The New High Intensity Training by Darden

Discussion in 'Health and Fitness' started by gobbyidiot, Dec 6, 2008.

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  1. A kid I know bought this, so I read it in front of the telly in two hours - a hymn of praise to his mate Arthur Jones, and damn little in the way of exercise science given that the author has a PhD in it.

    I basically think high intensity/heavy duty training is about right - it fits what they know about muscle growth. I don't do much in the way of weights - couple of 8-9 set workouts to failure, no legs, a week - but the book made me think I'd go for the recommended high intensity workout.

    Basically, a few absolute efforts to negative failure for the whole body. I did a set of chins, set of curls, set of weighted push ups, set of nautilus tricep extension and a set of leg pressing and straight on to leg extensions.

    And..........a feckin bad ten minutes :lol: Aerobics afterwards was out of the question - my legs were jiggered and I felt shocking. I could have done something, but nowhere near the intensity I wanted.

    Pull ups to failure with a dumbell, drop the dumbell and keep going to failure again and then on a step to get up and eccentric failure repeatedly - that worked okay, but next time I'll either keep the dumbell on or re-attach it for the negatives. Even after you've failed concentrically, you can lower a lot.

    Dumbell curls to eccentric failure really work because you can swing them when you fail to get them up, but my grip started to go.

    Push ups with a plate on the back were ok, then dump it and keep going, and then eccentric failure, but I think next time I'll keep the plate on - eccentric failure with no weight takes too long.

    A Nautilus machine leg press is the kit for single leg extensions, and upping the weight and lifting the whole stack with both legs and then lowering on one worked well.

    Triceps is tricky - I think I'll try push downs and then use a step and straight arms after concentric failure to go negative.

    ....but going to absolute negative failure is a whole new ball game of misery. Positive failure nine times doesn't cause me the problems that negative failure does. People who do this regularly suffer.
     
  2. I know Ill regret asking , but whats negative failure then?
     
  3. Positive or concentric failure - you can't lift it.

    Negative or eccentric failure - you can't lower it in a controlled way.

    It's shocking how much you have left for lowering once you can't lift it, and how much you suffer getting that bit of strength out of you.
     
  4. Training the muscle to failure is not the best way to train a muscle, and ignoring the legs is a shocking idea!
     
  5. I keep forgetting that you're a female based on these statements.
     
  6. I just did a little interval session on the bike - legs sore as I walked up but I was fine once I started. The soreness was entirely caused by the negatives, pushing on the bike was no problem, in fact if anything I went better thanks to yesterday's enforced aerobics lay-off.

    I was thinking about "negative failure". Reality is the classic forced set very nearly involves negative failure - near the end you are struggling to lower it under control. The other thing that occured to me - how does your biceps (for example) experience something different from an eccentric movement, ie lowering a weight under control, and a failed attempt at an isometric movement ie holding the joint at a given angle, and finding the angle open up? I wonder if the old Bullworker was really not isometrics, just lots of disguised eccentric training.
     
  7. why would you not train your legs?
     
  8. If I train legs going ballistic on weights it really interferes with my ability to manage the CV stuff - I use the stepper and the bike a lot to save my achilles and joints, so ruined quads are a real problem.

    Having said that, Chris Hoy does both - my recovery from training is obviously pretty pish.
     
  9. You don't have to train like a machine mate, mix up using different set and rep ranges to suit to your goal, which i assume is strength.

    Does it ruin your ability to do CV stuff because they're sore?
    If so, theres ways you can limit your DOMS (delayed onset muscle soreness)

    Good nutrition post-workout can limit it massively, consuming the correct portions of protein and amino acids after you've trained will greatly reduce the DOMS you feel the day afterward.

    Have a look around for other ways to limit it mate, the quads are the one of the biggest muscles in your body, there's a ton of good reasons to train them, chief of which being that the more muscles you have, the greater your body's ability to burn fat!

    Lampard
     
  10. Flight

    Flight LE Book Reviewer

    Was thinking about trying the negatives to failure idea myself, seems theres quite a few proponents of HIT out there.

    Its going to hurt, I know that so... Has it worked for you? Is it worth the extra pain?
     
  11. I w ank alot....does that count?
     
  12. According to the book, yes if you do it infrequently but to the point of absolute exhaustion :D
     
  13. Too early to tell, but it's a lot more workable on some exercises than others. Dombell curls, for example, are easy to train to negative failure, just have a pair 10-15% heavier ready for when you fail. But chins to negative failure is a bit more of a nuisance - it's hard to get a step high enough to get you to the full "up" position unless you are using a bar which is basically too low to start with. With the highest step I can find I'm still starting negative chins from about 90 degrees, which isn't ideal.
     
  14. if you want an excellent all round work out try this http://bodyforlife.com/exercise/weighttraining.asp

    Ignore all the other gumph they have on the site they are just trying to sell you their supplements and other carp but the exercise progamme works well.