The Trump Presidency...

Well it was the Germans fault. Clearly . You should read Fritz Fischer's " Germany's War Aims 1914" . A very enlightening book.
I don't fault the Germans for stomping the French. The Frogs were out fought plain and simple and it was their country to defend not yours or mine to worry about.

World War 2 was a different story.

World War 1 was just all the big kids on the block having a go at each other because nobody realized that this kind of war was going to be a long drawn out slug fest.
 

Goatman

ADC
Book Reviewer
Interesting set of letters just appeared in another thread : https://www.arrse.co.uk/community/threads/transcribed-letters-from-the-western-front-1917.288341/

For a bit of first-hand testimony, this is a British Tommy writing to his father at the tail end of the 100 days:



Oct 13th 1918

Dearest Dad and Girls

I have a few minutes to spare, so I am writing this letter to tell you I am quite well and getting strong.

I often feel ashamed that I do not write oftener, because you all have been so good in writing and sending me whatever you want, but these days it is most difficult to write because we are on the move all the time, and I expect it will be the same now until the end. Everytime the infantry make the Germans retire, we rush them and keep them going as fast as we can, then when they fall back on a dug position we hold on until the infantry come up and then we hand over to them. In the last five days we have advanced a good distance, and now we are in a new country, that has seen no war except when the Germans stormed over it in early 1914.

I have on two occasions been scrapping alongside the Americans and they are good fellows and fight like hell, but they make a few mistakes because they are new to it.

The razor Uncle Frank sent me is excellent, shaving out in the open with a cold wind blowing and about four days of stubble on your chops is torture, unless you have a good razor.
 
I don't fault the Germans for stomping the French. The Frogs were out fought plain and simple and it was their country to defend not yours or mine to worry about.

World War 2 was a different story.

World War 1 was just all the big kids on the block having a go at each other because nobody realized that this kind of war was going to be a long drawn out slug fest.
Your knowledge of history is questionable my old studmuffin. The French were not out-fought. They did get caught into a war of attrition with the Germans, which was horrific and produced nothing. It became UK problem when the Germans violated treaties. You know, treaties... international agreements. Important things. There are a pile of ripped up treaties beside Trump's desk if you care to look.
 
Your knowledge of history is questionable my old studmuffin. The French were not out-fought. They did get caught into a war of attrition with the Germans, which was horrific and produced nothing. It became UK problem when the Germans violated treaties. You know, treaties... international agreements. Important things. There are a pile of ripped up treaties beside Trump's desk if you care to look.

The Germans were stopped in the first battle of the Marne, after sweeping aside the opposition. So yes I would say the French were out-fought and out-foxed by the Krauts. The First battle of Ypres ensured the stalemate on the Western Front.
 
The Germans were stopped in the first battle of the Marne, after sweeping aside the opposition. So yes I would say the French were out-fought and out-foxed by the Krauts. The First battle of Ypres ensured the stalemate on the Western Front.
Again, if you are going to take a view on the war in question, get it right. Who stopped the Germans? At the Marne? I'll give you a clue. It was not the French. I'll give you a clue about the Ypres battles too. BRITISH. Ok? Sorry for the lack of subtlety.

Ypres was a salient which was heavily defended because a breakthrough by the Germans could have rolled up the channel ports. Hitler, who was no stranger to Ypres...did not make that mistake.
 
Again, if you are going to take a view on the war in question, get it right. Who stopped the Germans? At the Marne? I'll give you a clue. It was not the French. I'll give you a clue about the Ypres battles too. BRITISH. Ok? Sorry for the lack of subtlety.

Ypres was a salient which was heavily defended because a breakthrough by the Germans could have rolled up the channel ports. Hitler, who was no stranger to Ypres...did not make that mistake.
So your saying the French did not in fact stop the Germans? That they did rely on a Foreign Army to do what they could not?
I thought you just said the Frogs were not out fought by the Krauts?
 
So your saying the French did not in fact stop the Germans? That they did rely on a Foreign Army to do what they could not?
I thought you just said the Frogs were not out fought by the Krauts?
Oh dear. The Marne was mostly UK because that is where the BEF were stationed and fought well. The French fought in different sectors in the race to the sea, but effectively the result was that the Germans were halted. We fought together.

But the counter attack by French and UK troops nearly encircled Gen Moltke's armies. Hardly outfought.

Verdun was a different matter, but effectively, the French were not outfought. Think of this - if the French were outfought the Germans would have taken Paris. Which did not happen.
 
Oh dear. The Marne was mostly UK because that is where the BEF were stationed and fought well. The French fought in different sectors in the race to the sea, but effectively the result was that the Germans were halted. We fought together.

But the counter attack by French and UK troops nearly encircled Gen Moltke's armies. Hardly outfought.

Verdun was a different matter, but effectively, the French were not outfought. Think of this - if the French were outfought the Germans would have taken Paris. Which did not happen.
The Germans were stopped about 70 klicks from Paris....in the first go. If that is success I would hate to see what a BFO would have looked like....oh wait we did in WW2.
 
It was just a question of who cracked first . Every army cracked in that war . Every bloody one. Well every Army that was in it seriously from 1914 or 1915. Except one. Luckily for the French that army was their primary ally.
I will agree with that, but the point remains that the French got their clocks cleaned by the huns. They also mutinied in 1917, and refused to go on the offensive to retake the portions of the country that the Germans captured until the US arrived in numbers.

Ironically enough I now have Brits defending the French Army's performance in WW1.
 
I will agree with that, but the point remains that the French got their clocks cleaned by the huns. They also mutinied in 1917, and refused to go on the offensive to retake the portions of the country that the Germans captured until the US arrived in numbers.

Ironically enough I now have Brits defending the French Army's performance in WW1.
It was the British army that never cracked and after the French mutinies had to take over the lead role on the western front.
 
Someone's put 50p (or should that be 50 kopecks) in the idiot


Worth remembering that George Bush appointed Director Mueller, Mueller served 8 years under him. Mueller then served 2 years under Obama, before an extra-ordinary extension for 2 years further.

Contrast an honourable career in public service with the circus that came to town recently...

NPR Choice page
 
The intent from the beginning was that in combat, the Americans would form US divisions commanded by their own men with their own rules and regulations. No one is saying otherwise. However, Corps command with the AED was initially largely French! Oh the irony. Only later did Pershing fight independently, but still with partnership in the strategic sense. A certain Maj Eisenhower developed a canny knack of working with troops from other nations. Came in handy that.

Much of the AED was in fact trained by UK and Commonwealth troops. With French and British weapons, especially French tanks.

Americans dont remember WW1 as they have the attention span of a goldfish with ADHD.
That certain Major never left the USA during WW1. he never saw the battlefield until 1942, nor did he serve with other nations troops until 1942

And most of the AEF went through training syllabus for trench operations conducted by the French not the British since most served in the French sectors
 
He means the Lewis gun but American designed while technically correct
Indeed and the French Hotchkiss machinegun was designed by Benjamin Hotchkiss of Watertown Connecticut. The Mle1909 version was the British Army's Portative model Mark I used by cavalry and the Tank Corps after the Lewis was replaced when a belt feed was designed for the Hotchkiss.

Lewis by the way signed over all royalty payments to the US treasury after April 1917 for all guns made therafter.
 
I don't fault the Germans for stomping the French. The Frogs were out fought plain and simple and it was their country to defend not yours or mine to worry about.

World War 2 was a different story.

World War 1 was just all the big kids on the block having a go at each other because nobody realized that this kind of war was going to be a long drawn out slug fest.
The French were outfought in WW1? FFS your grasp of history is pretty rubbish.
 

New Posts

Latest Threads

Top