The sad demise of Thomas Cook Airlines

Grownup_Rafbrat

LE
Book Reviewer
I have long understood that when a British Embassy of consulate arranges a flight home for some 'distressed British subject' i.e. one who can't afford the flight, some sort of bond is entered into whereby the person is formally in debt (essentially to the taxpayer) for the sum after they arrive back in UK.

I have not read of anything like this applying to the rescued T Cook customers.
I think ATOL pays for that.
 
Those figures are fiction......... eg Tui want £360 return flight, travel to Manchester, 1 night in a hotel, £50 for petrol for the return trip, parking, £100 for transfer each way to Amalfi.

Easyjet from London....... flight £356 plus luggage.

1 night hotel, train, £100 each way transfer from Naples.

Then acommodation on top........
They are not fiction - are real (click on Google Flights and will take you to the link of booking on the airline page) - and like I said before, I don't know what your parameters are - I just did it for one person.

And you can always book an AirBnB or something for cheap separately.

I am not saying you're wrong or anything, just saying that there are so many different options out there.
 
I don't think ATOL covers you if you go flight only, so TC wouldn't have been liable, plus if you were robbed as well, and had no money, you probably would have to call in the embassy
 
I don't think ATOL covers you if you go flight only, so TC wouldn't have been liable, plus if you were robbed as well, and had no money, you probably would have to call in the embassy
Travel insurance is not that expensive....also if you have a decent credit card, they also bung in travel insurance for free. My Amex and HSBC ones do anyways.

Like I said numerous variable factors.
 

ancienturion

LE
Book Reviewer
I read in the newspaper that it is now intended to legislate in parliament for travel companies with their own aircraft, such as Cook to have to use those aircraft in order to bring customers home to UK. This now answers one of my own questions because it seems that it is not within the act at present to use those aircraft if the company has finished trading.
I reckon it would be a good idea and another comfort to customers.
 

Tyk

LE
I read in the newspaper that it is now intended to legislate in parliament for travel companies with their own aircraft, such as Cook to have to use those aircraft in order to bring customers home to UK. This now answers one of my own questions because it seems that it is not within the act at present to use those aircraft if the company has finished trading.
I reckon it would be a good idea and another comfort to customers.
That would be complicated, if the company goes bang it invariably owes a lot of money to people, including landing and fuelling fees to airports where the aircraft are currently located, not forgetting the crews. Insurances and maintenance would be a not insignificant consideration either.
 
There should be a fraud conviction.... the bastards knew, long before their final demise, that they were going tits- up, and cheated a lot of innocent people out of a shit-load of money......
 

ancienturion

LE
Book Reviewer
That would be complicated, if the company goes bang it invariably owes a lot of money to people, including landing and fuelling fees to airports where the aircraft are currently located, not forgetting the crews. Insurances and maintenance would be a not insignificant consideration either.
Possibly so but as I wrote at least parliament are going to have a look at it.
 
There should be a fraud conviction.... the bastards knew, long before their final demise, that they were going tits- up, and cheated a lot of innocent people out of a shit-load of money......
Not saying they're good - just saying that in this modern times, people should be able to weigh their different safe options.

That said, if they did sell all those holiday packages full well knowing they were going bust, that is a very good case for a class action lawsuit.
 
There should be a fraud conviction.... the bastards knew, long before their final demise, that they were going tits- up, and cheated a lot of innocent people out of a shit-load of money......
I lost 5 flights I had paid for when Germania Airlines went bust in Feb 2019. Their management said about 26k tickets had been sold when they went bust. I'm not aware of any criminal proceedings though towards the end they must have known they were flogging raffle tickets.
 
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Just a couple of questions.

In the UK, I believe it is an offence for a company to trade whilst insolvent, so at what point did the company actually become insolvent?

Was it on Monday the 23rd September when the Administrators took over or was it sometime earlier?

Were they still taking holiday bookings on the 21st September?
 

Tyk

LE
Just a couple of questions.

In the UK, I believe it is an offence for a company to trade whilst insolvent, so at what point did the company actually become insolvent?

Was it on Monday the 23rd September when the Administrators took over or was it sometime earlier?

Were they still taking holiday bookings on the 21st September?
That is true, but of course it's highly complicated when financing is being sought, or agreed financing falls through. A company can go from viable to insolvent in a matter of hours, especially common with the practice of running companies with vastly leveraged assets.
 

Joker62

ADC
Book Reviewer
I don't think ATOL covers you if you go flight only, so TC wouldn't have been liable, plus if you were robbed as well, and had no money, you probably would have to call in the embassy
It doesn't, but you still get charged the same fee on your ticket as package holidaymakers do.
 

Grownup_Rafbrat

LE
Book Reviewer
That is true, but of course it's highly complicated when financing is being sought, or agreed financing falls through. A company can go from viable to insolvent in a matter of hours, especially common with the practice of running companies with vastly leveraged assets.
Perhaps time to legislate on the matter of gearing ratios? Or what % of a company's assets can be mortgaged.

And whether mortgages should be funding dividends.

And whether directors should receive bonuses when the company isn't profitable. And whether directors' total remuneration should be limited to a smaller multiple of the lowest paid worker's remuneration.
 
Perhaps time to legislate on the matter of gearing ratios? Or what % of a company's assets can be mortgaged.

And whether mortgages should be funding dividends.

And whether directors should receive bonuses when the company isn't profitable. And whether directors' total remuneration should be limited to a smaller multiple of the lowest paid worker's remuneration.
Or perhaps we should stay out of private business.
If you were running a small company would you like the Government to tell you that you can only mortgaged what they tell you?
Plenty of businesses gamble with their assets, sometimes they win and pay taxes, create jobs and bump up their share prices, sometimes they lose and go tits up.
 

Grownup_Rafbrat

LE
Book Reviewer
Or perhaps we should stay out of private business.
If you were running a small company would you like the Government to tell you that you can only mortgaged what they tell you?
Plenty of businesses gamble with their assets, sometimes they win and pay taxes, create jobs and bump up their share prices, sometimes they lose and go tits up.
In theory I agree, but in practice, Southern Cross, Thomas Cook, and many others (Pizza Express) are causing huge distress to customers/patients and employees with these business practices and as it affects the national economy I am suggesting that it should be looked into and legislation passed to prevent such misery.

It never happened until Big Bang in the 1980s. Perhaps a baby was thrown out with some de-regulation bathwater?
 
In theory I agree, but in practice, Southern Cross, Thomas Cook, and many others (Pizza Express) are causing huge distress to customers/patients and employees with these business practices and as it affects the national economy I am suggesting that it should be looked into and legislation passed to prevent such misery.

It never happened until Big Bang in the 1980s. Perhaps a baby was thrown out with some de-regulation bathwater?

Customers and employees take their chances like everything else in life. If a company can mortgage itself and create 10000 jobs, should it be prevented from doing so because the government says its too risky?

The national economy doesnt complain when the companies gamble pays off.

In the 70s, (and the 30 years previous) the government seemed to nationalise everything that was failing. That didnt work out so well.
 

Grownup_Rafbrat

LE
Book Reviewer
Customers and employees take their chances like everything else in life. If a company can mortgage itself and create 10000 jobs, should it be prevented from doing so because the government says its too risky?

The national economy doesnt complain when the companies gamble pays off.

In the 70s, (and the 30 years previous) the government seemed to nationalise everything that was failing. That didnt work out so well.
Look back further. The Victorians got so fed up with scammers that they legislated. Much of that wasn't repealed until Big Bang.

The only thing we learn from history is that we never learn from history.

The problems of the 1970s deserve their own thread, but Corbyn and his mates aided by the USSR, played their part.
 
Look back further. The Victorians got so fed up with scammers that they legislated. Much of that wasn't repealed until Big Bang.

The only thing we learn from history is that we never learn from history.

The problems of the 1970s deserve their own thread, but Corbyn and his mates aided by the USSR, played their part.
If its fraud then there are already laws, it tends to be the wrong business decision.

There have been bankruptcies for centuries.

The government can barely run the country what makes you think they know about private businesses?
 

Gout Man

LE
Book Reviewer
I read in the newspaper that it is now intended to legislate in parliament for travel companies with their own aircraft, such as Cook to have to use those aircraft in order to bring customers home to UK. This now answers one of my own questions because it seems that it is not within the act at present to use those aircraft if the company has finished trading.
I reckon it would be a good idea and another comfort to customers.
There was talk of legislating for that after Monarch went bust, apparently the government were all over it until it fell into Chris Failing , sorry Graylings in tray.
Bloody typical of Mays premiership.
 

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