the old Sarrycan, does anyone know why...

#1
IMG_1656.JPG

this is a specialist Saracen wheeled APC pictured above, (you'll find this example at the Bovington Tank Museum Dorset.)
There were many of these sitting around in NI up until 1984, were they all sold off for scrap ect? if, and it's a big if, because I wasn't there, but my question is this... could these have saved lives in Iraq if we'd had these in the early stages of the operation instead of the snatch Landrovers. If they were kept mothballed somewhere, ran through base workshops, could they have? what's your opinion?
 
#2
An Ex REME mate of mine has one, he joined this very site briefly but everyone who posted on his thread was somewhat abusive. (shock horror)
from what he's said of the design there are many areas that could be improved, in particular the drive to all 6 wheels, oil lines, cooling and electrics as well as visibility for the driver. the list is pretty long really.
 

Grumblegrunt

LE
Book Reviewer
#3
one thing which was picked up early on is why the US military didn't ask for any of the 1000 (IIRC) or so m113s in storage in kuwait at the time instead the up armour humvee thing they tried and failed with.

same goes for us - not enough tracked stuff, like the debate over tanks in afghanistan.

by the time it had been bar armoured to cope with rpg you could have built new ones - we could have picked up the buffel cheap enough if we left BAE out of the equation
 
#5
IIRC it was abuse over asking about wearing uniform of a unit that's been disbanded in his saracen (hired out for weddings and such like) and some of the usual abuse over how a friend of his looked on her wedding in said saracen.

I can't be arsed to search for the threads as I'm far too lazy.
 
#6
ok, that sums it up quite well enough, bit odd, Sarrycan at a wedding, but hey, takes all types to make a world.
the old problems with fuel lines and drive train ect could have been rebuilt, It may have taken longer than developing new vehicles the way they did, but I doubt it.
 

_Chimurenga_

LE
Gallery Guru
#7
IIRC it was abuse over asking about wearing uniform of a unit that's been disbanded in his saracen (hired out for weddings and such like) and some of the usual abuse over how a friend of his looked on her wedding in said saracen.

I can't be arsed to search for the threads as I'm far too lazy.
This one ?

http://www.arrse.co.uk/intelligence-cell/163252-wedding-transport-anyone.html

Or this one ?

http://www.arrse.co.uk/intelligence...isbanded-british-regiment-family-wedding.html
 
#8
IIRC it was abuse over asking about wearing uniform of a unit that's been disbanded in his saracen (hired out for weddings and such like) and some of the usual abuse over how a friend of his looked on her wedding in said saracen.

I can't be arsed to search for the threads as I'm far too lazy.
The usual arrrse bollocks then.
 
#11
I did mention he was REME, didn't I mention the TA bit?
 

rampant

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#12
one thing which was picked up early on is why the US military didn't ask for any of the 1000 (IIRC) or so m113s in storage in kuwait at the time instead the up armour humvee thing they tried and failed with.

same goes for us - not enough tracked stuff, like the debate over tanks in afghanistan.

by the time it had been bar armoured to cope with rpg you could have built new ones - we could have picked up the buffel cheap enough if we left BAE out of the equation
Force Protection had major, major problems producing the Buffalo they just did not have the manufacturing capacity, personnel or the right management teams in place at the time - they only had a handful of guys working there they had to team up with BAe, Armor Holdings and GD in order to gain access to their manufacturing base and experience, indeed several of FPs orders were made with those companies instead because FP couldn't cope.
 
#13
View attachment 137857

this is a specialist Saracen wheeled APC pictured above, (you'll find this example at the Bovington Tank Museum Dorset.)
There were many of these sitting around in NI up until 1984, were they all sold off for scrap ect? if, and it's a big if, because I wasn't there, but my question is this... could these have saved lives in Iraq if we'd had these in the early stages of the operation instead of the snatch Landrovers. If they were kept mothballed somewhere, ran through base workshops, could they have? what's your opinion?
Seriously doubt it.

There's a reason why Warrior and Mastiff were running round with bloody great slabs of armour on the sides...Snatch, Sallycan - you'd still be dead.

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#14
ya see Gassin badgers that's where my question lies, slab sides don't protect you from blasts from underneath, IED'S are laid in the roadway, making vehicles and their crews and passengers vulnerable under the floor, slab sides would protect you from direct fire projectiles or IED side on blasts, I'm no expert, so I'm just asking, extra bolt on armour under a six wheeler rather than light Kevlar fitted to a light truck.
 

Drivers_lag

On ROPS
On ROPs
#15
View attachment 137857

this is a specialist Saracen wheeled APC pictured above, (you'll find this example at the Bovington Tank Museum Dorset.)
There were many of these sitting around in NI up until 1984, were they all sold off for scrap ect? if, and it's a big if, because I wasn't there, but my question is this... could these have saved lives in Iraq if we'd had these in the early stages of the operation instead of the snatch Landrovers. If they were kept mothballed somewhere, ran through base workshops, could they have? what's your opinion?
What is it, a flamethrower tank? I didn't know we had them in NI.
 
#17
Isn't there a water cannon version? Sure I saw one at Tankfest this year but I was quite drunk a lot of that weekend so the memory's not what it could be...
 
#18
ya see Gassin badgers that's where my question lies, slab sides don't protect you from blasts from underneath, IED'S are laid in the roadway, making vehicles and their crews and passengers vulnerable under the floor, slab sides would protect you from direct fire projectiles or IED side on blasts, I'm no expert, so I'm just asking, extra bolt on armour under a six wheeler rather than light Kevlar fitted to a light truck.
Without the 'V' shaped hull seen on most of the wheeled armoured vehicles in theatre now, you're going to be fucked anyway. Challenger 2, Warrior, etc all very susceptible to AT mines and IEDs. The design of the Mastiff and other newer vehicles gives them a huge advantage over traditional flat bottomed, tracked vehicles.
 
#19
Chieftain, Challenger 1 and Challenger 2 all have v-shaped hulls. Not massively extreme but it was designed in to deflect blasts under the belly.
chieftan_mk10_05_of_31.jpg
 
#20
ya see Gassin badgers that's where my question lies, slab sides don't protect you from blasts from underneath, IED'S are laid in the roadway, making vehicles and their crews and passengers vulnerable under the floor, slab sides would protect you from direct fire projectiles or IED side on blasts, I'm no expert, so I'm just asking, extra bolt on armour under a six wheeler rather than light Kevlar fitted to a light truck.
The IED threat in MND(SE) was very specific - hence my comment.

Saladin would have faired no better.

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