The truth about Taliban 'reintegration'

#3
Gosh, what a surprise.
 
#4
...
A leaked Nato report earlier this month also appeared to cast doubt on the very premise of the reintegration programme - that Taliban fighters are tired, motivated by money and want a way out.
Interrogators who have questioned thousands of insurgent prisoners in the past year reported instead that they remain motivated, feel their support is rising and their victory inevitable as foreign troops withdraw.
Fighters in Helmand, where the great majority of Britain's 397 dead have been killed, remain too afraid of their comrades in the Taliban to publicly relinquish the struggle and join the scheme despite security gains in the province, Nato and Afghan officials said.
...
It's worth bearing in mind Britain's seven million quid (out of a fund of 92 million) is small change compared to the cost to the UK of deploying troops over there, that's run at at least three billion quid PA.
The Septics reckon a million bucks per pair of boots on the ground PA.

In recent history Afghans have often actively switched sides for cash but they also like to be on the winning side, looking like you are liable to bugger off in a couple of years may not be helpful.

A hundred quid a month may be a lot to Afghan but if your Terry chums (who pay pretty well) are going to come round and cut your balls off it may seem rather paltry. So it's no surprise there is lots of fraud by fake taliban but then even small gains would make this scheme cost effective.
 
#6
It is all such a load of bollocks, the whole program is just another tick in the box before our abject failiure (victory in 2015/2014/2013) along the Afgan Police and ANA, they will all turn back to the dark side the moment we have****ed off. How the Government of this country should hang it's collective head in shame. It knows what it is going to do, it knows the likely outcome, yet it will go ahead and do it with their head held high because on paper they ticked the right boxes.
If they want to pull out just do it, I cannot see the point of losing one more coalition life for the shitehole for the sake of what is now a face saving exercise.
Just get out and say we****ed it up but we tried, we let our troops down, we apologise for every injury and death to British troops, who by the way were as ever outstanding in their efforts to secure our flawed policies.
 
#7
The Taliban's position was stated about a year or so ago: that there was no point in negotiating as they would simply wait until the Western forces had buggered off, then they would retake the country.
 
#8
It is all such a load of bollocks, the whole program is just another tick in the box before our abject failiure (victory in 2015/2014/2013) along the Afgan Police and ANA, they will all turn back to the dark side the moment we have****ed off. How the Government of this country should hang it's collective head in shame. It knows what it is going to do, it knows the likely outcome, yet it will go ahead and do it with their head held high because on paper they ticked the right boxes.
If they want to pull out just do it, I cannot see the point of losing one more coalition life for the shitehole for the sake of what is now a face saving exercise.
Just get out and say we****ed it up but we tried, we let our troops down, we apologise for every injury and death to British troops, who by the way were as ever outstanding in their efforts to secure our flawed policies.
A bloody shame but I think I have to agree with you.

I worked on the "National Solidarity program" which had more logical holes than a string vest and a couple of equally cracked brained UN programs.

As discussed before, the reconstruction policies have all been made by over educated idiots with no common sense and there has been way too much mission creep.

This latest scheme is merely a continuation of a comedy of errors.
 

seaweed

LE
Book Reviewer
#9
The creativity with which our Govt finds ever more pointless ways to throw away our money is amazing.
 
#10
It is all such a load of bollocks, the whole program is just another tick in the box before our abject failiure (victory in 2015/2014/2013) along the Afgan Police and ANA, they will all turn back to the dark side the moment we have****ed off. How the Government of this country should hang it's collective head in shame. It knows what it is going to do, it knows the likely outcome, yet it will go ahead and do it with their head held high because on paper they ticked the right boxes.
If they want to pull out just do it, I cannot see the point of losing one more coalition life for the shitehole for the sake of what is now a face saving exercise.
Just get out and say we****ed it up but we tried, we let our troops down, we apologise for every injury and death to British troops, who by the way were as ever outstanding in their efforts to secure our flawed policies.
Word is anyway and regardless that once the troopies leave, the glorious and dashing Afgahn leader will be 5 mins behind them, such is his love amongst his people
 
#11
The creativity with which our Govt finds ever more pointless ways to throw away our money is amazing.
Such the £350 million a year we give to that nuclear, space programme country known as India. If they think that building the bomb is more worthwhile than housing and feeding the 990million citizens who live in adject poverty, who are we to argue with them. But 350 pence would be an out rage. Same as China I be leave.
 
#12
The creativity with which our Govt finds ever more pointless ways to throw away our money is amazing.
Yup - as another post said, they are simply fulfilling one of their promises, possibly made to the UN, US or whatever. Our politicians in particular still haven't made the connection between their throwing money at various impossible projects, and the contributions/donations made by the taxpayer. Time someone showed them!
 
#13
Such the £350 million a year we give to that nuclear, space programme country known as India. If they think that building the bomb is more worthwhile than housing and feeding the 990million citizens who live in adject poverty, who are we to argue with them. But 350 pence would be an out rage. Same as China I be leave.
Same as Pakistan - spend millions, including our aid, on nuclear and other weapons, and do nothing about shoring up the banks of the Indus to prevent future flooding.
 

ehwhat

Old-Salt
Book Reviewer
#14
Not really news is it? This is a rehash from the mid 1800s payout for stability/peace. It only works to a point, has no lasting positive effect on the area and reinforces perceptions of weakness. One gets what one pays for and in this instance, we get an exit.

The Taliban are not stupid, uncoordinated, or unable to learn from mistakes. They have demonstrated an ability to rapidly exploit weaknesses or tactical errors. The opening of an office in Qatar is much more a statement of political intent for reacquisition of national power rather than an overture to Karzai for "peace." Any understanding reached between the two will be of very short duration. Most observers might suggest that Karzai should be considering his travel arrangements.

If you have an interest, you might consider an article from 2009 that critiqued the IC understanding of the Taliban and efforts for containment. Don't agree with all the points but found it useful at the time and unfortunately much of what was correct was not addressed.
http://carnegieendowment.org/files/taliban_winning_strategy.pdf

"I would characterize the Taliban strategy in very simple terms," said retired Army Lt. Gen. David Barno. Speaking at the Marine conference on counterinsurgency last Wednesday, Barno, who was the overall commander in Afghanistan from 2003 to 2005, and was one of the more competent generals we've had there, said the Talibian think that they are winning and that the war is nearly over, and so "their strategy is simply to run out the clock." 2009
 
#15
Same as Pakistan - spend millions, including our aid, on nuclear and other weapons, and do nothing about shoring up the banks of the Indus to prevent future flooding.
There are slight differences with the Indians, Pindi takes the aid and is fast tracking its nuclear arsenal AND is fighting a proxy war against USAF via folk like the Haqqanis. A war that probably can be sustained indefinitely as they have secure rear basing in FATA, a river of money from the Kingships and an endless supply of cannon fodder from the Deobandi Madrasahs. Pindi has also milked the LOS up from Karachi for over a decade. Folk who are not even worried about losing tens of millions civilians in a nuclear exchange with India aren't likely to care much about the Indus banks.
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#16
**** me its taken how long to work out that the whole place is shit? the whole adventure is a waste of money and lives which only encourages rampant criminals immigrating into the UK masquerading as refugees.
Shouldnt have gone in there in the first place!
 

ehwhat

Old-Salt
Book Reviewer
#17
There were several scenarios under discussion concerning the Taliban and their guests at the start. Not all would have lead to this point. Unfortunately, we continue to choose less favourable paths that provided a trajectory we are unable or unwilling to complete. Short term goals leading to short sighted outcomes.
 
#18
There are slight differences with the Indians, Pindi takes the aid and is fast tracking its nuclear arsenal AND is fighting a proxy war against USAF via folk like the Haqqanis. A war that probably can be sustained indefinitely as they have secure rear basing in FATA, a river of money from the Kingships and an endless supply of cannon fodder from the Deobandi Madrasahs. Pindi has also milked the LOS up from Karachi for over a decade. Folk who are not even worried about losing tens of millions civilians in a nuclear exchange with India aren't likely to care much about the Indus banks.
Touche - that was the point I was making ........., I think.
 
S

Screw_The_Nut

Guest
#19
PS 1200 quid a year is BIG money for an Afghan.
BS. You obviously have never been there. A MONTHLY wage in Kabul at the moment is roughly $800 US...

edited to add: a semi-skilled worker in Lashkar Gah can expect to get at least $400-500.
 

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