The new Land Rover Defender is go!

The new Pentastar V6 powerplant is pretty reliable and efficient though. It always performed well in very many vehicles, especially in latest gen ones. No wonder Chrysler FIAT adopted it widely.

I looked recently and I am still not impressed with 18mpg city and 23mpg highway. Bump it up to 25mpg and 30mpg and it might be interesting.
 
I looked recently and I am still not impressed with 18mpg city and 23mpg highway. Bump it up to 25mpg and 30mpg and it might be interesting.
A Jeep Wrangler is not a heavy vehicle, 18 to 23 mpg is pretty abismal, yes it is a 4X4 but still. I had a 3.0ltr Vauxhall Frontera 25 to 30 mpg.
 
A Jeep Wrangler is not a heavy vehicle, 18 to 23 mpg is pretty abismal, yes it is a 4X4 but still. I had a 3.0ltr Vauxhall Frontera 25 to 30 mpg.
When we rolled up here I was looking around for a decent SUV type car to buy and could not find much better than around the 18 - 23mpg mark across the board. Fuel is cheap so no one really pays much attention to mpg figures if they can afford to buy the vehicle, new or secondhand. The same vehicles sold in euroland with a 1.8 or 2.0 engine are in many cases sold here with a V6 at around the 3.0 mark.
 
A Jeep Wrangler is not a heavy vehicle, 18 to 23 mpg is pretty abismal, yes it is a 4X4 but still. I had a 3.0ltr Vauxhall Frontera 25 to 30 mpg.
You can't really compare a Frontera on the old NEDC test cycle (abysmal) with the US FTP cycle. The old NEDC was so far off the real fuel efficiency mark, it was laughable. No wonder they updated it to the new WTLP procedure..
 
When we rolled up here I was looking around for a decent SUV type car to buy and could not find much better than around the 18 - 23mpg mark across the board. Fuel is cheap so no one really pays much attention to mpg figures if they can afford to buy the vehicle, new or secondhand. The same vehicles sold in euroland with a 1.8 or 2.0 engine are in many cases sold here with a V6 at around the 3.0 mark.
The same attitude existed in Oz, especially Qld when I was there in the 90s. I had an F100 with a lightly tuned 5.7ltr V8, all my mates in a Bike club (Wanderers MCC) ran Ford or Holdon V8s.
Can't quite remember, but I'm sure it was around a Aus Dollar a ltr.
 
You can't really compare a Frontera on the old NEDC test cycle (abysmal) with the US FTP cycle. The old NEDC was so far off the real fuel efficiency mark, it was laughable. No wonder they updated it to the new WTLP procedure..
I haven't a clue what those tests are, so haven't a clue what your talking about.
 
You can't really compare a Frontera on the old NEDC test cycle (abysmal) with the US FTP cycle. The old NEDC was so far off the real fuel efficiency mark, it was laughable. No wonder they updated it to the new WTLP procedure..
That'll be the new one which is being fiddled with all these auto engine off devices whenever you stop at traffic lights.

None of them are true representations, all the manufacturers work some fiddle or other to make up efficiency figures.
 
I haven't a clue what those tests are, so haven't a clue what your talking about.
Sorry - was speaking in 3/4 letter abbreviations.

NEDC - New European Driving Cycle (EU) -1997 to 2017

FTP - Federal Test Procedure (US) - Came in to play in 2009 roughly

WLTP - World Harmonized Test Procedure (successor to NEDC and a lot of other cycles around the world, minus the U.S.) - based on real world conditions.
 
That'll be the new one which is being fiddled with all these auto engine off devices whenever you stop at traffic lights.

None of them are true representations, all the manufacturers work some fiddle or other to make up efficiency figures.

I care to disagree with you. The older NEDC was the perfect one for stop-start tech. The new one really doesn't help stop-start too much, the vehicles actually have to be a bit more efficient.

The WLTP takes out a whole lot of loop holes which NEDC did. NEDC allowed vehicle manufacturers to certify anything from a BMW 316 all the way to M3 on the same certification as the base model. While testing the base model without any auxillaries (AC, radio, lights etc) running.
 

RigPig

War Hero
See the link for an article from an Australian magazine. If you click on the first photo it will open up 100 pictures.

I saw a new 90 and it looks better in the flesh than in the pictures.

RP.
 
Sorry - was speaking in 3/4 letter abbreviations.

NEDC - New European Driving Cycle (EU) -1997 to 2017

FTP - Federal Test Procedure (US) - Came in to play in 2009 roughly

WLTP - World Harmonized Test Procedure (successor to NEDC and a lot of other cycles around the world, minus the U.S.) - based on real world conditions.
Nope..... Still haven't a clue.!!
All I need to know is how, far it'll go on one gallon of diesel. All that twoddle you came out with means absolutely nothing to me. And just to save you typing it out, I'm not really interested.
 
You are going to get complicated regardless of price. It can't be any other way than that now.
As for versatile, I guess we'll see when they are out on the roads

I did see one of the new 110's a week or so ago and they look better in the flesh. Didn't see it up close though
My bet it that the Grenadier will end up being a very expensive bespoke vehicle. Production numbers will be small whatever The fixed costs of product development and building a dealer network will have to be spread across a relatively small number of vehicles.

JLR couldn’t make the numbers add up and they aren’t developing from start up. I’ll be amazed if anyone ever gets to buy an Ineos.
 
A Jeep Wrangler is not a heavy vehicle, 18 to 23 mpg is pretty abismal, yes it is a 4X4 but still. I had a 3.0ltr Vauxhall Frontera 25 to 30 mpg.

Not forgetting the US gallon is a lot smaller than an Imperial Gallon

3.8 litre-ish to the US gallon, 4.54 to the Imperial if I remember rightly so a spetic comparing fuel eccconomy to the UK isn't a direct comparison
 
My bet it that the Grenadier will end up being a very expensive bespoke vehicle. Production numbers will be small whatever The fixed costs of product development and building a dealer network will have to be spread across a relatively small number of vehicles.

JLR couldn’t make the numbers add up and they aren’t developing from start up. I’ll be amazed if anyone ever gets to buy an Ineos.

Not so sure, I kind of expect the base model Grenadier to come in at an almost reasonable price.
I suspect Ineos will make a serious part of its revenue on bling, I think its likely that a big part of the price will be generated from a hefty options list

I would imagine it will be perfectly feasible to drive on eout of the factory gate in a base model at a sensible price, but virtually nobody will do so.

I suspect that the grenadier may end up a re-invention of the Foers Ibex

1571108226758.png
 
Not so sure, I kind of expect the base model Grenadier to come in at an almost reasonable price.
I suspect Ineos will make a serious part of its revenue on bling, I think its likely that a big part of the price will be generated from a hefty options list

I would imagine it will be perfectly feasible to drive on eout of the factory gate in a base model at a sensible price, but virtually nobody will do so.

I suspect that the grenadier may end up a re-invention of the Foers Ibex

View attachment 422934
It costs roughly about a Billion these days to develop a new vehicle (even a small car or a truck) which can also be sold in developed markets...hope they have that kind of dough to spread around.
 
It costs roughly about a Billion these days to develop a new vehicle (even a small car or a truck) which can also be sold in developed markets...hope they have that kind of dough to spread around.

As it happens, they do-


Very wealthy company and owner, how much they are spending I don't know but they do have the resources.
From what I understand the Grenadier project is a "want to do" by a prosperous company.

John Bloor's Triumph would probably be the most interesting comparison for the Grenadier project
Triumph motorcycles now sell over 60,000 a year, mostly because John Bloor was told it was impossible to do
 
As it happens, they do-


Very wealthy company and owner, how much they are spending I don't know but they do have the resources.
From what I understand the Grenadier project is a "want to do" by a prosperous company.

John Bloor's Triumph would probably be the most interesting comparison for the Grenadier project
Triumph motorcycles now sell over 60,000 a year, mostly because John Bloor was told it was impossible to do
Well, I wish them all the luck. Not in a sarcastic way.
 
As it happens, they do-


Very wealthy company and owner, how much they are spending I don't know but they do have the resources.
From what I understand the Grenadier project is a "want to do" by a prosperous company.

John Bloor's Triumph would probably be the most interesting comparison for the Grenadier project
Triumph motorcycles now sell over 60,000 a year, mostly because John Bloor was told it was impossible to do
It’s interesting watching Jim Radcliffe our his head over the parapet after years of building a hugely successful privately owned company very much off the air. The first time I heard of him or his business was the Grangemouth strikes a few years ago.

Now they’ve taken over Team Sky and (from Landrover) Ben Ainslie Racing’s Americas Cup set up. And they’re starting car manufacture.

No doubt he has very deep pockets, but he’s no Elon Musk or Tesla. Manufacturing a 21st century car is a far cry from making motor bikes too.

If he can make small volumes cheaply, he’ll do something that no other manufacturer has managed.
 
See the link for an article from an Australian magazine. If you click on the first photo it will open up 100 pictures.

I saw a new 90 and it looks better in the flesh than in the pictures.

RP.
where did you see that just out of interest?
 

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