The Sterling

AlienFTM

MIA
Book Reviewer
The correct term is L2A3
View attachment 495169
I did SMG during my 88 days RMP. The weapon I trained with was actually stamped L2A1, and Machine Carbine. I asked.my instructor. He reckoned it had come from Canada. It was indistinguishable from the L2A3.
 

arcticfox042

War Hero
Screen Shot 2020-08-07 at 13.26.59.png
 

Diogenes' limp

Old-Salt
In the aftermath of the Falklands War, the rumour went around that we'd used so much of NATO's war stock of 9mm (which i frankly doubt) that we imported cheap knock-off 9mm from India and Pakistan.

I never had a stoppage on an SMG (despite the myth of the subcontinental ammo).
The ammunition from India, as mentioned earlier,, wasn't a myth, as it had certainly occurred in a different decade, the early/mid 70s. The effects on the action and report were an anomaly that was puzzling on the range the first time it happened to me whilst firing. But walking up to the target at 20 yards, to find the rounds lodged half way through the ply was the real head scratcher.
Perhaps it was the earliest example of progress towards a new 'woke' army, the bullets strike with just sufficient force to to cause mild offence?
 

DaManBugs

LE
Book Reviewer
The ammunition from India, as mentioned earlier,, wasn't a myth, as it had certainly occurred in a different decade, the early/mid 70s. The effects on the action and report were an anomaly that was puzzling on the range the first time it happened to me whilst firing. But walking up to the target at 20 yards, to find the rounds lodged half way through the ply was the real head scratcher.
Perhaps it was the earliest example of progress towards a new 'woke' army, the bullets strike with just sufficient force to to cause mild offence?
Something that's set me to thinking since this very interesting thread started is whether the loads for the Smudge were different to the loads for the Hi-Power. That is, were the L2 loads "hotter" to make sure the weapon cycled correctly, while the L9 loads were "normal", as it were? It's something that never entered my mind while firing them and during reloads I never checked whether the packs had different markings. Anyone any idea?

MsG
 
The ammunition from India, as mentioned earlier,, wasn't a myth, as it had certainly occurred in a different decade, the early/mid 70s. The effects on the action and report were an anomaly that was puzzling on the range the first time it happened to me whilst firing. But walking up to the target at 20 yards, to find the rounds lodged half way through the ply was the real head scratcher.
Perhaps it was the earliest example of progress towards a new 'woke' army, the bullets strike with just sufficient force to to cause mild offence?
Indeed it wasn’t a myth as you say.

We went day to Hythe for a platoon range day which was a little unusual because they were usually company strength occasions.

It was immediately apparent that something was very wrong when the very first shots were fired. On two weapons, the bullets never even left the barrels of the SLR’s.

It was due to a couple of very experienced and astute Riflemen that something of a tragedy didn’t occur.

There was an immediate decision to abandon the range day and return to barracks at Dover.

If it had been a company strength range day, three times the amount of Riflemen shooting defective ammunition would have three times higher that the chances of a major accident may have occurred.

I’m pretty certain that we never used ammunition sourced from India ever again!
 

Themanwho

LE
Book Reviewer
Something that's set me to thinking since this very interesting thread started is whether the loads for the Smudge were different to the loads for the Hi-Power. That is, were the L2 loads "hotter" to make sure the weapon cycled correctly, while the L9 loads were "normal", as it were? It's something that never entered my mind while firing them and during reloads I never checked whether the packs had different markings. Anyone any idea?

MsG
No.
 

4(T)

LE
Something that's set me to thinking since this very interesting thread started is whether the loads for the Smudge were different to the loads for the Hi-Power. That is, were the L2 loads "hotter" to make sure the weapon cycled correctly, while the L9 loads were "normal", as it were? It's something that never entered my mind while firing them and during reloads I never checked whether the packs had different markings. Anyone any idea?

MsG

IIRC there was only ever one batch of 9mm that was divided by pistol/SMG and that was a lot purchased from Gevelot in 1974. The headstamps were identical, with just the pistol type having the box overstamped "for pistol use only".

Its unlikely that any Arrsers will have encountered this batch, so the broad answer is - no, there were no separate types for pistol and SMG.

IIRC#2, all other non-UK purchases of 9mm (and there were many) were approximately L2 spec and for use in both pistols and SMG. There were some non-standard types (ie training rounds).

Most of the subsequent "L" codes were to indicate the manufacturer of the ammunition, and not any difference in spec - it was all STANAG.

"L9" was a code allocated to batches from Dynamit Nobel, and was standard L2/ STANAG spec.
 
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Diogenes' limp

Old-Salt
Something that's set me to thinking since this very interesting thread started is whether the loads for the Smudge were different to the loads for the Hi-Power. That is, were the L2 loads "hotter" to make sure the weapon cycled correctly, while the L9 loads were "normal", as it were? It's something that never entered my mind while firing them and during reloads I never checked whether the packs had different markings. Anyone any idea?

MsG
It is not my area of expertise, though marksmanship and competitions were an area of interest throughout, and I'm sure a SME will be along shortly*, but from a practical level I don't think so, at least in my era**

All 9 mm ammunition used in both the Sterling and the Browning 9 mm pistol came from the same ammo boxes.

* Apologies to GATT, I see he has. ETA and 4T too.
** I preferred the Sterling to my original personal weapon, as, being a PORG, the Brown Bess was longer than I was tall.
 

ericferret

War Hero
Indeed it wasn’t a myth as you say.

We went day to Hythe for a platoon range day which was a little unusual because they were usually company strength occasions.

It was immediately apparent that something was very wrong when the very first shots were fired. On two weapons, the bullets never even left the barrels of the SLR’s.

It was due to a couple of very experienced and astute Riflemen that something of a tragedy didn’t occur.

There was an immediate decision to abandon the range day and return to barracks at Dover.

If it had been a company strength range day, three times the amount of Riflemen shooting defective ammunition would have three times higher that the chances of a major accident may have occurred.

I’m pretty certain that we never used ammunition sourced from India ever again!

Had a similar occurrence with 7.62 (1977) although no idea where it was manufactured.
Range day abandoned and ammo returned for investigation.
 

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