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Three years in prison for Germans who criticise the EU.

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Does that not strike you as rather illiberal? As soon as you criminalise criticism of an institution you spike public debate. Allowing 'objective or legitimate' criticism immediately sets a bar of 'can we justify this as objective or legitimate?' So in practice it just becomes safer not to criticise rather than risk the editor getting his collar felt.

Given we are leaving would you feel comfortable with a law introduced here that criminalises praise of the EU, but makes exceptions for 'objective or legitimate praise'?
Last sentence yes-you are hereby sentenced to financially support the BBC for 5 years.
 
I saw this on Breitbart & the Express websites, and dismissed it as hyperbole, but it looks like the President of Germany wants to imprison German citizens who disparage the EU or damage its flag.

Frank-Walter Steinmeier has presented a petition to the State Chamber stating that it is necessary to provide the law enforcement agencies with the means "to take firm and effective action against those whose aim is to disparage the fundamental values of the European Union". These include attacks "on the reputation or the symbols of the European Union". Specifically, anyone who "removes, destroys, or obscures" a publicly displayed EU flag is punished with imprisonment of up to three years or a fine.

Seems a bizarre and oppressive move, and an attack on fundamental rights of free speech.

Anyone in Germany know if it's likely to become law?

The original article in German is here, the Google translated version below.



Federal President Frank-Walter Steinmeier hoisted the blue European flag with the twelve stars in front of the Bellevue Palace just before the European elections in May. It is now the symbol of the EU - and it should now be better protected against slurs in Germany. Anyone who publicly destroys the flag, for example burns, may soon face a prison sentence.

The Federal Council is to advise on this information from our editorial staff at the end of next week. A petition to the State Chamber states that it is necessary to provide the law enforcement agencies with means "to take firm and effective action against those whose aim is to disparage the fundamental values of the European Union". These included attacks "on the reputation of the symbols of the European Union". Specifically, the one who "removes, destroys, destroys, destroys, destroys, or obscures" a publicly displayed EU flag is punished with imprisonment of up to three years or a fine. The punishment of the anthem of the EU should also be punished. Leading in the tightening of penalties is the Free State of Saxony.

So far, it is the case in Germany that only the symbols of foreign states such as flags and national emblems are criminally protected against destruction. The flag of the EU falls according to the application is not included. That should change. The new provision does not affect "the right to objective or legitimate criticism". But it is "a commandment of self-esteem" that the Federal Republic as a founding member of the EU "protects against malicious contempt."

So when we are talking about publically displayed EU Flags are we talking about the one in the corner of the the nameplates they like to have put on anything that the grant money for? Alternatively have some Germans begun painting the the kerbs Blue and Gold and hanging flags off lamp posts?
 
If you're getting all snowflakey about this, don't (for goodness sake) Google Flag Desecration as you might find many (very many) countries have penalties for doing nasty things to their flag.
That one bloke in Germany has said it should apply to the EU flag as well just goes to show you have rather too much time on your hands.
Noted for prosterity.
 

seaweed

LE
Book Reviewer
RIP
A German being dictatorial? Gosh.
 
I saw this on Breitbart & the Express websites, and dismissed it as hyperbole, but it looks like the President of Germany wants to imprison German citizens who disparage the EU or damage its flag.

Frank-Walter Steinmeier has presented a petition to the State Chamber stating that it is necessary to provide the law enforcement agencies with the means "to take firm and effective action against those whose aim is to disparage the fundamental values of the European Union". These include attacks "on the reputation or the symbols of the European Union". Specifically, anyone who "removes, destroys, or obscures" a publicly displayed EU flag is punished with imprisonment of up to three years or a fine.

Seems a bizarre and oppressive move, and an attack on fundamental rights of free speech.

Anyone in Germany know if it's likely to become law?

The original article in German is here, the Google translated version below.



Federal President Frank-Walter Steinmeier hoisted the blue European flag with the twelve stars in front of the Bellevue Palace just before the European elections in May. It is now the symbol of the EU - and it should now be better protected against slurs in Germany. Anyone who publicly destroys the flag, for example burns, may soon face a prison sentence.

The Federal Council is to advise on this information from our editorial staff at the end of next week. A petition to the State Chamber states that it is necessary to provide the law enforcement agencies with means "to take firm and effective action against those whose aim is to disparage the fundamental values of the European Union". These included attacks "on the reputation of the symbols of the European Union". Specifically, the one who "removes, destroys, destroys, destroys, destroys, or obscures" a publicly displayed EU flag is punished with imprisonment of up to three years or a fine. The punishment of the anthem of the EU should also be punished. Leading in the tightening of penalties is the Free State of Saxony.

So far, it is the case in Germany that only the symbols of foreign states such as flags and national emblems are criminally protected against destruction. The flag of the EU falls according to the application is not included. That should change. The new provision does not affect "the right to objective or legitimate criticism". But it is "a commandment of self-esteem" that the Federal Republic as a founding member of the EU "protects against malicious contempt."
what colour star does it get on your prison uniform then
 

WALT

War Hero
Whoops! That's me buggered, and I live in Saxony!

Mind you, it's been on there since the referendum result and no one's noticed yet.

DSCN4645.jpg
 
Have a look around for all the nutcases who attempt to burn the Euro flag. They usually give a big speech then fail miserably as European H&S ensure that the Eu flag material is non flammable.

It’s pitiful.

He's never had proper management training then has he? Refine, practice and rehearse your presentation well in advance of the event.
 

chrisg46

LE
Book Reviewer

seaweed

LE
Book Reviewer
RIP
I don't see how this could possibly be legal, it contravenes the ECHR and the Germans are the people that was written for.
 

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