The new Land Rover Defender is go!

I had a Freelander 2 'Commercial' which was basically a standard Freelander with the rear bench seat deleted, a load guard fitted behind the front seats and a load floor fitted in lieu of the rear seats. With regard to the (new) Defender, the 2nd & optional 3rd row seats fold flat in a similar way to Discovery 3 & 4 to give a flat loadspace.
From personal experience, the extra doors into the loadspace are useful - look at Transit Custom, most owners / drivers prefer the side load doors for acessibility and flexibility. The issue of kerb weight has been resolved by integrating the chassis into the body, retaining the strength but reducing the mass, thereby increasing the (seating) flexibility but retaining the load-carrying ability. A more practical reason to retain the rear doors is simply to reduce the panel option count and type approval cost - as we're all aware, car production control was handed over to accountants long ago... :(
The “commercial” Freelander and Discovery markets are tiny niche though, aren’t they. I think a lot of Defender buyers will want something more rugged; a full length hardtop with a tray in the back. Just look at how many twin cabs are specced out with all the luxury option but have a tub and hardtop at the back. Given the type approval stuff that JLR do at SVR, it can’t be that hard. They changed just about every panel on the XE Project 8, including welding up the back doors.
 

OneTenner

LE
Book Reviewer
The “commercial” Freelander and Discovery markets are tiny niche though, aren’t they. I think a lot of Defender buyers will want something more rugged; a full length hardtop with a tray in the back. Just look at how many twin cabs are specced out with all the luxury option but have a tub and hardtop at the back. Given the type approval stuff that JLR do at SVR, it can’t be that hard. They changed just about every panel on the XE Project 8, including welding up the back doors.
Yep, the 'commercial' options for FL2, Disco 3 & 4 were essentially production line bolt-ons (and offs) to increase the sales breadth of marketing. Other than the demo versions, FL2 didn't sell well - mine was one of the Demo's. Disco 3 & 4 sold OK, most were illegally converted back to passenger cars without the VAT being properly accounted for....
The New Defender loadspace is a lot more rugged than the carpeted Discovery fold-flat incarnations
1594248597837.png


It's not going to suit everyone, but neither did the myriad of options on the old model.
All I can suggest is go to the dealer and have a look. The rear door is certainly wider than the old one, not as wide as the drop gate, but it doesn't have the turning circle of the 'Torrey Canyon' either....
 
Yep, the 'commercial' options for FL2, Disco 3 & 4 were essentially production line bolt-ons (and offs) to increase the sales breadth of marketing. Other than the demo versions, FL2 didn't sell well - mine was one of the Demo's. Disco 3 & 4 sold OK, most were illegally converted back to passenger cars without the VAT being properly accounted for....
The New Defender loadspace is a lot more rugged than the carpeted Discovery fold-flat incarnations
View attachment 488232

It's not going to suit everyone, but neither did the myriad of options on the old model.
All I can suggest is go to the dealer and have a look. The rear door is certainly wider than the old one, not as wide as the drop gate, but it doesn't have the turning circle of the 'Torrey Canyon' either....
The new Defender isn’t here in Aus yet in the flesh. I’m buying one, but, like everything, it will be a compromise.

A decent commercial version would be really good; a tray in the back that can be washed out and that will survive daily loading and unloading without needing to take any care.

There is a big market for such a vehicle outside of the UK.
 

OneTenner

LE
Book Reviewer
I've not seen any full length liner for New Defender - which is an omission in my view, hopefully one that the aftermarket co's. will rectify.
There is no demarcation between passenger and load compartment as of old, both are transient depending on needs - which is the current 'mobility' thinking, ignoring the 'chuck it in, wash it out' market will lose some sales but will be more than made up for by the aspirational / lifestyle purchases.
I'm not aware of SV or Mantec working on any model branches but as i'm now a couple of tiers down from that level of info....
 
I've not seen any full length liner for New Defender - which is an omission in my view, hopefully one that the aftermarket co's. will rectify.
There is no demarcation between passenger and load compartment as of old, both are transient depending on needs - which is the current 'mobility' thinking, ignoring the 'chuck it in, wash it out' market will lose some sales but will be more than made up for by the aspirational / lifestyle purchases.
I'm not aware of SV or Mantec working on any model branches but as i'm now a couple of tiers down from that level of info....
The “chuck it in, wash it out” market is massive in countries that use their 4x4s as dual purpose vehicles. Here in Aus, a twincab is a family car. It may double up as a work vehicle or it may just be used for recreation, but it’s very much an aspirational / lifestyle purchase.

Australians buy more Hiluxes a year than any single Landrover product sells globally. Most of them are either dual purpose or lifestyle vehicles.
 
. . . . A more practical reason to retain the rear doors is simply to reduce the panel option count and type approval cost - as we're all aware, car production control was handed over to accountants long ago... :(
What he said . . . !!
. . . . Given the type approval stuff that JLR do at SVR, it can’t be that hard. They changed just about every panel on the XE Project 8, including welding up the back doors.
I am NOT sure SVR do - or NEED to do - ANY type approval testing.

Before they start hacking-about to modify any standard-off-the-line production model, I would imagine they/SVR, require someone (even themselves for a prototype !), to have FIRST bought and registered the vehicle.

I understand, once a vehicle is registered, the only "testing" to which it will subjected, is the standard annual MOT road-safety test.
 
Posted in the New DEFENDER thread, and in the INEOS thread.

DO NOT (YET) BUY A NEW DISCOVERY 5 . . . the price of the existing new vehicles will soon be reduced to “move” existing stock, and after the “face-lift” who knows ?!

+ + + + + + + + + +

Published by AUTOCAR magazine, on 08 JULY 2020.

Our innovator STURMEY AWARD winner - GERRY McGOVERN long-serving design director at Land Rover.

We talk about the Discovery, the current design he agrees hasn’t been as successful as the rest.

Jerry McGovern (page 43) “I think I allowed myself – and the team – to be too influenced by the established visual DNA of previous Discoverys, stuff like the offset number plate and stepped roof . . . (it does) have a massive rear quarter . . . our facelift, which is imminent, will make changes that improve it significantly . . . “

It is clear, however, that McGovern thinks the next all-new Discovery, probably four years away, will provide an opportunity for real change.

Jerry McGovern (page 43) “We won’t alter its breadth of capability,” he says, “but we’ll make sure it’s perfectly differentiated from the Range Rover and that’ll optimise its appeal”.

1594376268312.png
 

4(T)

LE
Posted in the New DEFENDER thread, and in the INEOS thread.

DO NOT (YET) BUY A NEW DISCOVERY 5 . . . the price of the existing new vehicles will soon be reduced to “move” existing stock, and after the “face-lift” who knows ?!

+ + + + + + + + + +

Published by AUTOCAR magazine, on 08 JULY 2020.

Our innovator STURMEY AWARD winner - GERRY McGOVERN long-serving design director at Land Rover.

We talk about the Discovery, the current design he agrees hasn’t been as successful as the rest.

Jerry McGovern (page 43) “I think I allowed myself – and the team – to be too influenced by the established visual DNA of previous Discoverys, stuff like the offset number plate and stepped roof . . . (it does) have a massive rear quarter . . . our facelift, which is imminent, will make changes that improve it significantly . . . “

It is clear, however, that McGovern thinks the next all-new Discovery, probably four years away, will provide an opportunity for real change.

Jerry McGovern (page 43) “We won’t alter its breadth of capability,” he says, “but we’ll make sure it’s perfectly differentiated from the Range Rover and that’ll optimise its appeal”.

View attachment 488561

Perhaps they've belatedly realised that having a range of visually-similar generic "blobs" is throwing away the market differentiation advantage they had with the unique old models?
 
Perhaps they've belatedly realised that having a range of visually-similar generic "blobs" is throwing away the market differentiation advantage they had with the unique old models?
The thing is with marketing (in its widest context), you don’t know how the market will reword to a product until you actually sell it.

I can easily see how JLR confused that a generic Discovery look might work, particularly when they knew that Defender was on the way. I can also see why they would want a consistent product look; it’s worked for BMW, Merc, Audi etc.

With the Discovery, they made a right mess up of the details, particularly the arrse end. The curved look of the rest of the range hairs doesn’t work on a car as tall as the Disco. And that asymmetric number plate......

The Discovery is, however, a fantastic vehicle. Once you are looking out of it, not at it!
 
The thing is with marketing (in its widest context), you don’t know how the market will reword to a product until you actually sell it.

I can easily see how JLR confused that a generic Discovery look might work, particularly when they knew that Defender was on the way. I can also see why they would want a consistent product look; it’s worked for BMW, Merc, Audi etc.

With the Discovery, they made a right mess up of the details, particularly the arrse end. The curved look of the rest of the range hairs doesn’t work on a car as tall as the Disco. And that asymmetric number plate......

The Discovery is, however, a fantastic vehicle. Once you are looking out of it, not at it!
I will be very interested to see this "facelift".

A "facelift" usually involves anything but metal-work, which gets expensive if they have to machine new tooling with which to press different metal body panels.

So usually just plastic items (grill, bumpers, etc..), and lights . . . both of which are/can be bought-in from different suppliers.

But, I can not see how "tinkering" with the details, is going to help reduce that huge ARRSE !! ;) .
 
I will be very interested to see this "facelift".

A "facelift" usually involves anything but metal-work, which gets expensive if they have to machine new tooling with which to press different metal body panels.

So usually just plastic items (grill, bumpers, etc..), and lights . . . both of which are/can be bought-in from different suppliers.

But, I can not see how "tinkering" with the details, is going to help reduce that huge ARRSE !! ;) .
If all they do is press a new rear tailgate, they’ll be half way there.
 
I saw one yesterday up on Long Mynd in Shropshire - it was, of course, white and spotless: it's ******* gopping.

It's nothing you hoped it might be, and everything you knew it would be - it just screams chavvy hairdresser with the windows down and the system up.
 
Posted in the New DEFENDER thread, and in the INEOS thread.

DO NOT (YET) BUY A NEW DISCOVERY 5 . . . the price of the existing new vehicles will soon be reduced to “move” existing stock, and after the “face-lift” who knows ?!

+ + + + + + + + + +

Published by AUTOCAR magazine, on 08 JULY 2020.

Our innovator STURMEY AWARD winner - GERRY McGOVERN long-serving design director at Land Rover.

We talk about the Discovery, the current design he agrees hasn’t been as successful as the rest.

Jerry McGovern (page 43) “I think I allowed myself – and the team – to be too influenced by the established visual DNA of previous Discoverys, stuff like the offset number plate and stepped roof . . . (it does) have a massive rear quarter . . . our facelift, which is imminent, will make changes that improve it significantly . . . “

It is clear, however, that McGovern thinks the next all-new Discovery, probably four years away, will provide an opportunity for real change.

Jerry McGovern (page 43) “We won’t alter its breadth of capability,” he says, “but we’ll make sure it’s perfectly differentiated from the Range Rover and that’ll optimise its appeal”.

View attachment 488561
Just found the following . . . . ;) !

+ + + + + + + + + + + +

DISCOVERY
Enhanced offers available on selected Discovery vehicles, up to £8,500 Finance Deposit Allowance and APR 3.9%.


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Similar "discount" on "full-fat" Range-Rover, but with higher 5.9% APR, and - of course - totally market position/price category.
 
The little Jimny 4x4, has mentioned many times on this and other threads . . .

[DRIFT]

Published by: Lawrence Allan, AUTOCAR magazine, on 08 July 2020.

Suzuki’s UK range becomes hybrid-only, Jimny goes off sale.

Suzuki has removed all non-hybrid variants from its UK line-up; only existing orders of Jimny 4x4 will be fulfilled.


Suzuki’s UK line-up is will soon be exclusively hybridised, with non-electrified variants of all models down to dealer stock only and the Jimny 4x4 now no longer directly available to order.

The future of the compact off-roader was already in question after Suzuki UK said it would only be sold “in very limited numbers throughout 2020” at the start of the year. A brand spokesperson has now confirmed that “once existing and limited number dealer allocations to customers are fulfilled over the next 4-5 months” it will be officially axed.

As previously rumoured, there remains a possibility that the model could be brought back into the market as an N1 class commercial vehicle in future, with the removal of the rear seats to enable a load bay alongside other homologation alterations. However, this is yet to be confirmed.


The Jimny’s fate is largely down to the adverse effect it has on the brand’s fleet average CO2 emissions. Even in most frugal manual form its CO2 rating is 154g/km - well above the 95g/km fleet average Suzuki will need to meet in 2021.

Suzuki’s wider range now comprises the Vitara and S-Cross SUVs, the Swift and Swift Sport hatchbacks and the Ignis city car. All are now offered solely with mild-hybrid petrol engines.

The Ignis and Swift use a cheaper and simpler 12v system, while the SUVs and Swift Sport use a more advanced 48v system. Suzuki claims economy is boosted by as much as 15%, and CO2 is reduced by as much as 25%, compared with the previous non-hybrid versions.

The range will soon also be joined by the Across SUV - recently revealed as the first product created under a partnership between Suzuki and Toyota. Essentially a rebadged and lightly restyled RAV4, the Across features Suzuki's first plug-in hybrid powertrain.

1594480986042.png



[/DRIFT]
 

4(T)

LE
The little Jimny 4x4, has mentioned many times on this and other threads . . .

[DRIFT]

Published by: Lawrence Allan, AUTOCAR magazine, on 08 July 2020.

Suzuki’s UK range becomes hybrid-only, Jimny goes off sale.

Suzuki has removed all non-hybrid variants from its UK line-up; only existing orders of Jimny 4x4 will be fulfilled.

Suzuki’s UK line-up is will soon be exclusively hybridised, with non-electrified variants of all models down to dealer stock only and the Jimny 4x4 now no longer directly available to order.

The future of the compact off-roader was already in question after Suzuki UK said it would only be sold “in very limited numbers throughout 2020” at the start of the year. A brand spokesperson has now confirmed that “once existing and limited number dealer allocations to customers are fulfilled over the next 4-5 months” it will be officially axed.

As previously rumoured, there remains a possibility that the model could be brought back into the market as an N1 class commercial vehicle in future, with the removal of the rear seats to enable a load bay alongside other homologation alterations. However, this is yet to be confirmed.


The Jimny’s fate is largely down to the adverse effect it has on the brand’s fleet average CO2 emissions. Even in most frugal manual form its CO2 rating is 154g/km - well above the 95g/km fleet average Suzuki will need to meet in 2021.

Suzuki’s wider range now comprises the Vitara and S-Cross SUVs, the Swift and Swift Sport hatchbacks and the Ignis city car. All are now offered solely with mild-hybrid petrol engines.

The Ignis and Swift use a cheaper and simpler 12v system, while the SUVs and Swift Sport use a more advanced 48v system. Suzuki claims economy is boosted by as much as 15%, and CO2 is reduced by as much as 25%, compared with the previous non-hybrid versions.

The range will soon also be joined by the Across SUV - recently revealed as the first product created under a partnership between Suzuki and Toyota. Essentially a rebadged and lightly restyled RAV4, the Across features Suzuki's first plug-in hybrid powertrain.

View attachment 488865


[/DRIFT]

Thats a shame. We were saving up for a new one. I personally don't like the new G-Wagen looks, so maybe we'll try to get a late old model now.
 
I saw one yesterday up on Long Mynd in Shropshire - it was, of course, white and spotless: it's ******* gopping.

It's nothing you hoped it might be, and everything you knew it would be - it just screams chavvy hairdresser with the windows down and the system up.
Got back this avo for a 2800km road trip in a week. Of that, about 1000km was on dirt roads, much of it muddy and all of it corrugated.

This morning we took it up a track that climbed 1500m of muddy, boggy tracks and slid back down. Nothing really challenging, but water crossings above sill level and lots of sections where the track was water logged. Plenty of mud. We left and drove 6 hours back home, much on roads that would be B roads in the UK.

We did it in my partner’s Discovery Sport. Last minute decision; take my Landcruiser or take her Landrover? Her Disco Sport is chavvy white with black wheels and a black top, including a glass roof. Today, it’s filthy; red mud up to the waist. Tomorrow it will be white and spotless. But by **** it’s an impressive vehicle. The same journey in the Landcruiser would have used twice the fuel and would have been seriously uncomfortable.

Can’t wait for the Defender to arrive here.
 
Oh dear . . . !!

bronco_sport_exterior_02_1.jpg


TWO - New Ford Bronco SPORT.

Why the “Blue Oval” would launch/introduce this second, totally separate different model, AT THE SAME TIME AS, the expected/anticipated big BRONCO is beyond me. Regrettably, this smaller vehicle . . . sharing NOTHING with the big one, other than (part of) its name . . . is probably going to be lost in all the ballyhoo and confusion. It is a shame :( .

Although we are told the smaller vehicle will (also!) NOT be exported, it is to be hoped that this decision will change.

This smaller vehicle looks far more suited for a “World” vehicle . . . rather than “Stetson and cowboy boots” vehicle, that is the big BRONCO.

For the moment Jaguar Land Rover (JLR), must be relieved that their new DEFENDER will not have to compete with the attractive BRONCO SPORT, in world markets. I don’t think that situation will last long ;) !!


+ + + + + + + + + + + + + +

Published by: James Attwood, digital editor, AUTOCAR magazine, on Tuesday 14 July 2020.

New Ford Bronco: revived Jeep Wrangler rival revealed.

Long-running nameplate is brought back for new family of rugged off-roaders, including two-door, four-door and (a second, totally separate, different model, the . . . ) road-biased Bronco Sport models.

View attachment 489613

Launched alongside the new off-roader, the Bronco Sport is described by Ford as “the Bronco of small SUVs” and expands the nameplate to a more road-focused vehicle for the first time. As with the standard Bronco, there are no plans to launch it in the UK.

Although the Jeep Compass-rivalling Bronco Sport takes its retro styling cues from the regular Bronco, it is built on a different platform, utilising Ford’s C2 architecture that also underpins the Focus and Kuga.

While it's built more for on-road use, the Bronco Sport offers four-wheel drive as standard and is designed to still be capable off road. High-end models will feature an advanced 4x4 system that features a twin-clutch rear drive unit with a differential lock.

The Bronco Sport will be offered with a choice of two Ecoboost petrol engines: a 1.5-litre unit producing 179bhp and 190lb ft, and a 2.0-litre unit with 242bhp and 275lb ft. Both engines will use an eight-speed automatic gearbox as standard.

As with the regular Bronco, up to seven GOAT driver models will be offered (with the totally separate, different SPORT model), depending on trim. All models will feature independent front and rear suspension, while higher-end models will gain specially tuned front struts with hydraulic rebound. The Trail Control suite of off-road driver assistance systems will also be offered.

The Bronco Sport features a more comfort-focused interior, although still features washable rubber flooring and easy-to-clean cloth seat covers. The boot is designed to accommodate two standing mountain bikes, while LED floodlights can be built into the tailgate. The rear window can be opened separately from the boot, while a slide-out working side table is also offered.

Ford’s Sync 3 infotainment system features an 8.0in touchscreen. More than 100 factory and aftermarket accessories will be offered.

 
Posted on the INEOS thread, and on the New DEFENDER thread , , ,

INEOS GRENADIER or LAND ROVER DEFENDER. Which one would you buy?

•Jul 8, 2020

Attacking a vehicle segment that most car makers have largely abandoned, is the Ineos Grenadier the Land Rover Defender replacement that the die-hard fans where hoping for? . . .


.
@bobthebuilder is the well known 4x4 writer, explorer and filmmaker, Andrew St Pierre White, and I claim my £5-00 !! ;) .
 
Last edited:
How Does The 2020 Land Rover Defender Perform Off-Road? I Race It Against an Old One To Find Out!

Posted on facebook, on 25 July 2020.

 

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