSAS. He is definitely not on the nominal rolls for the Selous Scouts or the RhSAS. Tim Bax on the other hand is genuine.

    AIRBORNEJOCK War Hero Reviewer Book Reviewer

    Obviously the aircav used heli extensively in vietnam for insertions/assaults etc and the same happens in astan now I think the fireforce concept isn't just the use of helis/para as an insertion technique but more the fact they would react offensively with it to hunt down/cut off and destroy groups of terrs (who had been preseen or just in contact) which I don't think was done in Vietnam and astan on the same level ..... Open to debate.
  10. Schaden

    Schaden LE Book Reviewer

    Oh great - make an off the cuff comment and out comes crawling pendant obsessive compulsive internet crawlers.
  11. Schaden

    Schaden LE Book Reviewer

    When people post on your blog that it's time you upped your meds - perhaps you should start checking out local mental healthcare proffs. There is no "investigation" it's over and done with - you're a weird little ****** in the Hatfield mode - probably with a beard and one of those multi pocket jackets that before the internet came along no one ever had to know existed.

    Piss off you stupid ******. You remind me of that **** Ralph.
  12. Helicopter-borne quick reaction forces were used fairly extensively in Vietnam, under various names, such as "Eagle Flights" and Air Cavalry aero-rifle ("Blue") platoons within the US Army, and "Sparrowhawks" within the USMC. Not exactly the same thing as Fireforce but then of course the circumstances weren't exactly the same, something a lot of people tend to forget.

    Eagle Flights:

    Vietnam Choppers (Revised Edition ... - Google Books

    Eagle flights prey on fleeing Viet Cong - News - Stripes


    Organisation of Divisional Air Cavalry Troop in Vietnam

    Huey Vets - EMU, Inc.



    Vietnam War Sparrow Hawk rapid reaction force

    AIRBORNEJOCK War Hero Reviewer Book Reviewer

    Had heard of the blues being used for QRF for LRP patrols obviously there will be numerous occasions of others having airborne/heli reaction forces as you said though not exactly fireforce.