The New TA? or moral question

#1
Thoughts really.

Spoke to an IT recruitment agency about a NATO role last week and it's seems my SC clearance is still current because I'm still in the TA (I've not used my other clearance for over 12mnths so the other one has lapsed). A few checks and this practice is recommended for staying cleared (not official of course).

Seems like I'd be using TA but MoD/My own business point of view - it's just a practical arrangement. On the TA side - work stops me from holding a slot in the ORBAT and obviously attendance would be difficult.
 
#2
Are you worried that you can only get this job because of the SC the TA gives you but the new job will prevent you playing an active part in the TA?

If so I wouldn't worry. It's not really any different from anyone using courses the army has paid for to get them jobs. You could also argu that NATO is in more need of IT specialists than it is of Weekend Warriors.

Apologies if I have got the wrong end of thd stick
 
#3
Sounds about right.

Can't do a active role in unit, would be better to free up slot and maybe go national. It is NATO/MOD having more need of IT skills
 
#4
Sounds about right.

Can't do a active role in unit, would be better to free up slot and maybe go national. It is NATO/MOD having more need of IT skills
Sounds like a good idea if you want to stay involved with the TA. The national units are excellent and very understanding of other job commitments.
 

Command_doh

LE
Book Reviewer
#5
I hear stories that certain National T.A. Hubs are regionalising themselves to save money. One in particular is looking likely to become housing estates in the not too distant future. With this in mind, does the 'national' T.A. concept not hold water long term now?
 
F

fozzy

Guest
#6
Thoughts really.

Spoke to an IT recruitment agency about a NATO role last week and it's seems my SC clearance is still current because I'm still in the TA (I've not used my other clearance for over 12mnths so the other one has lapsed). A few checks and this practice is recommended for staying cleared (not official of course).

Seems like I'd be using TA but MoD/My own business point of view - it's just a practical arrangement. On the TA side - work stops me from holding a slot in the ORBAT and obviously attendance would be difficult.
Your SC will lapse after time. You can get it transfered to the new organisation, if they are eligable to manage security clearances. For example BT manages Security Clearances for its personnel and its contractors and suppliers. I know several folk who have had BT take over the sponsoring of their SC/DV clearance from the Army.
 
#7
Do all TA soldiers have SC? - no matter their cap badge? - for example, do TA infantry have SC (at jnco level)?

I remember doing a vetting questionaire on entry to the TA. but would this have been SC? or just CTC?
 
F

fozzy

Guest
#8
Do all TA soldiers have SC? - no matter their cap badge? - for example, do TA infantry have SC (at jnco level)?

I remember doing a vetting questionaire on entry to the TA. but would this have been SC? or just CTC?
Everyone is CTC. SC is specific to role/trade.
 

Bowmore_Assassin

MIA
Moderator
Book Reviewer
#9
All Regular officers are SC. I thought the same applied TA officers - can one if our TA brethren confirm this ?


Sent from my iPhone using ARRSE app
 
#10
It's not true. They only get 1x 45 minute period on V+S, so cant be trusted, and are trusted with no more responsibility than the TAC keys. So no requirement really.
 
#11
and are trusted with no more responsibility than the TAC keys.
There's trust and then there's trust. Holy crap, could you imagine if one of them let himself into the stores? Imagine how long it would take to clear up!
 
#12
It's not true. They only get 1x 45 minute period on V+S, so cant be trusted, and are trusted with no more responsibility than the TAC keys. So no requirement really.
You got the TAC keys? Bloody luxury!

Although with the OK of the QM, I did once pitch up, unlock the garage, drive out one of our platoon landies, sign my own work ticket, do an evening Recce for the upcoming Remembrance parade in another town, and put it all back afterwards. Or perhaps as a young Lt, I misunderstood "just use one of your platoon wagons to do the recce" (and yes, the MT Sgt had signed my FMT600). ;)

It didn't cause half the trouble I made when I broke into the TAC (zero damage caused) to park up the minibus because it was 3am and I didn't want to wake up the Caretaker and her newborn if I didn't have to... QM was utterly convinced I'd got a copied key, perhaps opening the Officers' Mess Bar (the AO went home with the key) with a shaped piece of acetate convinced him I hadn't. It might not have been the smartest thing to do on the first night the new CO was in the mess...
 
#13
You would be advised to speak to PSAO ref this, especially if your role is in KAIA, one chap fairly recently, completed his op Tour, and went straight back out to Afghan as a civilian & managed to do enough to qualify for his bounty by turning up for duty for various days & hours with the resident Royal Signals unit.
Certainly worth mentioning, as practically every unit would be grateful for an extra pair of hands.



Thoughts really.

Spoke to an IT recruitment agency about a NATO role last week and it's seems my SC clearance is still current because I'm still in the TA (I've not used my other clearance for over 12mnths so the other one has lapsed). A few checks and this practice is recommended for staying cleared (not official of course).

Seems like I'd be using TA but MoD/My own business point of view - it's just a practical arrangement. On the TA side - work stops me from holding a slot in the ORBAT and obviously attendance would be difficult.
 
#14
Thoughts really.

Spoke to an IT recruitment agency about a NATO role last week and it's seems my SC clearance is still current because I'm still in the TA (I've not used my other clearance for over 12mnths so the other one has lapsed). A few checks and this practice is recommended for staying cleared (not official of course).

Seems like I'd be using TA but MoD/My own business point of view - it's just a practical arrangement. On the TA side - work stops me from holding a slot in the ORBAT and obviously attendance would be difficult.
As ever you seem to doing a good impression of a cold war Numbers Station, but from what I can decipher of your post:

It doesn't matter why you have SC (or DV that matter), however if you are going to do a job outside of the Army/clearance holder then whoever you are working for needs to ensure that they take temporary ownership of your clearance for the period that you are employed by them - if this a NATO role which involves CENTCOM there are also other hoops to be jumped through.

In short - there is no problem with you having SC through being a STAB, but it not quite as simple as turning up on site and giving someone a printout of your JPA profficiencies. If the appropriate procedures have not been followed you will not be cleared.
 
#15
As ever you seem to doing a good impression of a cold war Numbers Station, but from what I can decipher of your post:
Guess it's my turn to be confused...

Don't get involved with checking clearance bit, that's the responsibility of the agency but my experience is it's rather more simple than getting a printout from JPA or .... far less complex than sorting out works tickets to drive a truck.
 
#16
As ever you seem to doing a good impression of a cold war Numbers Station, but from what I can decipher of your post:
I think the bit your on about is the lapsed bit....

As a contractor I'll move between SC roles and other forms of checking such as CRB or disclosure scotland. These checks aren't vetting and so don't count towards keeping the SC active, so it will lapse.

The suggested method of preventing the SC from lapsing is to join the TA.... (obviously a role that needs SC).

but attendance at TA is unlikely - too far away etc, therefore getting bounty qualified is difficult (without loosing money and not seeing family).
 
F

fozzy

Guest
#17
Polar,
Are you actually in the TA at the moment? I must admit, I am having trouble in decoding your question.

If I have managed to find the correct keymat, then you can have your SC "sponsorship "transfered to your employer from the Army, IF they are allowed to sponsor and manage their own vetting. Many organisations with Public Sector/Defence business divisons can do this - BT, C&W, Serco, Lockheed Martin UK, Logica etc. You simply give the details of your vetting across and they manage the renewals etc.

There is a Linked In forum that explains all this in its FAQ's - called "SC/DV - Use it or lose it"
 
#18
Polar,
Are you actually in the TA at the moment? I must admit, I am having trouble in decoding your question.

If I have managed to find the correct keymat, then you can have your SC "sponsorship "transfered to your employer from the Army, IF they are allowed to sponsor and manage their own vetting. Many organisations with Public Sector/Defence business divisons can do this - BT, C&W, Serco, Lockheed Martin UK, Logica etc. You simply give the details of your vetting across and they manage the renewals etc.

There is a Linked In forum that explains all this in its FAQ's - called "SC/DV - Use it or lose it"
Eh mate, Polar is signals. You can't expect him to communicate with clarity, surely???
 
#19
Polar,
Are you actually in the TA at the moment? I must admit, I am having trouble in decoding your question.

There is a Linked In forum that explains all this in its FAQ's - called "SC/DV - Use it or lose it"
Yep, that's where the advice about joining the TA to keep your SC current came from. The question was: Is it ethical?

My experience is contractors find it very difficult to attend (standard) TA - you loose soldiers for months, if not years. I don't think any of the JNCO's in my troop deployed (when it was compulsory) but they'd retain vetting for future contracts. I've not seen my unit for over a year - just don't have the time (I will do shortly but that's either to hand kit in or go on camp - leaving sounds sensible at the mo)
 

BuggerAll

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#20
All Regular officers are SC. I thought the same applied TA officers - can one if our TA brethren confirm this ?


Sent from my iPhone using ARRSE app
Yes SC is minimum for reserve officers.

On the OP's question I don't think there is any question that you should take the the job provided its what you want to do. If you can't make your commitment to the TA over the foreseeable future then I think you need to consider whether you should stay or not.

As you mentioned there are the nationally recruited units which have different commitments which may be user friendly for you and which would allow you to continue to contribute your experience.

Edited to add. I haven't quite addressed the ethical issue of staying in the TA to remain SC with no intention of meeting your commitment.

I suppose the simple answer is be honest with your chain of command - not perhaps on the SC thing. Tell them what the job entails and what that means for your commitment to the TA. If they ask you to go then shake hands and go. If they are happy for you to stay then soldier on.
 

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