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The Trump Presidency...

Didn't Candesartan do a cover of 'Stand By Your man'?

Ahem, anyway, moving on....
But at the same time one has to make sure welfare state does not go overboard. Everybody should have a stake in the system so the takers don’t outnumber the makers.

If you get cancer because you smoke 20 packs a day and eat 5,000 calories I am not going to feel sympathetic for you. You make your choices you take your chances like everybody else. Your system comes off as abused entitlement by a growing welfare class who expect the state to provide them with with everything. Cradle to the grave .
They're good points and that's fine, so far as it goes.

Indeed, in my experience, those that demand the most from the NHS are those that have paid the least and that grates, and there is an ongoing argument about accountability, particularly around diabetes and obesity.

But here's the thing - I could lead the most healthy, safe and blameless life on earth and still get smitted by the fickle gods of cancer (as an example), and every working day I meet people who are given that news.

Not wealthy people you understand, but normal people, be they shop workers, civil servants, farmers - frankly, the whole range of working folk.

They’ve worked and paid their tax, but now they need the service and it's time to collect, and they will be treated and cared for until they are in remission or have died, without fear of the cost of the treatment.

A question - If you get that shit moment when you're told you've got Parkinson's disease, what kind of insurance cover do you require to keep you in healthcare for the rest of your life?

There is no system that’s perfect, of course, but I would argue that the various European approaches are fairer and serve more of their citizens than the American system.

And no, we’re not communists.



Anyway, Candesartan – a good name for a daughter, don’t you think?

Has to be better than Chardonnay.
 
Can you change your coverage options, and reduce your monthly tax contribution to the system? I can at least pay for the level of use we need. Come January I will pay 6 bucks a month for the family, out of pocket.

Yes, but you are a civil servant, with government arranged medical insurance.

People in corporates are reliant on their employer finding and negotiating a decent insurance policy on their behalf. I know that for my wifes corporate it costs the employer $10,000 a year per employee to subscribe to the policy. On top of that $10K the employee also has to pay an amount, variable dependent on the level of cover they want. Then they have to pay for the first $3000 of any treatment, this is for the year, for the family - when someone is only taking home $3000 a month it can come as a shock to have to pay that if an emergency arises. "Yeah, take a payment plan" was a smart answer I got back one time. It is simply fcuking disgusting that something as basic as healthcare is monetarised.

The major cause of personal bankruptcy in the USA is medical expenses in old age, fullstop/period. People do not spend their entire lives working, sweating and building something up so that if they have a heart attack, or stroke so that they can sign over the deeds for their house and everything else they own to a Dr.

And that is the shite, warped system, which Biden, and Obama before him, and their crew are trying to fix.
 
p.s. that is perhaps the stupidest fcking thing anyone has ever posted on this website, and I include the pte Mike Golden walting saga in that. What you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point, in your rambling, incoherent response, were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on this forum is now dumber for having read it. I award you no arrse points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Billy Madison walt :)

“A simple ‘wrong’ would have done just fine”.
 
And you will pay heavily for them, and the financing for that system. So enjoy it. Please get an abortion or two and your bit for the system.

You have drunk the kool Aid my friend.

Forget the imaginary conspiracies of your man emong emong...the true conspiracies are those of big pharma and big med. conspiracies that sail very close to your own Anti Trust act.

Remember that chart you posted about who was going to get hit by Biden’s tax rises? The one that said it was going to be the top 1% of the population (ie those who earn over $400k pa)? The tax rises that you were so angry about?

The fact is, if the richer end of society don’t pay for stuff, then it’s the average Joe who does.

You.
 

BigT

LE
You have drunk the kool Aid my friend.

Forget the imaginary conspiracies of your man emong emong...the true conspiracies are those of big pharma and big med. conspiracies that sail very close to your own Anti Trust act.

Remember that chart you posted about who was going to get hit by Biden’s tax rises? The one that said it was going to be the top 1% of the population (ie those who earn over $400k pa)? The tax rises that you were so angry about?

The fact is, if the richer end of society don’t pay for stuff, then it’s the average Joe who does.

You.

This is what happens when an economy is predicated on making those at the lower end of the pay scale worry that those at the top may have to pay more tax and that would be a bad thing. Remember when the likes of Bernie and AOC were floating a 90% tax on every dollar earned over 10 million, Fox News / Fox Business went into an utter melt down of course failing to mention that you had to earn 10 million first. The thing is that it was a policy implemented by that far left commie President Eisenhower back in the 50's and was credited with kick starting the US economy into prolonged boom.
 

BigT

LE
Yes, but you are a civil servant, with government arranged medical insurance.

People in corporates are reliant on their employer finding and negotiating a decent insurance policy on their behalf. I know that for my wifes corporate it costs the employer $10,000 a year per employee to subscribe to the policy. On top of that $10K the employee also has to pay an amount, variable dependent on the level of cover they want. Then they have to pay for the first $3000 of any treatment, this is for the year, for the family - when someone is only taking home $3000 a month it can come as a shock to have to pay that if an emergency arises. "Yeah, take a payment plan" was a smart answer I got back one time. It is simply fcuking disgusting that something as basic as healthcare is monetarised.

The major cause of personal bankruptcy in the USA is medical expenses in old age, fullstop/period. People do not spend their entire lives working, sweating and building something up so that if they have a heart attack, or stroke so that they can sign over the deeds for their house and everything else they own to a Dr.

And that is the shite, warped system, which Biden, and Obama before him, and their crew are trying to fix.

We've argued the several times back down the thread at the absurdity of paying Heath Insurance but still ending up out of pocket due to Co-Pays or that you get charged for an ambulance.
 
This is what happens when an economy is predicated on making those at the lower end of the pay scale worry that those at the top may have to pay more tax and that would be a bad thing. Remember when the likes of Bernie and AOC were floating a 90% tax on every dollar earned over 10 million, Fox News / Fox Business went into an utter melt down of course failing to mention that you had to earn 10 million first. The thing is that it was a policy implemented by that far left commie President Eisenhower back in the 50's and was credited with kick starting the US economy into prolonged boom.
Isn't the fact that all that does is that every dollar you earn over 10 million goes into an offshore tax haven or you set up your factories or investments overseas in low tax cheap labour countries. I sure as hell wouldn't work my butt off to give a spendthrift government 90% of everything I earn over a certain amount.

Look what happened in France when Hollande came to power threatening a 95% tax rate. London became the biggest French city outside Paris and lots of French celebrities and Film stars suddenly decided that they were Belgium (yes it was that bad).
 
Yes, but you are a civil servant, with government arranged medical insurance.

People in corporates are reliant on their employer finding and negotiating a decent insurance policy on their behalf. I know that for my wifes corporate it costs the employer $10,000 a year per employee to subscribe to the policy. On top of that $10K the employee also has to pay an amount, variable dependent on the level of cover they want. Then they have to pay for the first $3000 of any treatment, this is for the year, for the family - when someone is only taking home $3000 a month it can come as a shock to have to pay that if an emergency arises. "Yeah, take a payment plan" was a smart answer I got back one time. It is simply fcuking disgusting that something as basic as healthcare is monetarised.

The major cause of personal bankruptcy in the USA is medical expenses in old age, fullstop/period. People do not spend their entire lives working, sweating and building something up so that if they have a heart attack, or stroke so that they can sign over the deeds for their house and everything else they own to a Dr.

And that is the shite, warped system, which Biden, and Obama before him, and their crew are trying to fix.
Is it right that in America that at an accident the medics check your social security number and medical plan before they check your pulse and heart beat.
 
The progressive left likes to dabble to much with social experimentation, and has a very unhealthy desire to eliminate rights and create unprecedented changes to people’s ways of life. So I don’t think universal taxpayer funded healthcare is the way. Along with student loan forgiveness, and all the other gimmicks that they pitch.

The big problem with our yuppie college kids is that they equate Socialism with the Nordic countries, and not places like Venezuela. Nor are they really prepared to live in high tax areas like Europe. They only think the evil rich will pay for it.

The US left does seem to have a hard on for being authoritarian. Those that do not agree with them should be ignored and punished..... Well, at least those Democratic politicians who get the media air time and column inches.

The Scandinavian counties and UK (and a lot of Europe) enjoy democratic socialism in a variety of forms and flavours. It works for us and it could work for the US too.
The problem with the hard left of the US is they want to change society and they what to see the changes instantly. Society changes slowly, if it changes to quickly people don't like it.

I am not sure about the debt forgiveness schtick. It seems like a bit off and aimed at keeping the middle class and upper class students happy (as they are the ones with the most debt). It's as if the middle class policy makers are looking for a freebee for themselves, and not for the working class who tend to go to community colleges and universities.

Personally I would use the money to improve community colleges and universities to enhance their prestige and quality of education.
 
Isn't the fact that all that does is that every dollar you earn over 10 million goes into an offshore tax haven or you set up your factories or investments overseas in low tax cheap labour countries. I sure as hell wouldn't work my butt off to give a spendthrift government 90% of everything I earn over a certain amount.

Look what happened in France when Hollande came to power threatening a 95% tax rate. London became the biggest French city outside Paris and lots of French celebrities and Film stars suddenly decided that they were Belgium (yes it was that bad).

That’s true. Maggie got rid of the highest tax brackets. But nevertheless income tax is still ‘progressive’ in most western countries.

In the states you get ‘Libertarians’ like Ron Paul argue for ‘flat taxes’ because they’re simpler. What most people don’t realise is that flat taxes work better for the super rich than the poor - or even average, because (a) income isn’t ‘normally’ distributed* and (b) poorer people spend proportionately more of their income on basic necessities. See link on ‘Engels’ Law’ below.

Without turning this into economics 101, whenever you hear someone a lot richer than you talk about ‘tax reform’, you can normally be sure that it’s not going to be in your favour.



Biden’s tax reform plan, the one that upset Jonesy so much, is to raise taxes on those who earn more than $400,000 pa.


 
Congrats, now you get to pay for those rights weather you use them or not.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but I do get a buzz when I go past a hospital (not just because of the nurses). I think to myself what a bloody wonderful thing the NHS is, and how my hard work and taxes have helped keep it running for the good of the nation.

Same for state schools, colleges and universities (free education). I take great joy in knowing that, through taxation, I have helped educate the next generation for the good of the community and nation.
 
The major cause of personal bankruptcy in the USA is medical expenses in old age, fullstop/period. People do not spend their entire lives working, sweating and building something up so that if they have a heart attack, or stroke so that they can sign over the deeds for their house and everything else they own to a Dr.

There is a cruel capitalist method in that apparent madness.
Plenty of people will not seek medical help or top themselves rather than bankrupt their family and put their wife and kids on the street.
 

offog

LE
Isn't the fact that all that does is that every dollar you earn over 10 million goes into an offshore tax haven or you set up your factories or investments overseas in low tax cheap labour countries. I sure as hell wouldn't work my butt off to give a spendthrift government 90% of everything I earn over a certain amount.

Look what happened in France when Hollande came to power threatening a 95% tax rate. London became the biggest French city outside Paris and lots of French celebrities and Film stars suddenly decided that they were Belgium (yes it was that bad).
One of the interesting things about the US tax system is that you pay it even if you don't live in the country. There are exceptions for some countries and I think the UK is one of them so that if you earn a wage in the UK and pay tax to the UK Gov you don't get a bill from the IRS in the US.

So moving to an overseas area will not help, the IRS will still send you a tax bill. The other side of that is that if you are in trouble and need the USMC to come and help they will.
 
Congrats, now you get to pay for those rights weather you use them or not.
I'm happy to pay a little bit extra so that friends of mine who are unemployed, through no fault of their own, can recieve 'more than the bare minimum' medical care.

In one case, for one of my friends, life-saving medical care for an ongoing condition which will kill her in the end.

For me, that is what it comes down to. Despite many people in this (and probably every) country being scumbags, there are very few who I actually want to suffer and / or expire prematurely. I'm happy to pay a few extra pence on the pound for this.
 
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rampant

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
One of the interesting things about the US tax system is that you pay it even if you don't live in the country. There are exceptions for some countries and I think the UK is one of them so that if you earn a wage in the UK and pay tax to the UK Gov you don't get a bill from the IRS in the US.

So moving to an overseas area will not help, the IRS will still send you a tax bill. The other side of that is that if you are in trouble and need the USMC to come and help they will.

No you still get a bill from Uncle Sam in the UK
 

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